Caldwell cut

[Vern]

I really would love to hear your response to my question. Here's my thing again:

What you are suggesting runs COMPLETELY counter to their their track record - indeed, this F.O. seems to be ESPECIALLY cognizant of giving guys they KNOW ARE GOING TO BE CUT a little extra time to hook on with another team before cuts occur. See Miller, Josh and Hawkins, Artrell. This happens ALL THE TIME in Foxboro, so why all of a sudden do you think they're totally going AGAINST that grain - especially with a guy like Reche who never caused a problem and, by all accounts, was well-liked by BB and the staff?

They kept him as insurance till they knew Moss was really healthy enough to play (for once will people understand that they know almost as little about the health of a player as we do). Also, they were trying to make a trade, for probably ANY of their WRs. If they could swing a trade, then Caldwell would stay on the roster. When it came down like this and no one wanted any WR, then the last guy on the list had to go.

His agent did not sound surprised. I swear folks, this stuff is not that hard.

 

[Nordy]

They kept him as insurance till they knew Moss was really healthy enough to play (for once will people understand that they know almost as little about the health of a player as we do). Also, they were trying to make a trade, for probably ANY of their WRs. If they could swing a trade, then Caldwell would stay on the roster. When it came down like this and no one wanted any WR, then the last guy on the list had to go.

His agent did not sound surprised. I swear folks, this stuff is not that hard.

Deus seems to think it's pretty hard.

 

[Deus Irae]

Deus seems to think it's pretty hard.

No, he seems to think that waiting until after all the rosters have been set was bush league. They are two very different things.

 

[nbsmitty]

You could always depend on him.Others are injury prone.Hope it does'nt come back and bite us in the - - -

 

[patsox23]

Your arguments are not "perfectly legit" which could be why. First of all, you somehow overlooked the Lawyer Milloy situation.

Wow. Where to start. I'll take the second part first. Lawyer Milloy. Lawyer Milloy got cut because he refused to restructure and if they kept him at his current number, MULTIPLE OTHER PLAYERS would have to be cut instead. It's not at all the same situation. He FORCED the move so he could go to another team and get a bigger money deal, which he did. The rumors of tampering from Washington - ring a bell? By the way, this is not news - to anyone but you, apparently.

But back to your first arguing-for-the-sake-of-arguing "point" - pray tell, how exactly are the following two arguments in any way NOT "perfectly legit?"

1) The Patriots have a track record of, whenever possible, letting vets go EARLY, so the players have a shot at hooking on with another team. The idea that somehow "spite" or other such "bush league" tactics played a role is really quite baseless.

2) Moss and Gaffney had both been hobbled as of late, and on the VERY DAY that both are back practicing, and Moss is back at his first practice, Caldwell gets cut. Do you see how there might be a correlation? That they kept him around, while likely trying to dig up trade partners, as insurance in case either or both of those guys were too hurt to play? This isn't reasonable to you?

No, let's go with YOUR theory instead. Let's ASSUME that the Patriots, with no history WHATSOEVER of bad blood with Reche Caldwell, and with a LONG (and recent) history of cutting vets in time for them to hook on with other clubs - let's assume THAT team decided to screw over this guy, who has never done anything to them. Does that ring AT ALL true to you?

No? Not to us, either. I tried to be nice about this, and let you save face, and you come back at me with this HORSECRAP? F that. You just got your ass WAILED on and handed to you. Just shut the Hell up, take your totally baseless theory that you can't even back up to ANYONE here with anything RESEMBLING a sound and grounded argument, and GO. GET. YOUR. F-ing. SHINEBOX.

 

[Keegs]

man im tired of being right

 

[patsox23]

They kept him as insurance till they knew Moss was really healthy enough to play (for once will people understand that they know almost as little about the health of a player as we do). Also, they were trying to make a trade, for probably ANY of their WRs. If they could swing a trade, then Caldwell would stay on the roster. When it came down like this and no one wanted any WR, then the last guy on the list had to go.

