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Defense - Corners

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by mgteich, Sep 20, 2011.

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  1. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think it reasonable to separate out the units and see where we are at this early time in the season. Obviously, the defense has much room for improvement. We just CAN'T let every opposing quarterback look like a probowler!

    INJURIES
    OK, let's be clear. We have more defensive backs playing with casts than than those who are who are healthy.

    BODDEN is doing OK. He is doing his job. He doesn't get thrown too often, because of his skills. And YES, he knows enough to hold when he is beaten. This is an important tactic, given the new rules.

    DOWLING
    He is now injured, but is much better than anyone could have expected so early in the season.

    MCCOURTY
    He is not picking off where he left off. Hopefully, more time will help. I expect that the lack of an off-season hurt him.

    ARRINGTON
    He is settling into his utility role, substituting for anyone injured, sometime dime back, sometime rover (following Bush), sometime designated blitzer. He is doing fine.

    MOLDEN
    He is our developmental player and STer. I don't expect much from him. He is kind of our Earthwind Moreland. If we need him, he'll play.

    BOTTOM LINE
    The improvements in the DL and at OLB/DE were supposed to make this groups much better than 2010. Butler and Wilhite are out. Bodden and Dowling are in. It seems that we should be much better than our production shows.
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2011
  2. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Rookie

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    The defense is only as good as it's weakest link.

    Minimal pass rush and a huge hole at FS, equals a lot of extra stress on our corners.
  3. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Also think that there are so many new moving parts, it will take time to come together.. have to keep in mind San Diego had a lot of O weapons, and we took Gates out of the game.. so McCourty was essentially 1-1 on Vincent Jackson.

    Something has to give in that scenario..

    While many lament the pass rush, thought it was better than last year.. pretty much shut down the run. Created 4 turnovers.. which is becoming a hallmark.
  4. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I ask again,

    ARE WE SATISFIED WITH THE PREFORMANCE OF THE CORNERS?

    Perhaps, we should give their performance over the first two weeks a grade?

    We've had Bodden for twpo games. We've had Downing for more than one game. I would expect to see improvement from 2011 in this unit. I understand that we have just played 2 great offenses (????). Seriously, I am fine if we think they'll be better later as the rest of the defense starts to gel.

    But for now, I can't see a grade better than B-.
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2011
  5. Horace's Ivories

    Horace's Ivories PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I think that alot of these passes completed against this secondary have been "pro bowl caliber" throws and/or catches
  6. Elijah

    Elijah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Who is Darling?
  7. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    A player need to be around ahile before we get his name right. :)

  8. borg

    borg Rookie

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    Phillip Rivers has major cajones...chucking it to his guy amongst a swarm of mighty mites. You would a think a 4 on 1 advantage for the defense would cause Rivers to redirect....but not so. Big cajones and huge confidence in his WR.

    I suspect BB knew Rivers would be fearless throwing into coverage ...and I suspect BB expected some turnovers as well. They got the yards, the Pats eventually got the turnovers. A win is a win. But as bad as the D has been, the Patriots are the only team to win both their games by 2 TDs each. Only the Texans come close with 1 big win and a 10 pointer. Tough to complain
  9. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Ron Darling. Former Mets and Athletics pitcher. The Pats have given him a try out at CB and he has been spectacular so far. For a guy who is his 50s and never played football before, he is far exceeding expectations. :D
  10. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    But, can he rush the passer?

  11. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We keep on talking about Rivers and the playoff quality chargers.

    How did the corners do agains the Henne and the "mighty" dolphins, our likely division doormats?

    Last edited: Sep 20, 2011
  12. patsfaninpittsburgh

    patsfaninpittsburgh Banned

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    Since it seems like we are going be stuck with these threads, I decided to order NFL Rewind just to make sure that's it's correct to believe what happened vs "your lying eyes".

    If we are going to jump on McCourty vs Jackson it might not be a bad idea to review the tape. The reality is only 4 of 10 catches were on McCourty. McCourty did give up an outstanding Floyd reception on the second drive.

    The first Jackson TD had good initial coverage. The pass was thrown after 5 seconds. Too long

    The second TD could have been intercepted or broken up by Arrington if he played the ball vs thinking he had a duck INT.

    Norv deserves mucho credit for putting Jackson in the slot.

    15 of the SD completions were to RB's.
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2011
  13. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Of the defensive backs, I'm only happy with Leigh Bodden, Ras-I Dowling and Patrick Chung's performances through 2 games. The rest have been average to below average.
  14. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Aren't we playing a different style also in the secondary. I thought we were in the process of being more aggressive as opposed to playing deep off the line. That is why we got rid of some of the players. A different scheme is going to take some time, some here do not want to give that time.
  15. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I would agree with this statement too.

    I question those who say that Bodden is not doing okay so far, I could be wrong but I rarely even remember him being targeted too much. Through the first two games the only time I even saw him was when he received the 2 penalties.

    I would tend to give the overall average of the CB's slightly lower than mgteich did, as I think that a "C" is in order, possibly even a "C-," but I'm a coldhearted pr!ck too...so take that into account ;)
  16. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Any update on Dowlings injury? haven't read anything about it
  17. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

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    I suspect McCourty just needs some time to get his reflexes right. After all, he wasn't that great the first half of his rookie season either.

    Also, his play is underrated. For example, in Game 1 he wrestled Brandon Marshall for the ball, lost the battle, but at least prevented the touchdown. The Pats succeeded on the goal-line stand.

    In Game 2, on another goal-line stand, he made a fine play in run support on 4th down that led to the stop. Take those two plays together, and the net effect is approximately the same as if we remove one big TD reception from his ledger.
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2011
  18. Off The Grid

    Off The Grid Rookie

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    Speak for yourself.
  19. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    LOL :D

    Ten chrctrs
  20. BillBelichickFan79

    BillBelichickFan79 Rookie

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    Stop making the excuse that Marshall and V-Jax are so tall so McCourty had no chance. If that's the case, then how does Revis at 5'11 or 5'10 blanket and completely shut down the 6'4 Moss, the 6'5 Calvin Johnson, the 6'3 Andre Johnson, the 6'4 Brandon Marshall, etc. And please don't say he gets away with PI all day. No. He doesn't. He's just a classic physical bump and run corner.

    Champ Bailey is only 6'0. He shutdown bigger WR's in his heyday. The only big shutdown CB in recent years is Asomugha. And I bet if you had him, you'd be complaining about how he's a bit stiff in the hips when he's playing in off coverage due to his height/length.

    McCourty is a good corner back with a promising future. But he's not the shutdown corner people were claiming he was last year. All the "McCourty > Revis" stuff was fanboy garbage. McCourty was overrated as a rookie because of his high interception total. He was burned by quite a few guys like Percy Harvin and Mike Wallace, but his interceptions made people forget about those things. By the end of the year, people just stopped throwing at him because whoever was playing opposite him or in the slot was just so inept (Arrington/Wilhite/Butler).

    Maybe one day he'll turn into a shutdown corner. But he's not really that close to being one at this time. He's a good player with a good deal of potential who is very solid in all phases of the game, but he's not an elite corner.
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2011
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