Defensive Backfield

[mgteich]

CORNER (5-6)
If the Jones boys look good coming out of camp, I'm not sure that we need 6 corners, unless neither is capable of being a backup nickel back. In that case Coleman and Killings was fight for that backup roster spot. IMHO, both Jones boys are locks, J Jones at special teams at least.

As a reminder of past discussions, I think most of us expect Butler to start, and play inside when Rowe comes in.

SAFETY (5-6)
We have the three top safeties and two top special teamers. If two of the safeties were injured, would we really want Richards getting serious time? I would think that we'd move a corner to play safety. With one injury, a safety wouldn't be used in nickel and dime situations.

SOOOO, is the 6th safety position necessary? I would think that it is NOT unless there is a better option than Richards.

BOTTOM LINE
I expect to see 11 defensive backs on the 53, with 2-3 developmental players on the PS.

 

[50-yard-line]

Jesus, this board is so down on Richards.

Harmon, Ryan, Cannon, and a whole bunch of others really didn't show much in their first couple of years, either, you know?

 

[mgteich]

Jesus, this board is so down on Richards.

Harmon, Ryan, Cannon, and a whole bunch of others really didn't show much in their first couple of years, either, you know?

As is usually the case, a player should be expected to show something by the pre-season of his 3rd season. Otherwise, he should be eligible to be replaced. Occasionally, there are injury reasons to explain a player's showing absolutely nothing.

I don't see why Richards should be given a pass. If he isn't good enough to be a backup SS, he should be replaced.

And, just BTW, I disagree with all 3 of your examples. ALL contributed as backups in their first couple of years.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Not sure how you pass on us with these guys back there. Lets just hope they stay healthy

 

[Dragda]

We might not even have a player yet that will be on the final 53 in September. In fact, I give it even odds that is the case. We are deep, but there are players that are upgradable.

 

[mgteich]

We might not even have a player yet that will be on the final 53 in September. In fact, I give it even odds that is the case. We are deep, but there are players that are upgradable.

If you are saying that players not now on the 90 will make the 53, that is almost undoubtedly true. This is most likely in the interior of the offensive line.

 

[Dexter]

Yeah, like every year, there will surprising cuts and trades (BB is always hunting) but still fun to talk about all those roster projections. We gotta fill the time till the training camp somehow.

 

[DarrylS]

Where does soon to be signed Jason McCourty fit??

 

[luuked]

Jesus, this board is so down on Richards.

Harmon, Ryan, Cannon, and a whole bunch of others really didn't show much in their first couple of years, either, you know?

Cannon played pretty well in 2013 when Vollmer went down. His decline "coincided" with Scar retiring/Googe taking over. Harmon was a solid #2 safety at the middle/towards the end of his rookie year. Really don't think you chose the right examples.

Richards is on the bubble. All it needs is one UDFA showing a bit more in camp and he might be gone.

 

[ausbacker]

Early days but I have an uneasy confidence regarding not only this unit, but the entire damn team. On paper, it looks so freakin' good. I'm really looking forward to seeing what the staff does with all this talent.

 

[stelfans]

I wouldnt count out an in season Butler trade.

But anyway you look at it, its a fantastic unit. If Cyrus Jones somehow realizes his potential..wow.

 

[stinkypete]

It's tough to get special teams snap counts, but in the games I looked up (SBXI, Rams, Jets, Bills) he didn't see the field, even on ST. That's a bad sign.

This team does need a potential backup SS, and unless you want to see Ebner taking significant snaps (in the event of a Chung injury) Richards is in the mix for a roster spot. Remember the name Demarious Travis. He is a UDFA SS from Minnesota. He meets the size/speed/demeanor requirements for the position, but his tackling needs work. If he impresses in camp, he could challenge Richards for a spot.

 

[50-yard-line]

As is usually the case, a player should be expected to show something by the pre-season of his 3rd season. Otherwise, he should be eligible to be replaced. Occasionally, there are injury reasons to explain a player's showing absolutely nothing.

I don't see why Richards should be given a pass. If he isn't good enough to be a backup SS, he should be replaced.

And, just BTW, I disagree with all 3 of your examples. ALL contributed as backups in their first couple of years.

His 3rd camp is coming up, so we'll see.

People here wanted Harmon and Ryan and Cannon cut, and quite loudly said so, year after year.

