PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

After meeting with Broncos, Cutler formally asks for trade


Status
Not open for further replies.
Re: After Meeting with McKid, Cutler Formally Asks for Trade

Mcdaniels seems to have Manginis people skill
 
I have repeatedly heard reference to the three team deal and how there is no way Denver did not initiate it. Let me spitball here: Tampa Bay reaches out to Detroit and says "who you be interested in this deal," Detroit responds "it would," and Tampa Bay then contacts Denver with a proposal (not a hammered out contract, that would require a higher order of involvement). I am having a hard time understanding why all the junior GMs blasting Denver are having such a hard time fathoming that possibility.

:confused:

Could you re-check the names in this paragraph and re-post?
 
Re: After Meeting with McKid, Cutler Formally Asks for Trade

Was Cook his agent when Cutler signed his existing contract? If not, Cook gets nada until he negotiates a new one IIRC. I'm always skeptical when a player gets a new agent and then screams for a new contract or a trade........

Cook has been his agent since the beginning.
 
It is funny that he is basically calling McDaniels a hypocrite and then acting hypocritical towards him in this case.

Please locate this phantom quote by myself chastising Branch's agent. It doesn't exist.


The Broncos front office is showing its ineptitude by at the same time telling their QB he's their guy, and then telling him they will continue listening to offers for their QB as they come. They are showing their ineptitude by at the same time denying they ever considered an offer for Cutler, and then telling him that they did consider offers.
 
Re: After Meeting with McKid, Cutler Formally Asks for Trade

Was Cook his agent when Cutler signed his existing contract? If not, Cook gets nada until he negotiates a new one IIRC. I'm always skeptical when a player gets a new agent and then screams for a new contract or a trade........

Cook has always been Cutler's agent. It is really stretching it to think Cook or Cutler have been planning to force a trade out of Denver before two months ago. That is just more irrational thinking from McDaniels ball washers who will defend the kid at all cost, even against the facts or common sense.
 
Last edited:
Cook has an interesting and somewhat limited client list. Just a smattering of stars, including two recently retired QB's whose legacies he helped blow up when they wouldn't restructure or mentor, two Patriots (AD and Randy, although I recall Randy has a personal lawyer who dealt with most of his stuff here and I think Bus just consults on contracts in that case), Calvin Johnson and two Broncos (Cutler and his binky Scheffler). He was likely behind Randy's exit from Minnesota to Oakland. He seldom gets them what they need, moreso convincing them what they want.

I think he wants a big second deal for Cutler before some scheme or his illness makes that a pipedream. Negotiations were underway with the Broncos before Shanny got canned and Bowlen put the brakes on pending his new HC's evaluation of the roster. That got Bus thinkin' about how Jay might fare better at sea level in a temperate climate or in a dome in a conference where there really is parity, and a lot of QB inconsistency if now mediocrity. Jay's pro bowl nods within the AFC will be limited going forward as long as Brady and Manning stay healthy and Rivers (and now Cassel) potentially exists to overshadow him in a weak and wide open division.

The only mistake Josh made was trying to work with this stiff and not rock the boat out of the gate. Probably would have been a tough sell to Bowlen to lay the groundwork that Cutler needed to go on the heels of a default pro bowl nod.... Sometimes owners have to figure that out for themselves. Just like Kraft with Bledsoe. No way BB could have jettisoned him in 2000, and probably would have had a hard time even after 2001 had not Brady exposed him in relief. Bowlen now knows what a little self absorbed pissant Cutler is but the problem is the best case replacement scenario no longer exists. Can't trade him for picks with Simms as the backup, either. But he's gotta go now or Bowlen might as well sign the team over to Bus...

