Final thoughts .....

[NYCPatsFan]

I wonder how much that double overtime took out of the ravens.

The ravens will come out with fire and high emotion, but their team may burn out if the pats can withstand it by the 4th quarter.

The game will be a brawl but this is the first time the patriots have the personnel to out physical the ravens.

Given the fact that it wasn't exactly a full double ot (more a one + nibble) and the fact that they have an extra day, I doubt if it'll drain them that much.

That said, I feel that they might go the way Jets went two seasons ago when they upset us @ home but were lackluster in the next one (the AFCC) against the Steelers.

 

[ausbacker]

The crowd hasn't been the same since the beer ban. Gronk was being taking out of the game when Aaron Hernandez got hurt. Calvin is a home run hitter, while gronk hits doubles.

I don't like comparing calving with gronk.

You're kidding me right? In 6 seasons Johnson has 54 regular season touchdowns. In 3 seasons Gronk has 38 regular season touchdowns.

You and I have very different definitions of a home run hitter.

 

[patfanken]

I hope you are right but this is like a division game so skill set etc goes out of the window. Our team has shown tendencies-few but have shown tendencies to be inconsistent . Not to mention our fast starts have somewhat been reduced -takes a few drives for us to get us going. Playing at home is huge and hopefully the crowd is loud tomorrow but they dont inspire same supreme confidence at least like our 2003/2004 teams did in the playoffs .Maybe its because the pressure was less than it is now who knows.

I hope so too, SVN. But I would propose that this division metaphor is over played. Are you aware that only 5 starters remain from that 2009 playoff game. This is a new team. One of the youngest in the NFL. Its best years are yet to come. That was my point in the OP.

These last 2 years have been great, the superbowls have been great, but the reality is, that this current version of the Pats have accomplished this unlikely task, despite the fact that they haven't even reached their peak yet. That's going to happen over the next 2 years. In other words what we are seeing now is just the BEGINNING of this run. In comparative terms with the last run, NEXT year is 2003

 

[NYCPatsFan]

Ken,

Not sure if you saw the Bruchi wrap-up with Reiss on ESPN's website. Splendid insights.

NFL Playoffs: Tedy Bruschi's Breakdown of New England Patriots-Baltimore Ravens playoff game - ESPN Boston

The following caught my eye and I wanted to know your thoughts on it since you feel so strong about us winning easily tomorrow (don't get me wrong, I would love to see that happen and so plan to buy you a beer if it does. )

------------------------
Tedy: ...Remember, Pees was a former Patriots defensive coordinator, and his knowledge of the New England offense helps.

Mike: Would you take the same type of approach if you were Pees?

Tedy: I think the first thing I'd say to my defensive front is that there will be times when they'll have only six men in the box to stop the run because we have to worry about this passing game. I'd put some more emphasis on that with the linemen and linebackers. Then I'd concentrate on taking away that inside passing game, which is similar to what others have tried to do with rerouting slot receivers and receiving tight ends. I'd arm my linebackers and slot defenders with various calls -- also using defensive ends at times -- to disrupt the passing game inside and between the numbers. Make them beat me outside. I'd also be concerned with running backs offset in the passing game. We saw Patriots running backs have success in the passing game Sunday against the Texans, exploiting one-on-one matchups against linebackers. There was also a checkdown to Stevan Ridley. The Ravens' defense was hurt by this against the Broncos, with Dannell Ellerbe matched up outside on Knowshon Moreno and Moreno catching a touchdown pass.

--------------------

Thanks,

 

[coolguy]

You're kidding me right? In 6 seasons Johnson has 54 regular season touchdowns. In 3 seasons Gronk has 38 regular season touchdowns.

You and I have very different definitions of a home run hitter.

Gronk is covered by linebackers and mostly single coverage
calvin is double and triple teamed BY CORNERS AND SAFETIES every game.

Welker and Hernandez open up coverage for gronk.........calvin doesn't have that.

A home run hitter in football is someone who can score any time they have the ball.

 

[ausbacker]

Gronk is covered by linebackers and mostly single coverage
calvin is double and triple teamed BY CORNERS AND SAFETIES every game.

Welker and Hernandez open up coverage for gronk.........calvin doesn't have that.

A home run hitter in football is someone who can score any time they have the ball.

At this point, you're just embarrassing yourself. Gronk has put up better stats than Johnson through his first three seasons and you're concerned with scoring when someone has the ball.

Gronk scores when he has the ball. You cannot refute that.

 

[coolguy]

I hope so too, SVN. But I would propose that this division metaphor is over played. Are you aware that only 5 starters remain from that 2009 playoff game. This is a new team. One of the youngest in the NFL. Its best years are yet to come. That was my point in the OP.