Richards' 2015 rookie season looked a lot like Harmon's rookie season. Last year, he was stuck behind a healthy and really good trio of safeties. Upgrading him with anything other than a rookie will be hard because I doubt BB will pay vet $$$ for the fourth safety.

You've got a guy known to have a very high football IQ, a high character guy, who's been in the system for 2 full years and has contributed. A guy BB likes a lot (and he just said he only wants to coach players he likes).

Also, at this point, with the 4 picks and all the UDFAs, there's one safety - and that in a class that was said to be very deep at the position.

Maybe he's the next Tavon Wilson (who's playing pretty well over in Detroit), or maybe he's Harmon when Harmon moves to McCourty's place.

 

[patfanken]

It's tough to get special teams snap counts, but in the games I looked up (SBXI, Rams, Jets, Bills) he didn't see the field, even on ST. That's a bad sign.

This team does need a potential backup SS, and unless you want to see Ebner taking significant snaps (in the event of a Chung injury) Richards is in the mix for a roster spot. Remember the name Demarious Travis. He is a UDFA SS from Minnesota. He meets the size/speed/demeanor requirements for the position, but his tackling needs work. If he impresses in camp, he could challenge Richards for a spot.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Ebner start to see some more regular defense snaps this year, especially in the event of an injury to one of the top 3 safeties.

There is no question he has the speed, and tackling ability in the open field. He has been around long enough to know the defenses. He already gets snaps on the GL Defense.

Guys like Ebner and Richardson, as well as TWilson, have all impeded by the fact that McCourty, Chung, and to a lesser extent Harmon have all been iron men the last 3 seasons. While those 3 have been playing so well, how can those others show what they have. Tavon Wilson thrived in Detroit once he got snaps. The kid was never a bad football player, just redundant here.

The truth is we don't know if Ebner and Richardson can or can't play. Up to now they havn't been needed to play.

 

[mgteich]

It says a lot when our 2nd round potential starter is reduced to one of our top posters not even knowing his name.

But, yes, I agree with you. One solution is to consider Ebner our emergency #4 position safety. King could even play the big nickel once in awhile if necessary.

Personally, I think that we need to consider keeping only FIVE safeties, understanding that the #4 and #5 safeties need to be top special teamers.

We might even consider carrying only 5 corners, understanding that the #5 corner needs to be a top special teamer.

BOTTOM LINE
11 defensive backs is a lot (but obviously doable if there are no developmental projects). 12 defensive backs seems excessive.

Our front seven specializes in having lots and lots of different roles. IMHO, it would be great if we could again have 15 front seven players, or at least 14.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Ebner start to see some more regular defense snaps this year, especially in the event of an injury to one of the top 3 safeties.

There is no question he has the speed, and tackling ability in the open field. He has been around long enough to know the defenses. He already gets snaps on the GL Defense.

Guys like Ebner and Richardson, as well as TWilson, have all impeded by the fact that McCourty, Chung, and to a lesser extent Harmon have all been iron men the last 3 seasons. While those 3 have been playing so well, how can those others show what they have. Tavon Wilson thrived in Detroit once he got snaps. The kid was never a bad football player, just redundant here.

The truth is we don't know if Ebner and Richardson can or can't play. Up to now they havn't been needed to play.

 

[hornetfb85]

There are a lot of combinations we could go with in our secondary. I know that it's early and there are a lot factors that come into play but with things as they are now, what would be the best combination.

Butler at the nickel and Rowe outside.

Or

Butler outside and one of C Jones/J Jones at nickel.

 

[mgteich]

There are a lot of combinations we could go with in our secondary. I know that it's early and there are a lot factors that come into play but with things as they are now, what would be the best combination.

Butler at the nickel and Rowe outside.

Or

Butler outside and one of C Jones/J Jones at nickel.

BASE - 2 CORNERS
I think that we all believe that this is Gilmore and Butler. Last year, we had Ryan and Butler.

NICKEL
The question is which player is added in the nickel. In 2016, Rowe was the #3. When he came in, he played the outside, with Ryan playing inside.

Sure, we COULD bring in one of the Jones boys as the #3. Personally, I think that the team is comfortable with Rowe as the #3, and certainly better than the Jones boys. Rowe outside and Butler in the slot is a powerful lineup.