Maybe they can work something out with Ratgini since he apparently isn't ready to commit to Quinn. At least he knows the offense and system Josh will be implementing. Only the Browns don't appear to be in a position to be adding contracts. Cutler's would work in trade but he'd likely never agree to play absent that big extension. And unless Eric's a total idiot he had to have learned a lesson about self absorbed gunslingers over the last several months - they can make or break you and walk away smelling like a rose... But those guys tend to have allure for struggling HC's that decries common sense. Shanny spent 2-3 seasons trying to force Jake to accept discipline and follow a script just so they could be clompetitive. Then he jettisoned him for a younger version of the same problem. And he got so caught up in trying to cater to that he lost sight of his running game and defense which had previously been his strengths and kept them remotely competitive.

It was bound to come to this in Denver sooner or later. Remains to be seen which way causes Josh the most damage. Had he not made the playoffs this season with Cutler he'd have likely gotten the lions share of the blame anyway...and still had Cutler to deal with. He only has to win 6 games with whomever replaces Jay to be ahead of the game in the midst of a full blown rebuild.
 
Please locate this phantom quote by myself chastising Branch's agent. It doesn't exist.


The Broncos front office is showing its ineptitude by at the same time telling their QB he's their guy, and then telling him they will continue listening to offers for their QB as they come. They are showing their ineptitude by at the same time denying they ever considered an offer for Cutler, and then telling him that they did consider offers.

I thought in the whole Branch fiasco your stance was that Chayut was an idiot, and that Branch only wanted more money for his special-needs son, and that Chayut negotiating through the media for a new contract or trade was the wrong way to go.

I don't recall any longtime poster blasting BB for failing to appease Deion Branch and treat him like a bona fide #1 WR.

But now that we are talking about Denver it seems Bus Cook's blabbing about private meetings and demanding trades is some kind of damning inditement of player management.
 
I thought in the whole Branch fiasco your stance was that Chayut was an idiot, and that Branch only wanted more money for his special-needs son, and that Chayut negotiating through the media for a new contract or trade was the wrong way to go.

Then find it, because I never said it. What you wrote is so different from my stance toward Branch's behavior, a stance I did not change.
If it exists please find it; posters can't delete posts after like a day it's been up. You won't find it because you're completely making this up.
 
Then find it, because I never said it. What you wrote is so different from my stance toward Branch's behavior, a stance I did not change.
If it exists please find it; posters can't delete posts after like a day it's been up. You won't find it because you're completely making this up.

Okay, I believe I've got my ducks in a row.

First and third part of my statement, that you said Chayut was the idiot (not BB, or Branch) responsible for holding out, demanding trades, leaking details to the media:
Sorry, but the Seymour situation was totally different just by virtue of the fact that Branch is not in the same class as Seymour. Also, Seymour's agent DID negotiate. Chayut has done no such thing. He told the pats to F**K off and that Deion would be holding out of camp unless the Patriots guaranteed that they wouldn't use the Franchise tag on Branch next year.
You're completely right.

But I won't hold Branch's idiot agent against him.
source:http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...l-branch-dead-me-thread-page2.html#post147480

And in a thread mostly about Branch and Chayut talking to the press:

If Deion fires his agent, hires a new one, and gets a new deal done in the next two weeks, will all of you still hate him!?!?!?

He hired his agent to represent him, to do the work for him. Obviously Chayut is doing a horrible job, but we need to stop attributing *all* of these recent boneheaded actions to Branch.
source:http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...st-talked-branch-merged-page2.html#post161038

You didn't quote anyone, but I assume you were responding to sentiments like this:

I'm truly getting pissed at Branch. It's one thing when we can pretend it's all his agent ill-advising him, but clearly the man knows what he's doing.

I am really shocked after all that Tom Brady has done for Branch that this little WR would now leave his QB out to dry. He's under contract and should be out there for his main man. But he's putting himself first. "F" him.

Then, on the second contention, I'll quote the full post you responded to:
Deion doesn't have ordinary kids. With the way our health care system is going, it may easily cost a few million or more to pay for one of those kids, who will be uninsurable once Deion leaves the NFL.

I'm not saying he couldn't have done it on $6 million a year, but when you come down to it, he is just like anyone else in his position. I was on his case because I thought his salary demands were crazy. They weren't. Other teams were willing to pay.