His agent did not sound surprised. I swear folks, this stuff is not that hard.

EXACTLY. Thank you.

 

[Deus Irae]

Wow. Where to start. I'll take the second part first. Lawyer Milloy. Lawyer Milloy got cut because he refused to restructure and if they kept him at his current number, MULTIPLE OTHER PLAYERS would have to be cut instead. It's not at all the same situation. He FORCED the move so he could go to another team and get a bigger money deal, which he did. The rumors of tampering from Washington - ring a bell? By the way, this is not news - to anyone but you, apparently.

But back to your first arguing-for-the-sake-of-arguing "point" - pray tell, how exactly are the following two arguments in any way NOT "perfectly legit?"

1) The Patriots have a track record of, whenever possible, letting vets go EARLY, so the players have a shot at hooking on with another team. The idea that somehow "spite" or other such "bush league" tactics played a role is really quite baseless.

2) Moss and Gaffney had both been hobbled as of late, and on the VERY DAY that both are back practicing, and Moss is back at his first practice, Caldwell gets cut. Do you see how there might be a correlation? That they kept him around, while likely trying to dig up trade partners, as insurance in case either or both of those guys were too hurt to play? This isn't reasonable to you?

No, let's go with YOUR theory instead. Let's ASSUME that the Patriots, with no history WHATSOEVER of bad blood with Reche Caldwell, and with a LONG (and recent) history of cutting vets in time for them to hook on with other clubs - let's assume THAT team decided to screw over this guy, who has never done anything to them. Does that ring AT ALL true to you?

No? Not to us, either. I tried to be nice about this, and let you save face, and you come back at me with this HORSECRAP? F that. You just got your ass WAILED on and handed to you. Just shut the Hell up, take your totally baseless theory that you can't even back up to ANYONE here with anything RESEMBLING a sound and grounded argument, and GO. GET. YOUR. F-ing. SHINEBOX.

I know some 8 month old children who are more mature than this. You were wrong, you are wrong, and you'll be wrong. Why? Because it was my OPINION being stated. In MY OPINION, what they did was bush league. Just because you don't agree, I'm supposed to give a rat's ass? Furthermore, it doesn't matter if it's standard to do what they did or not: they did it. Everything else you posted is just a steaming pile of cow dung.

If they cost him the potential to earn salary just so they could try to get a 7th round draft pick when they are the deepest team in the league and have 2 first round picks next season, that doesn't fall under "ok" in my book. It was bush league, just as your post here is bush league. And you, sir, are an idiot who should probably look into medication.

 

[PatsSteve1]

BBioli are always going to do what's best for the team. They were probably waiting to be sure Moss and Gaffney were OK then tried to get something in trade. That didn't happen. In many cases over the years they've cut guys early to hook up with another team. This time due to injury, they didn't feel it was in the interest of the team to do that.

 

[mgteich]

I also believe that this is exactly right. I also think it likely that we could not get ANY picks for Gaffney, Caldwell or for Washington. We decided NOT to use a roster spot to wait until trade value for someone increased in the next few weeks. That was certainly an option.

In the end, the debate with regard to the value of Gaffney, Caldwell and Washington was resolved. Caldwell was cut. In the end, Washington had more upside and plays special teams, as many have have argued for months. It was NOT a matter of who would be the best 2007 WR starter. And yes, there was the matter of having to pay Caldwell's higher 2007 salary, with no 2008 option for the patriots.

The patriots made the correct business decision, and made it at the correct time.

If Caldwell is a valuable commodity, certainly someone will sign him in the next week. I would think that he is better than many #3 wide receivers, certainly even more #4's.

They kept him as insurance till they knew Moss was really healthy enough to play (for once will people understand that they know almost as little about the health of a player as we do). Also, they were trying to make a trade, for probably ANY of their WRs. If they could swing a trade, then Caldwell would stay on the roster. When it came down like this and no one wanted any WR, then the last guy on the list had to go.