These last 2 years have been great, the superbowls have been great, but the reality is, that this current version of the Pats have accomplished this unlikely task, despite the fact that they haven't even reached their peak yet. That's going to happen over the next 2 years. In other words what we are seeing now is just the BEGINNING of this run. In comparative terms with the last run, NEXT year is 2003

On top of that, every team that gave the patriots trouble has now entered the rebuilding stage or have very old defenses.
Steelers are old
ravens are old
colts are rebuilding
and the broncos are old.

Bill has outsmarted everyone.

 

[coolguy]

At this point, you're just embarrassing yourself. Gronk has put up better stats than Johnson through his first three seasons and you're concerned with scoring when someone has the ball.

Gronk scores when he has the ball. You cannot refute that.

Can gronk score from the patriots 30? Calvin johnson is unstoppable despite not have any good receivers around him. It's only in the redzone where his qb can't get him the ball.

Gronk is a great player(best tight end i've ever seen), but he's not to the level of prime randy moss or calvin Johnson.

Gronk and calvin are both beast in their right.

 

[ausbacker]

Can gronk score from the patriots 30? Calvin johnson is unstoppable despite not have any good receivers around him. It's only in the redzone where his qb can't get him the ball.

Gronk is a great player(best tight end i've ever seen), but he's not to the level of prime randy moss or calvin Johnson.

Given Gronk's longest career TD is 52 yards you'd probably suggest not. In reality, why does that matter if he's scoring touchdowns? Yards don't win you games.

Furthermore, I find it amusing that you'd use Megatron being double or triple covered where he has a serious height and weight advantage over the defenders then go on to suggest that Gronk is single covered (when we all know Safeties lurk near his general presence) and he beats guys roughly the same size as him.

The problem you have is you think Johnson is better than Gronk where I think both Gronk and Johnson are similar in their ability to beat single and double coverage.

At this point in the conversation, your argument simply doesn't stack up when you consider numbers and the original point.

 

[coolguy]

Given Gronk's longest career TD is 52 yards you'd probably suggest not. In reality, why does that matter if he's scoring touchdowns? Yards don't win you games.

Furthermore, I find it amusing that you'd use Megatron being double or triple covered where he has a serious height and weight advantage over the defenders then go on to suggest that Gronk is single covered (when we all know Safeties lurk near his general presence) and he beats guys roughly the same size as him.

The problem you have is you think Johnson is better than Gronk where I think both Gronk and Johnson are similar in their ability to beat single and double coverage.

At this point in the conversation, your argument simply doesn't stack up when you consider numbers and the original point.

No, i don't think calvin is better than gronk. i just think his speed is better than gronk's overall skill set.

Just look at what the patriots did with randy moss to see where i'm coming from.

Vereen is the fastest receiver on the patriots.....damn, he may even be the fastest player on the whole team.

 

[ausbacker]

No, i don't think calvin is better than gronk. i just think his speed is better than gronk's overall skill set.

Just look at what the patriots did with randy moss to see where i'm coming from.

Vereen is the fastest receiver on the patriots.....damn, he may even be the fastest player on the whole team.

We're looking at this from a fundamentally different position coolguy.

 

[coolguy]

We're looking at this from a fundamentally different position coolguy.

If josh McDaniels is the offensive mastermind he thinks he is, we will see vereen take over the game now that gronk's gone..

 

[ausbacker]

If josh McDaniels is the offensive mastermind he thinks he is, we will see vereen take over the game now that gronk's gone..

Alternatively the Patriots will use their next man up philosophy that has served them so well over the years. It's up to Tom Brady to diagnose the mismatches from there.

I've been of the opinion for some time that I'd like to see a formation that has Vereen and Ridley on the field at the same time.

 

[coolguy]

I've been of the opinion for some time that I'd like to see a formation that has Vereen and Ridley on the field at the same time.

I was just about to post this. The patriots have the chance to do what the chargers didn't have the balls to do with darren sproles and ladainian tomlinson.

Vereen has finally earned earned brady's trust.

 

[SVN]

If woodhead is healthy go I will be surprised vereen is in the game a lot unless pats go pass heavy and reduce ridley's carries. Pass protection is prime in this game and woodhead is better than the other 2 in this.

 

[TruthSeeker]

Have you watch seen in college?

Vereen catching ability, running style and 4.5 speed is a mismatch for all teams.

Exactly. That's why he's our 4th/5th string running back.

 

[TruthSeeker]

I love your optimism Ken, but I really doubt the Patriots will get a double-digit lead tomorrow. Of all the teams in the league, it seems that the Ravens play the Pats the toughest. Every time they meet it's a nailbiter (except when the Ravens curbstomped us in 2009).

Can't underestimate the Ravens. I think this one will be close all the way til the end. Just hope the Pats catch enough breaks to win it.

You're right; the Ravens always play us close. But I agree with Ken; I don't think it will happen tonight.

 

[patfanken]

Ken,

Not sure if you saw the Bruchi wrap-up with Reiss on ESPN's website. Splendid insights.

