Dennard arrested for DUI

[dreamsfloatjoe]

...immediately running and filing charges for a court hearing 3 weeks after his violation. To me that speaks volumes about the potential of the case that they have... it isn't necessarily looking too good at the moment based on the immediate filing of the violation charges...

More will be revealed at the court hearing? Hope Dennard can stay out of trouble until then.
Pouncey twins are going to need new hats?

 

[supafly]

More will be revealed at the court hearing? Hope Dennard can stay out of trouble until then.
Pouncey twins are going to need new hats?

That about sums it up, my friend.

It's certainly possible that one in a position of a higher, public profile will be treated a little differently; so let's hope that is more along the lines of reasoning for having the violation hearing now as opposed to after the process has played out.

I'm hoping that maybe they are just trying to set an example of this, but in a more "minor" punishment format like the original sentence of 30 days was. In the earlier instance, the prosecution was still able to be "fair" while still coming down pretty hard in their decision to not accept a plea etc.

They can address the violation in a proper manner without going overboard, although that may involve revoking the probation and making Dennard do his jail time now as opposed to after the season. If that's the case then life will go on, and hopefully we'll have his services for the majority of the season still.

 

[JMC00]

So if his probation didn't prevent him from drinking they are gonna try to revoke his probation on the grounds of him "refusing" the breathalyzer. Which i'm assuming his attorney will request that any ruling be held of on probation as they are contesting the DUI charge and the breathalyzer refusal is a big part of the case. He'll probably argue that if he is violated before the case even starts that it could taint the due process in the case. Also that fact that if he is found to have violated his probation but is found Not Guilty in the case then the violation was wrong.

Going with my initial feeling I find it somewhat difficult that a judge is going to make a ruling before the DUI case is adjudicated.

I also fully expect if he is ruled to have violated his probation that there will be an appeal filed by the next day that would probably put a Stay of Execution on whatever the ruling is.

 

[Joker]

They use what is called 32-F in R.I. to sentence violators before they are adjudicated on the new charge...have no idea what they do in Nebraska

 

[MassPats38]

So if his probation didn't prevent him from drinking they are gonna try to revoke his probation on the grounds of him "refusing" the breathalyzer. Which i'm assuming his attorney will request that any ruling be held of on probation as they are contesting the DUI charge and the breathalyzer refusal is a big part of the case. He'll probably argue that if he is violated before the case even starts that it could taint the due process in the case. Also that fact that if he is found to have violated his probation but is found Not Guilty in the case then the violation was wrong.

It depends on the conditions of probation imposed. If the condition is that he not violate state or federal law, then he has already violated that condition in refusing the test (under Nebraska law, refusal is a separate violation). If the condition requires a misdemeanor or felony, then Nebraska can wait for the DWI proceeding to play out or try it in a probation violation proceeding (Dennard would then have to decide if he would actively fight the issue of the DWI under a lesser standard of proof if the court didn't want to wait).

 

[supafly]

Also that fact that if he is found to have violated his probation but is found Not Guilty in the case then the violation was wrong.

Going with my initial feeling I find it somewhat difficult that a judge is going to make a ruling before the DUI case is adjudicated.

You may be right, JMC00.

The judge may also decide that he isn't going to add any more punishment on to the new case (DUI) until the process is played out, BUT...that he also isn't going to allow the "special provision" that the defense requested aka doing the 30 days when the season is over. This way, it wouldn't matter whether or not he was guilty of the DUI, so no injustice would occur should he beat the charge seeing as how he was scheduled to do the 30 day sentence already.

If that is the case, it still won't be all "that" bad. Dennard will have to do his 30 days now instead of at the end of the season, and my guess is that we'd be looking at approx. 75% of the 30 day sentence, which would be about 22-23 days in total.

That would still likely have him out in time for the last couple of preseason games, then the DUI charge could potentially be pushed back at least past this upcoming year until after the season is over.

Hell, look at Marshawn Lynch. He's still waiting almost 2 yrs after his DUI due to his attys pushing it back, so his hearing won't even occur until 12/27 at the end of this season.

It depends on the conditions of probation imposed. If the condition is that he not violate state or federal law, then he has already violated that condition in refusing the test (under Nebraska law, refusal is a separate violation). If the condition requires a misdemeanor or felony, then Nebraska can wait for the DWI proceeding to play out or try it in a probation violation proceeding (Dennard would then have to decide if he would actively fight the issue of the DWI under a lesser standard of proof if the court didn't want to wait).

