Cutdown Day: PATS NEWS thread

[Deus Irae]

From Albert Breer, who works for the NFL (NFL.com)

Since the new IR rule is being adopted after the 75-man roster cuts, for the 2012 season only, the NFL and NFLPA have agreed to a transition process that allows teams to activate one player back to the 53-man roster who has been put on IR since the start of training camp.

However, the player must be reactivated no later than 9 p.m. ET on Friday.

NFLPA, NFL agree to trade deadline extension, IR exception - NFL.com

Also explained by Gregg Rosenthal:

IR tweak could help David DeCastro, Desmond Bishop - NFL.com

Again, if the rule is as reported, Demps is done for the year.

 

[Ring 6]

Nobody has posted the exact language of the rule.

I think it has been posted but people want to use their own interpretation.

 

[Deus Irae]

I wasn't posting this because, of Ian's desires, but since there seems to be some confusion, I'll post it and allow the Mods to adjust as deemed necessary:

New IR Rule Explained and Trade Deadline Moved

Bylaw proposal No. 2 moves the trading deadline from Tuesday, October 16 – the Tuesday after Week 6 of the regular season – to Tuesday, October 30, the Tuesday after Week 8.

Bylaw proposal No. 6A permits clubs to re-activate one player from Reserve/Injured during the 2012 season, subject to certain restrictions.

Since this rule is being adopted after the cutdown to 75 players, for 2012 only, the NFL and NFLPA have agreed to a transition procedure that permits clubs to return to their 53-player active list one player placed on Reserve/Injured since the start of preseason training camp. This selection of that player must be made no later than 9:00 p.m. ET tomorrow, Friday, August 31.

Following the cutdown to 53 players, the new Reserve/Injured rule will work as follows:

1. Only players with a “major injury” who are placed on Reserve/Injured after 4:00 p.m., New York time, on Tuesday, September 4, or thereafter during the season, will be eligible to be reactivated at a later time.

2. A “major injury” is defined as an injury that renders the player unable to practice or play football for at least six weeks (42 calendar days) from the date of injury.

3. Each team may reactivate only one player placed on Reserve/Injured after 4:00 p.m., New York time, on Tuesday, September 4. That player must be “designated for return” at the time the club places him on Reserve/Injured, and such designation shall appear on that day’s Personnel Notice.

4. Such player is eligible to return to practice if he has been on Reserve/Injured for at least six weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve. He is eligible to return to the Active List if he has been on Reserve/Injured for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.

Adam Caplan's post on Philadelphia Eagles | Latest updates on Sulia

 

[Mack Herron]

I think it has been posted but people want to use their own interpretation.

Then show me the language. People have only posted reports and interpretations. Nobody know what it says. Not even Deus. As of yesterday, they were still working on it.


https://twitter.com/GeorgeAtallah/status/241203648435191809

 

[The Gr8est]

From Albert Breer, who works for the NFL (NFL.com)



NFLPA, NFL agree to trade deadline extension, IR exception - NFL.com

Also explained by Gregg Rosenthal:

IR tweak could help David DeCastro, Desmond Bishop - NFL.com

Again, if the rule is as reported, Demps is done for the year.

The part about a team having to reactivate the player who they want to use the new rule on removes the extra roster spot advantage.

Sadly, this DOES seem to doom Demps' return this year.

 

[Deus Irae]

Then show me the language. People have only posted reports and interpretations. Nobody know what it says. Not even Deus. As of yesterday, they were still working on it.


https://twitter.com/GeorgeAtallah/status/241203648435191809

You need to look at the times. That tweet was at 9:00 AM.

 

[Mack Herron]

You need to look at the times. That tweet was at 9:00 AM.

Sure, but have you seen the actual rule? I have not. The intent is to allow retroactive designation. Still seems ambiguous to me. If someone has seen the actual rule, please post it. Otherwise, I'll wait.

As Reiss posted tonight:

(unclear if it's season-ending or short-term).

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-england-patriots/post/_/id/4728527/time-to-be-held-accountable

 

[Deus Irae]

Sure, but have you seen the actual rule? I have not. The intent is to allow retroactive designation. Still seems ambiguous to me. If someone has seen the actual rule, please post it. Otherwise, I'll wait.

You're claiming an existing ambiguity about a rule you admit you haven't seen. I'm pointing out that, if the rule is as has been reported, there's no ambiguity here, at all.