His agent did not sound surprised. I swear folks, this stuff is not that hard.

 

[LaBrady]

As soon as Moss got back, Caldwell ricocheted pretty quickly.

 

[Deus Irae]

BBioli are always going to do what's best for the team. They were probably waiting to be sure Moss and Gaffney were OK then tried to get something in trade. That didn't happen. In many cases over the years they've cut guys early to hook up with another team. This time due to injury, they didn't feel it was in the interest of the team to do that.

This could very well be the reasoning. I just find it to be bush league that they hosed their #1 receiver from last year in the attempt to get a 7th (even 6th) round pick. The timing was not "the correct time" as a moderator claimed. The timing was terrible.

 

[patsox23]

As soon as Moss got back, Caldwell ricocheted pretty quickly.

Don't buy into the coincidence. It's much more about the Pats F.O. turning suddenly, randomly spiteful toward Reche Caldwell!

 

[patsox23]

I know some 8 month old children who are more mature than this. You were wrong, you are wrong, and you'll be wrong. Why? Because it was my OPINION being stated. In MY OPINION, what they did was bush league.

Backpedal says hi. White flag got here earlier. They're gonna hang out for awhile.

 

[Phoenix111]

BBioli are always going to do what's best for the team. They were probably waiting to be sure Moss and Gaffney were OK then tried to get something in trade. That didn't happen. In many cases over the years they've cut guys early to hook up with another team. This time due to injury, they didn't feel it was in the interest of the team to do that.

Exactly. I would much rather BB look out for the good of the team first and foremost as opposed to the personal matters of one individual player. Many here would come out with full force fury if we had cut Caldwell early for his sake, he had signed with another team and then two of our top receivers had gone down. IF this had happened, the front office would have taken a beating on here.

 

[Deus Irae]

I normally hate commenting on player moves by the Patriots because, unlike the Celtics, they actually know what they are doing most of the time, but this move makes no sense at all to me, unless it's been made out of spite. If Caldwell wasn't coming back, he should have been let loose a long time ago so he could catch on with another team.

They weren't sure of Moss's health, that's why they kept him. It's unfortunate, but it what WORLD would the Pats F.O. harbor spit toward Reche Caldwell? I wonder also if maybe they were trying to trade him "into a job," and just couldn't find any takers.

Spite comes from many sources, but I wasn't claiming there was any. It's just the only thing that makes any kind of sense at all. They just hosed their #1 receiver from last year, and I can't find any reason for it that makes any real sense.

Don't buy into the coincidence. It's much more about the Pats F.O. turning suddenly, randomly spiteful toward Reche Caldwell!

Call me when you learn reading comprehension.

 

[PatsSteve1]

The timing was not "the correct time" as a moderator claimed. The timing was terrible.

It wasn't the right timing for Caldwell's interest's. That's true.

 

[Water Boy]

Good luck Reche. I'll remember the good times.

 

[Patjew]

Best of luck Reche. Thanks for the hard work last year.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

It wasn't the right timing for Caldwell's interest's. That's true.

And that should never be BB's concern UNLESS it coincides with the best interest of the team. With Moss unable to play in the pre season, Stallworth not getting to practice through much of camp, Troy and CJ not making it make it off PUP before the season, and Gaffney dinged up at the end of the pre season, there was no way the two interests could have coincided in this situation this season. Reche likely got as well as he gave last season, seeing as he was playing with Tom Brady and made it to the AFCC. If he can't parlay that into something even on the eve of the season, then it's probably because other HC's and GM's see him for what he is. Releasing him three weeks ago would have only made Bill's take on what our #1 WR from last season was all the clearer. And if he had, and Moss didn't progress and Stallworth had a setback and Gaffney got dinged up in pre season, I'm sure the same voice would be wailing about our bushleague HOF HC - only with a little more justification.