Great answer, MP38.

My guess would be that it likely would entail a misdemeanor or felony, but that's just a guess of course.

Like I said in another post, it may/may not be a hint towards how solid the new case is based on the immediate filing of the VOP hearing since the P.O (or the supervisor) and/or the judge will usually take a peek at the new charges and see how solid the case is prior to deciding to violate him immediately.

It also could just be that:

1. The higher profile image of the defendant is forcing them to consider and decide to proceed immediately without allowing the process to play out

OR

2. They simply seriously don't care for him too much out in Lincoln, Nebraska due to the past charges and feel that he needs some more "motivation" to walk a straighter path

Of course it could also mean that the judge is ready to totally revoke the probation and come down on him harder too. We'll know soon enough, but if I had to bet I'd think that the punishment isn't going to be too much harsher myself. That's just based on this being the 1st offense of a violation that is somewhat minor/moderate in nature, which has not even been resolved or convicted in a court of law yet.

 

[tuckeverlasting]

Is it possible to acquire an on-line law degree from following the Hernandez/Dennard threads on PatsFans.com?

you can get an on line associates degree in physics and lawyerin' at patsfans.com. thanks ahern and fonzie.

 

[zydecochris]

The University of Phoenix has got to be quaking in their boots at the prospect of this new degree competition from PatsFan.com.

you can get an on line associates degree in physics and lawyerin' at patsfans.com. thanks ahern and fonzie.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

You may be right, JMC00.

The judge may also decide that he isn't going to add any more punishment on to the new case (DUI) until the process is played out, BUT...that he also isn't going to allow the "special provision" that the defense requested aka doing the 30 days when the season is over. This way, it wouldn't matter whether or not he was guilty of the DUI, so no injustice would occur should he beat the charge seeing as how he was scheduled to do the 30 day sentence already.

If that is the case, it still won't be all "that" bad. Dennard will have to do his 30 days now instead of at the end of the season, and my guess is that we'd be looking at approx. 75% of the 30 day sentence, which would be about 22-23 days in total.

That would still likely have him out in time for the last couple of preseason games, then the DUI charge could potentially be pushed back at least past this upcoming year until after the season is over.

Hell, look at Marshawn Lynch. He's still waiting almost 2 yrs after his DUI due to his attys pushing it back, so his hearing won't even occur until 12/27 at the end of this season.



Great answer, MP38.

My guess would be that it likely would entail a misdemeanor or felony, but that's just a guess of course.

Like I said in another post, it may/may not be a hint towards how solid the new case is based on the immediate filing of the VOP hearing since the P.O (or the supervisor) and/or the judge will usually take a peek at the new charges and see how solid the case is prior to deciding to violate him immediately.

It also could just be that:

1. The higher profile image of the defendant is forcing them to consider and decide to proceed immediately without allowing the process to play out

OR

2. They simply seriously don't care for him too much out in Lincoln, Nebraska due to the past charges and feel that he needs some more "motivation" to walk a straighter path

Of course it could also mean that the judge is ready to totally revoke the probation and come down on him harder too. We'll know soon enough, but if I had to bet I'd think that the punishment isn't going to be too much harsher myself. That's just based on this being the 1st offense of a violation that is somewhat minor/moderate in nature, which has not even been resolved or convicted in a court of law yet.

Were I Dennard, I would SO be on the phone contacting Lindsay Lohan's lawyers stat!

 

[Rob0729]

We know certain facts, and are speculating on others, but one thing's for sure--Dennard is behind the eight ball in this case. That is for certain. Violating probation is a very bad thing, especially when there is jail time that has already been sentenced, and the judge has allowed you special provisions as it is.

Like I said before, most of the time the judge/prosecutor/supervisor of probation allows the legal process to play out prior to filing VOP (violation) charges against any defendant. They do a bit of a background search on the "new" case against the probationer and find out just how strong the evidence is prior to filing formal violation charges.

If the case was 1/2 as shoddy as some are making it they'd likely have allowed Dennard the luxury of being proven innocent/guilty first instead of immediately running and filing charges for a court hearing 3 weeks after his violation. To me that speaks volumes about the potential of the case that they have, but again--we're just bouncing ideas off of each other.

We may get lucky and find the judge to be in a good mood and simply throw in some additional smaller punsihment(s) or stipulations for Dennard, but it isn't necessarily looking too good at the moment based on the immediate filing of the violation charges (IMO).

You may feel differently of course. We can only hope that it all works out.