Look, I'm not going to bring this up to make a political point, but if you're a Republican and you're bagging on Deion, then you're being a bit hypocritical because the argument that the GOP uses for the death tax is that rich people should be allowed to give their earnings to their kids, whether or not their kids would be just fine without it. It's the same thing. Americans want to pass on riches to their kids, especially when a kid has a debilitating illness.

Then you:

Great point, and I totally forgot about this. Branch ACTUALLY has a kid with a debilitating, expensive disease. He's one of the rare players who can actually use this excuse and that it's legitimate.

Regardless of this fact, my previous points still hold, I think.

Then you again (responding to a point about how McGinest was hurt the Pats cut him before the "dummy year" of his contract):

Right. I highly doubt it's always wink-winked as a dummy year with the player. Are owners 'breaking their word' when they cut someone?

Also, this got lost in the thread, but Branch actually HAS a kid with a debilitating disease that could easily wipe out his fortune in a short amount of time.
source: http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...-care-them-not-patriots-page2.html#post188053

I don't really see how the second contention has much to do with Cutler/McDaniels, but you said my whole summation of your argument was completely made up, so...

Understand I have no bones to pick with you over your Branch arguments, you made good points and, as you said, you appear to be very consistent - especially in the matter of sympathizing with the player, not the agent (or the coach/FO). I just don't see how most of those principles are the same as the ones now, in the Cutler case.

EDIT: Obviously, there was a lot of stuff about Chayut's/Branch's shenanigans in the search, and it was a long time ago so I don't remember a lot of it. If you can find where you blast Belichick or Pioli for their inability to make Branch happy, I'll happily eat crow over implying you were being inconsistent.
 
Last edited:
unoriginal I appreciate you actually taking the time to do that, I can tell you were being earnest and not just being a d*ck like the McDaniels ball washers here.

Still, I fail to see how my past comments about Branch paints an inconsistent picture when it comes to my view toward Cutler or the Broncos front office. The McDaniels lovers are simply using your comments to somehow discredit my points saying I am somehow being irrational over McDaniels, when I'm not. I think the past two months, never mind the past few years, are showing to the rest of football America just how inexperienced McDaniels is and how clueless he is over situational awareness, on and off the field.
 
Last edited:
I appreciate you actually taking the time to do that, I can tell you were being earnest and not just being a d*ck like the McDaniels ball washers here.

Still, I fail to see how my past comments about Branch paints an inconsistent picture when it comes to my view toward Cutler or the Broncos front office. The McDaniels lovers are simply using your comments to somehow discredit my points because I am somehow being irrational over McDaniels, when I'm not. I think the past two months, never mind the past few years, are showing to the rest of football America just how inexperienced McDaniels is and how clueless he is over situational awareness, on and off the field.

The issue for me is, is the player "Patriot material" or not?

As i believe you agreed with in the quoted threads, Seymour is a very special talent who simply held out for a new contract; your support of Seymour was perfectly consistent with your argument that holdouts are a tool for players acknowledged by the CBA. Furthermore, during his holdout neither Seymour or his agent said much of anything to the media; Seymour practically disappeared from the press' POV, while his agent "actually negotiated" with the Pats. That is the very border case of Patriot material.

With Branch, which you recognized as a good player, but not on Seymour's level, you accepted the holdout, believed that the Pats ended up getting great value for him by trading him for a low 1st round pick, but when it came to the agent (Chayut) leaking stories to the press, holding pressers, and engaging in (alleged) player tampering with other teams, you considered that idiotic on the part of Chayut, not BB, though in the end Chayut got what he wanted. You didn't criticize BB that I know of, and as for Branch you praised his keeping his mouth mostly shut and letting his agent be the "bad cop."