 

[Mack Herron]

You're claiming an existing ambiguity about a rule you admit you haven't seen. I'm pointing out that, if the rule is as has been reported, there's no ambiguity here, at all.

Right or wrong, you are always certain.

 

[Deus Irae]

Right or wrong, you are always certain.

It's not about me being certain. It's about the reports being clear. Even the article you cited in an attempt to buttress your position, while arguing that it could apply to Demps, had the requirement about 9pm tonight, which means that it can no longer apply to Demps. I don't really get why you're arguing this.

And, again, you're claiming ambiguity in a rule that you've never read, while posting that "Right or wrong, you are always certain" crap.

 

[Deus Irae]

The most prominent move was the team putting rookie running back/return man Jeff Demps on injured reserve, ending his season. He is not on the 53-man roster so he won't be eligible for the newly implemented IR-return rule.

Demps to IR as Pats make cuts to 53

 

[mgteich]

The unanswered question is WHY we put Demps on IR instead of waiting a week and having available for later this season.

Demps to IR as Pats make cuts to 53

 

[Deus Irae]

Here's the text of the rule, from the NFLPA (this does not include the exception):

1. Only players with a "major injury" who are placed on Reserve/Injured after 4:00 p.m., New York time, on Tuesday, September 4, or thereafter during the season, will be eligible to be reactivated at a later time.

2. A "major injury" is defined as an injury that renders the player unable to practice or play football for at least six weeks (42 calendar days) from the date of injury.

3. Each team may reactivate only one player placed on Reserve/Injured after 4:00 p.m., New York time, on Tuesday, September 4. That player must be "designated for return" at the time the club places him on Reserve/Injured, and such designation shall appear on that day's Personnel Notice.

4. Such player is eligible to return to practice if he has been on Reserve/Injured for at least six weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve. He is eligible to return to the Active List if he has been on Reserve/Injured for at least eight weeks from the date he is placed on Reserve.

NFL Approves New IR Rule, Desmond Bishop Can Return This Season - Acme Packing Company

 

[Deus Irae]

The unanswered question is WHY we put Demps on IR instead of waiting a week and having available for later this season.

Absolutely. Severe MCL sprain or ACL sprain would make sense.

 

[Mack Herron]

Here's the text of the rule, from the NFLPA (this does not include the exception):



NFL Approves New IR Rule, Desmond Bishop Can Return This Season - Acme Packing Company

The exception is the relevant wording. All we seem to know is that teams could designate a player retroactively, right? Like Reiss, I don;t think it is clear if it applies to Demps (and I don't know if they would use it if it did). My point is that there is uncertainty about the exception regarding retroactive designation.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The unanswered question is WHY we put Demps on IR instead of waiting a week and having available for later this season.

The answer likely is because they are saving that designation for an in season situation at a position of greater need. And because they likely felt he needed a lot more practice/assimilation time before he could be useful enough once the games count a yet wouldn't clear waivers and make the PS.

They may also be saving that designation for Shiancoe.

 

[Deus Irae]

The exception is the relevant wording. All we seem to know is that teams could designate a player retroactively, right? Like Reiss, I don;t think it is clear if it applies to Demps (and I don't know if they would use it if it did). My point is that there is uncertainty about the exception regarding retroactive designation.

I've merely pointed out that, if the reports about the rule are accurate, Demps is lost for the year. Even if the 9pm interpretation you were going by was correct, the Patriots release did not place Demps on the "designated for return" IR listing, and that's what we have to go on. Your point was that Demps was eligible. You've since changed to arguing ambiguity and making snide personal remarks about me.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The exception is the relevant wording. All we seem to know is that teams could designate a player retroactively, right? Like Reiss, I don;t think it is clear if it applies to Demps (and I don't know if they would use it if it did). My point is that there is uncertainty about the exception regarding retroactive designation.

When the one time exception was announced earlier in the week it was stated that players placed on IR between the time the rules change was announced and final cutdowns would not be eligible, however players placed on IR earlier would be provided the team essentially rescinded their earlier designation to IR and carried them on the roster until the 4th.

 

[Patsrock]

This is from Greg Bedard

https://twitter.com/GregABedard/status/241715067698171904

 

[mgteich]

I agree.

I have posted several times that Shiancoe to IR next week would be a good idea.

The answer likely is because they are saving that designation for an in season situation at a position of greater need. And because they likely felt he needed a lot more practice/assimilation time before he could be useful enough once the games count a yet wouldn't clear waivers and make the PS.

They may also be saving that designation for Shiancoe.