I disagree. Dennard may be perfectly fine. We don't know what the judge will decide. The judge has plenty of latitude of what he/she can do. The judge could do anything from nothing to make Dennard check in with his probation officer more to ban him from drinking alcohol to mandatory alcohol counseling to more jail time. My guess is the judge will not give significant jail time.

People violate probation all the time and with more serious offenses than this. I tend to doubt Dennard is facing a harsh punishment unless the cops testify in the hearing that Dennard could barely walk or he was all over the road or something to that effect.

There are people who violate their probation with violent crimes and sometimes still get nothing more than a slap on the wrist.

I am betting that Dennard will end up getting mandatory alcohol counseling and have no alcohol added to the terms of his probation. But I am no expert on the matter. But to assume he is going to get locked up for a significant amount of time is way too premature.

And as to bringing this to a hearing, this is a very high profile case. They are going to do everyhting possible to look like they are going to be tough on Dennard and not let him skate.

 

[Rob0729]

Were I Dennard, I would SO be on the phone contacting Lindsay Lohan's lawyers stat!

Lidnsay Lohan is a perfect example of why I think Dennard will get a slap on the wrist with his probation hearing. Lohan violated her probation time after time with a slap on the wrist each time.

I know it is a different state and case, but that is what happen in these probation violation hearings. Unless it is a significant or repeated violation, the punishment is just a slap on the wrist. In the eyes of the court, suspicion of DUI is not a major offense.

 

[Danger Zone]

So does anyone know some of the details of how Dennard ended up hitting a cop?

I know that after looking into the Talib shooting arrest I actually ended up liking him more (the guy Talib shot at was a convicted child-molester and dating Talibs sister. During the incident Talibs mother was going after this guy with the same ferocity that Talib was.. so the math was pretty easy for me).

I heard the cop was in street clothes and hadnt announced himself to be a police officer.. but Dennard was convicted.

Anyone have more?

 

[supafly]

You may be right, JMC00.

The judge may also decide that he isn't going to add any more punishment on to the new case (DUI) until the process is played out, BUT...that he also isn't going to allow the "special provision" that the defense requested aka doing the 30 days when the season is over. This way, it wouldn't matter whether or not he was guilty of the DUI, so no injustice would occur should he beat the charge seeing as how he was scheduled to do the 30 day sentence already.

If that is the case, it still won't be all "that" bad. Dennard will have to do his 30 days now instead of at the end of the season, and my guess is that we'd be looking at approx. 75% of the 30 day sentence, which would be about 22-23 days in total.



Like I said in another post, it may/may not be a hint towards how solid the new case is based on the immediate filing of the VOP hearing since the P.O (or the supervisor) and/or the judge will usually take a peek at the new charges and see how solid the case is prior to deciding to violate him immediately.

It also could just be that:

1. The higher profile image of the defendant is forcing them to consider and decide to proceed immediately without allowing the process to play out

OR

2. They simply seriously don't care for him too much out in Lincoln, Nebraska due to the past charges and feel that he needs some more "motivation" to walk a straighter path

Of course it could also mean that the judge is ready to totally revoke the probation and come down on him harder too. We'll know soon enough, but if I had to bet I'd think that the punishment isn't going to be too much harsher myself. That's just based on this being the 1st offense of a violation that is somewhat minor/moderate in nature, which has not even been resolved or convicted in a court of law yet.

People violate probation all the time and with more serious offenses than this. I tend to doubt Dennard is facing a harsh punishment unless the cops testify in the hearing that Dennard could barely walk or he was all over the road or something to that effect.

There are people who violate their probation with violent crimes and sometimes still get nothing more than a slap on the wrist.

I am betting that Dennard will end up getting mandatory alcohol counseling and have no alcohol added to the terms of his probation. But I am no expert on the matter. But to assume he is going to get locked up for a significant amount of time is way too premature.

I don't remember stating that he'd have a significant punishment in ANY post on the subject, Rob.

The underlined example above is exactly how I feel--and nowhere did I state that the punsihment would be significant, so I tend to agree with you fully. There is certainly the possibility that things could be harsher of course, as you stated--but I'd have to think that it will be dealt with in a fair manner just as the first charge was.

What I stated was that it may be a hint towards the validity of the new charges of DUI seeing as how the judge's tipstaff (and/or P.O.) will often take a peek at the evidence of the new charges prior to filing a violation before it's played out in a court of law due to the fact that most VOP's aren't filed until AFTER the process has played itself out.

 

[supafly]

So does anyone know some of the details of how Dennard ended up hitting a cop?