Now we have both Cutler and Bus Cook talking to the press not only about contracts, but about heart-to-heart player-coach conversations like this is Jerry Jones' Dallas Cowboys. Neither one of them is keeping their mouths shut, and it looks likely that, much like Branch before, Cutler will get what he wants, or at least prove to be a big distraction in training camp, and possbily beyond. But since this isn't BB we're talking about, appearently neither Cook or Cutler are most at fault, its McDaniels for not handling this situation correctly.

My views may well be colored here because I, like McDaniels seems to, do not consider Cutler to be a sure-fire franchise QB like I think you do. This is a guy who ran the prototypical college option offense at Vanderbilt, then ran the prototypical west coast pro timing offense under Shanahan at Denver. Now you've got McDaniels coming in with an Air Coryell spread offense the likes of which Cutler has never seen. He demands a trade right then I believe. Then he puts up a public hissy fit when McDaniels considers bringing in a guy with the same measurables (minus the diabetes) who has had 4 years training in the offense. After that he demands a trade again, preferably to one of the west coast offense teams (like Minnesota, Tampa Bay or Detroit) that originally expressed so much interest in Cutler in the first place.

Thus I don't see how McDaniels has done anything to Denver that wasn't already done, besides sound out roster riff-raff at the most important position (QB) and alienate the fanbase, who naturally did not hate Shanahan and had high hopes for Cutler.
 
Last edited:
Why?????

JM has every right to look this d-bag right in the face and say "Yeah, I considered trading your 17-20, sorry-ass for a guy that I think I can win with....... but I didn't, deal with it".

screw Cutler, he's got a lot of stones. Some people are comparing is whining with lord Farvaquare, and in some way's it's similar, with one MAJOR difference. At least Farvaquare had a couple good-great seasons under his belt to point to even if they were 600 years ago. WTF is Cutler using to inflate his ego?

In 3 years post-Cutler, Denver might actually be good again.

Unfortunately McDaniels probably will be gone by then. Rightly or wrongly, Josh will be the fall guy if this doesn't get worked out. No amount of hand wringing over the antics of Bus Cook or the baby Cutler will change the fact that Josh came out at least a year too early.

I'm not a McDaniels hater and I wish he was still our OC. Can't really begrudge him for taking the opportunity that presented itself to him.
But in retrospect, maybe it would have been wiser for him, at 32 years of age, to spend another year or two learning under the greatest HC in the history of the NFL before deciding to leap into the post-Shanahan void in Denver.
 
Good for Jay Cutler, the Broncos organization are officially the clowns of the off-season.

But hey who cares, right? Cutler's just a whiny 25 year old pro-bowl quarterback coming off a 4,500+ yard season. They'll be better off. :rolleyes:
 
Now we have both Cutler and Bus Cook talking to the press not only about contracts, but about heart-to-heart player-coach conversations like this is Jerry Jones' Dallas Cowboys.

I definitely think a major aspect of this is Cutler's inherent whiny crybaby personality, as well as the fact that Bus Cook is his agent and one with a history of also causing problems with the franchises that employed his other QB clients.

But no matter how we try to look at it, I believe the Broncos front office has recently done multiple very stupid things, for which there is no defense.

If the coach is of the judgment that Cutler is no good and wanted Cassel in the first place, he should have been more aggressive in shaping his own team right off the bat, rather than what he ended up doing. What he ended up doing is deny to media and his own QB that he thought about a trade, and then two weeks later admit that he did consider a trade and would continue to listen to trades for his QB. That is a sign of either someone who can't make up his mind, is untrustworthy and disingenuous, or someone with a complete lack of social skills or situational awareness. Either way it's no good.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


New Patriots WR Javon Baker: ‘You ain’t gonna outwork me’
Friday Patriots Notebook 5/3: News and Notes
Thursday Patriots Notebook 5/2: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 5/1: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo’s Appearance on WEEI On Monday
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/30: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Drake Maye’s Interview on WEEI on Jones & Mego with Arcand
MORSE: Rookie Camp Invitees and Draft Notes
Patriots Get Extension Done with Barmore
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/29: News and Notes
Back
Top