NFL Playoffs: Tedy Bruschi's Breakdown of New England Patriots-Baltimore Ravens playoff game - ESPN Boston

The following caught my eye and I wanted to know your thoughts on it since you feel so strong about us winning easily tomorrow (don't get me wrong, I would love to see that happen and so plan to buy you a beer if it does. )

------------------------
Tedy: ...Remember, Pees was a former Patriots defensive coordinator, and his knowledge of the New England offense helps.

Mike: Would you take the same type of approach if you were Pees?

Tedy: I think the first thing I'd say to my defensive front is that there will be times when they'll have only six men in the box to stop the run because we have to worry about this passing game. I'd put some more emphasis on that with the linemen and linebackers. Then I'd concentrate on taking away that inside passing game, which is similar to what others have tried to do with rerouting slot receivers and receiving tight ends. I'd arm my linebackers and slot defenders with various calls -- also using defensive ends at times -- to disrupt the passing game inside and between the numbers. Make them beat me outside. I'd also be concerned with running backs offset in the passing game. We saw Patriots running backs have success in the passing game Sunday against the Texans, exploiting one-on-one matchups against linebackers. There was also a checkdown to Stevan Ridley. The Ravens' defense was hurt by this against the Broncos, with Dannell Ellerbe matched up outside on Knowshon Moreno and Moreno catching a touchdown pass.

--------------------

Thanks,

I'm not sure exactly what you want me to say here. NOTHING that Bruschi says here is inaccurate or doesn't make sense. What he has suggested is merely the "blueprint" common sense method of trying to slow down the Pats offense. So here is my rebuttal, for what its worth.l

Don't you think that pretty much every team hasn't tried to do what Brushi suggested all ready. If it were as easy as Bruschi says, how come they averaged 35 ppg on 5 of the top 8 defenses in the league over 7 games. Some of those defenses had better personnel than the Ravens.

Do you really think that several teams this year haven't tried to take Welker out of the game with double teams, physical play, and man to man coverage with help? This is especially true since for most of the season the Pats haven't had the luxury of having both their TE's on the field at the same time. Then how come Welker wound up with his 120 catches and 1300 yds

Everyone who is good enough to coach in the NFL is a great coach. They aren't stupid. They know what to do. They can match all their X's with our O's. But the problem is that it is REALLY hard to execute that great game plan given our system and the talent of the players who run it.

Really, at this point, the only one who can really consistently stop this offense are the Pats themselves with turnovers, penalties, drops, and poor execution. I think back to Jets loss. How much was that due to Rex's Brilliance and how much was due to Brady's impatience, turnovers and him trying to force balls to receivers when he had open guys elsewhere. Since then Brady has pretty much figured out how to deal with that style, and has put up 30 plus on the Jets virtually every time he plays them.

Bottom Line, NYC, what Tedy said isn't wrong, its just a lot harder to do, than to say it. Better defenses than the Ravens have tried and failed.

 

[Joker]

all I have to say is...FKUC THE JETS...

 

[SVN]

I'm not sure exactly what you want me to say here. NOTHING that Bruschi says here is inaccurate or doesn't make sense. What he has suggested is merely the "blueprint" common sense method of trying to slow down the Pats offense. So here is my rebuttal, for what its worth.l

Don't you think that pretty much every team hasn't tried to do what Brushi suggested all ready. If it were as easy as Bruschi says, how come they averaged 35 ppg on 5 of the top 8 defenses in the league over 7 games. Some of those defenses had better personnel than the Ravens.

Do you really think that several teams this year haven't tried to take Welker out of the game with double teams, physical play, and man to man coverage with help? This is especially true since for most of the season the Pats haven't had the luxury of having both their TE's on the field at the same time. Then how come Welker wound up with his 120 catches and 1300 yds

Everyone who is good enough to coach in the NFL is a great coach. They aren't stupid. They know what to do. They can match all their X's with our O's. But the problem is that it is REALLY hard to execute that great game plan given our system and the talent of the players who run it.

Really, at this point, the only one who can really consistently stop this offense are the Pats themselves with turnovers, penalties, drops, and poor execution. I think back to Jets loss. How much was that due to Rex's Brilliance and how much was due to Brady's impatience, turnovers and him trying to force balls to receivers when he had open guys elsewhere. Since then Brady has pretty much figured out how to deal with that style, and has put up 30 plus on the Jets virtually every time he plays them.

Bottom Line, NYC, what Tedy said isn't wrong, its just a lot harder to do, than to say it. Better defenses than the Ravens have tried and failed.

Would say more than the talent of the players, the experience of the players to execute such a defense is important like pats defense of 2000s. I would put the ravens D somewhat in that category. They may not be as talented as the texans right now but they are much smarter unlike the one trick pony texans. Not much out there they havent seen and they can play a savvy style of defense and manage the game.