I heard the cop was in street clothes and hadnt announced himself to be a police officer.. but Dennard was convicted.

Anyone have more?

That isn't even close to the truth, DZ.

It was a rumor (probably started here) that it was a plain clothes officer, nothing more. It seems as though certain people are always very one-sided when it comes to their Patriot players being in trouble or accused of something, so they immediately try to make themselves feel better by minimizing the truth. We saw it in the Hernandez situation and now we're seeing it in the Dennard situation too, along with the original Dennard situation, which is what your question is about.

Edelman was a different breed entirely in my opinion, since it was a very wide open charge that often has a lot of grey area and is known to be false many times; but that is very different from punching a cop, being charged with killing someone, or having 2 officers state that you were drunk at 2am, swaying towards the center line, failing the sobriety test, and that you couldn't somehow muster up enough breath to properly blow into a simple machine when you're a paid NFL athlete.

The cop that Dennard punched was not in plain clothes at the time, and he certainly identified himself according to the court testimony, the interviews given, and the prosecutor's statements.

 

[supafly]

Lidnsay Lohan is a perfect example of why I think Dennard will get a slap on the wrist with his probation hearing. Lohan violated her probation time after time with a slap on the wrist each time.

I know it is a different state and case, but that is what happen in these probation violation hearings. Unless it is a significant or repeated violation, the punishment is just a slap on the wrist. In the eyes of the court, suspicion of DUI is not a major offense.

I hear what you're saying that in many times a VOP can be a somewhat minor offense, but the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle too. You also have to look at the seriousness of the original conviction, and the fact that they already gave him a special provision to spend his jail time at his convenience. Last I checked most judges don't give you the option of "when" you prefer to go to jail, so that may be the first thing taken away.

As far as a new harsh punishment, we're in total agreement there. It shouldn't be too bad in my opinion, and I do expect Dennard to play out the majority of the season at the very least; but I also think that you're somewhat underestimating the seriousness of a VOP too.

In most states you cannot even make bond on a VOP charge if it's filed prior to the process being completed, and you simply sit there until either your new charges are figured out in court which can take 4-6 months, or until the maximum is served on the original charge (not that I'm suggesting that's what Dennard is looking at).

If the violation occurs AFTER the new charge process is played out (which is what you are referring to), then in most situations a first offense violation is not considered to be very serious. However, things are somewhat different in this scenario due to the judge and P.O. deciding that they are going to have a hearing prior to that happening.

Either way, I don't think we need to worry too much as Patsfans, but you really don't want to violate your judge's probation. There are many who do not take too kindly to that, and they can make your life very difficult.

 

[Danger Zone]

That isn't even close to the truth, DZ.

It was a rumor (probably started here) that it was a plain clothes officer, nothing more. It seems as though certain people are always very one-sided when it comes to their Patriot players being in trouble or accused of something, so they immediately try to make themselves feel better by minimizing the truth. We saw it in the Hernandez situation and now we're seeing it in the Dennard situation too, along with the original Dennard situation, which is what your question is about.

Edelman was a different breed entirely in my opinion, since it was a very wide open charge that often has a lot of grey area and is known to be false many times; but that is very different from punching a cop, being charged with killing someone, or having 2 officers state that you were drunk at 2am, swaying towards the center line, failing the sobriety test, and that you couldn't somehow muster up enough breath to properly blow into a simple machine when you're a paid NFL athlete.

The cop that Dennard punched was not in plain clothes at the time, and he certainly identified himself according to the court testimony, the interviews given, and the prosecutor's statements.

That is good to know. I'll stop helping to perpetuate that rumor then (though I have only done so to my RL friends I believe).

I was wondering how these two things could be true AND he could still be convicted of a felony assault (though not so surprising I suppose, Ive seen the Shield and Training Day

 

[supafly]

That is good to know. I'll stop perpetuating that rumor then.

I was wondering how these two things could be true AND he could still be convicted of a felony assault.

I definitely wondered the same thing too in the very beginning.

I'm not sure if that certain group of officers were supposed to be in charge of the specific block or two where the bar scene was, or if they were assigned just for that one nightclub, but they were in uniform and on bicycles--if I recall correctly about the bicycles.

Even Dennard didn't try and dispute that, although he did state that he swung or flailed his arms in a manner that eqauted to being a natural reaction due to him not entirely being sure of what was going on in the beginning--so I think his main defense was that it occurred accidentally, and that the blow wasn't nearly as bad as they were making it out to be.

 

[zydecochris]

Thanks for the clarification Supa, when he was drafted I also read the stories about "plain clothes officer who did not identify himself". I had not heard the follow-up.

So, he slugged a uniformed officer during a (presumably) drunken brawl and then followed up with a DUI arrest while on probation?

I like the guy, and loved his "no fear" approach to playing last year. I hope he is on the team this year. He has an attitude that is needed for the defense in my view.

I know that some are making comparison to the Lindsey Lohan slaps on the wrist (which I still can't believe), but I'm not sure if I will believe that it will be "strictly business" as opposed to personal (to quote the Godfather) for the Nebraska justice system. He slugged one of their own, and then (at the least) showed very poor judgement in putting himself a vulnerable position.

I have to admit that if I was the judge, I would be thinking "This young man needs a bit of a wake-up call". I wouldn't be too surprised if he gets it.

That isn't even close to the truth, DZ.

It was a rumor (probably started here) that it was a plain clothes officer, nothing more. It seems as though certain people are always very one-sided when it comes to their Patriot players being in trouble or accused of something, so they immediately try to make themselves feel better by minimizing the truth. We saw it in the Hernandez situation and now we're seeing it in the Dennard situation too, along with the original Dennard situation, which is what your question is about.

Edelman was a different breed entirely in my opinion, since it was a very wide open charge that often has a lot of grey area and is known to be false many times; but that is very different from punching a cop, being charged with killing someone, or having 2 officers state that you were drunk at 2am, swaying towards the center line, failing the sobriety test, and that you couldn't somehow muster up enough breath to properly blow into a simple machine when you're a paid NFL athlete.

The cop that Dennard punched was not in plain clothes at the time, and he certainly identified himself according to the court testimony, the interviews given, and the prosecutor's statements.

 

[supafly]

Thanks for the clarification Supa, when he was drafted I also read the stories about "plain clothes officer who did not identify himself". I had not heard the follow-up.

So, he slugged a uniformed officer during a (presumably) drunken brawl and then followed up with a DUI arrest while on probation?

I like the guy, and loved his "no fear" approach to playing last year. I hope he is on the team this year. He has an attitude that is needed for the defense in my view.

I know that some are making comparison to the Lindsey Lohan slaps on the wrist (which I still can't believe), but I'm not sure if I will believe that it will be "strictly business" as opposed to personal (to quote the Godfather) for the Nebraska justice system. He slugged one of their own, and then (at the least) showed very poor judgement in putting himself a vulnerable position.

I have to admit that if I was the judge, I would be thinking "This young man needs a bit of a wake-up call". I wouldn't be too surprised if he gets it.

Well, the fact that the prosecutor has asked the judge to entirely revoke the probation itself doesn't necessarily come across as "good news" to me personally.

They took a hard-nosed approach to him during the original charge in the spring, as they wouldn't even accept a plea bargain from Dennard. They definitely wanted him to serve some form of jail time, and the prosecution expressed these thoughts in a very matter of fact sort of way.

Now they are asking the judge to fully revoke the probation entirely, so while some who would state that "this isn't too serious" may be right--but the prosecutor is also wishing to make an example out of Dennard as has been since the inception of the original case, so the truth likely lies in the middle somewhere.

It should also be noted that this was a Sergeant who dealt with Dennard last week, so he is obviously very experienced, and will be well-respected. His testimony that he "emitted a strong odor of alcohol," and that he refused the breathalyzer will definitely go a long way. The fact that he was driving down Normal Blvd at 2am right down the heart of the local watering holes doesn't exactly scream "intelligence" to me either.

While Dennard's situation isn't "that" serious on a grand scale of things, this also has the potential to be a lot more serious than some seem to think.

Prosecutor asks judge to revoke Dennard's probation : Journal Star Breaking News

 

[supafly]

What's even crazier is that the original judge, Stephanie Stacy claimed that she would "consider" the defense's request 11 months from the April court date to totally suspend the 30 day sentence, if Dennard remained out of trouble.

In other words, it appears as though he really never even would have ended up going to jail in March 2014 for the 30 day sentence had he just avoided getting arrested again.

There are some more details about the original charge and what happened in this story. Supposedly the officer told Dennard to leave the bar and while he was walking away the officer witnessed him punching another man. When the officer pulled his handcuffs out and told Dennard that he was under arrest, Dennard supposedly punched him in the face (according to the officer).

Alfonzo Dennard of New England Patriots gets 30 days in jail in 2014 - ESPN Boston