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AFC playoff bye for PATs?


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Fair point, driven home by the poster (lamafist) who reports that the data show that over the last 12 seasons 16 of 48 teams with Byes have made the SB vs. eight of 96 without a bye. That's a 33.3% chance of getting to the big game with a Bye vs. 8.3% without a Bye.

If you expand the universe of SB winners back to 2000, it is, however, still 50--50 with vs. without the Bye. So, using lamafist's data, six of the sixteen that got to the SB with a Bye (37.5%) won the game and six of the eight without a Bye (75%) won the game.

So, the combined analysis shows that you have a better chance of actually getting to the SB with a Bye by a margin of four to one! I stand well and clearly corrected on that!

However, the analysis also shows that if you get there without a Bye, you have a better chance of winning the game, once you are there, by a margin of two to one (75% to 37.5%).

That makes me want to stick to my going-in view, stated several times in the thread: I'd rather that we have a Bye, but it's not the end of the world if we don't.

Good stuff all around. I wish there were more threads like this where we argue and discuss data, get corrected on the data by other posters and all end up learning something we didn't know before!

Thanks to everyone who added to the discussion and kept it civil and fact-driven!

Just to continue with the breakdowns, again using the given numbers, although SB win% doesn't add up to 100%...

12 non-bye
4 - bye

8.3% reach SB with non-bye
33% reach SB with bye

75% win SB with non-bye
37.5% win SB with bye

8.3% times 75% = .06225, or 6%
33% times 37.5% = .12375, or 12%

So, during the years referenced, given the numbers supplied and the percentages given (and assuming I didn't make an error), you are twice as likely to win the Super Bowl if you have a bye than if you don't.
 
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Beat me to it guys
5 stars
 
Just to continue with the breakdowns, again using the given numbers, although SB win% doesn't add up to 100%...

12 non-bye
4 - bye

8.3% reach SB with non-bye
33% reach SB with bye

75% win SB with non-bye
37.5% win SB with bye

8.3% times 75% = .06225, or 6%
33% times 37.5% = .12375, or 12%

So, during the years referenced, given the numbers supplied and the percentages given (and assuming I didn't make an error), you are twice as likely to win the Super Bowl if you have a bye than if you don't.

Yes, I saw that, but didn't spell it out because I thought it was tautologous; to wit (and to simplify the underlying calculation and logic), if you have a four times better chance of getting to the SB with a Bye (as I acknowledged, repeated twice and bolded) and a two times better chance of winning if you get there without a Bye (something that I believe was "new information)", you, therefore, by reducing the four and the two, end up with a two times better chance of winning the SB if you have a Bye. I guess it needed to be explicated, though. Thanks for doing so.

All in all, as I said in every one of my posts on this thread, I'd rather have a Bye, but it's not the end of the world if we don't.
 
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Yes, I saw that, but didn't spell it out because I thought it was tautologous; to wit (and to simplify the underlying calculation and logic), if you have a four times better chance of getting to the SB with a Bye (as I acknowledged, repeated twice and bolded) and a two times better chance of winning if you get there without a Bye (something that I believe was "new information)", you, therefore, by reducing the four and the two, end up with a two times better chance of winning the SB if you have a Bye. I guess it needed to be explicated, though. Thanks for doing so.

All in all, as I said in every one of my posts on this thread, I'd rather have a Bye, but it's not the end of the world if we don't.

I hear you. I was just breaking it down to the actual numbers. In the end, if you're looking at the breakdowns that we've done, and you're not looking any further, you're really deciding which point of view you're more comfortable with:

"It's twice as likely!"

or

"It's only a 6% difference in success rate."
 
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try as I might I cannot help but be tautologous and state that , despite this expert data breakdown, the Jets STILL suck and remain the outlyingest of outliers ever.
 
It was my understanding that there would be no math...
 
try as I might I cannot help but be tautologous and state that , despite this expert data breakdown, the Jets STILL suck and remain the outlyingest of outliers ever.

And may they get their pathetic clocks thoroughly cleaned in Seattle today!
 
I hear you. I was just breaking it down to the actual numbers. In the end, if you're looking at the breakdowns that we've done, and you're not looking any further, you're really deciding which point of view you're more comfortable with:

"It's twice as likely!"

or

"It's only a 6% difference in success rate."

Absolutely! If ever there was a case where the numbers can lead you to a half-empty vs. half-full (All right, all right, I know when I'm beaten, "25% empty vs. half-full" :) ) conclusion this is it.
 
An update after the week ten games, with as small amount of math as possible:


- Texans will soon be 8-1, Pats 6-3
-- Pats need to win one more game than the Texans do, plus beat Houston in Foxboro in week 14 (Dec 10); Pats would then finish ahead on the head-to-head tie-breaker

--- OR

- Ravens are 7-2, Pats 6-3
-- Baltimore has the head-to-head tie-breaker, so Pats need to win not one, but two more games than the Ravens do to finish ahead of them

--- ALSO

- Broncos are 6-3, Pats 6-3
-- Pats win the tie-breaker since they beat Denver in week 5, so the Pats just need to win at least as often as the Broncos do to remain ahead of them

--- DON'T FORGET

- Steelers are 5-3
-- Like Freddy Kreuger and Michael Myers, they come back from the dead

- Colts are also 6-3
-- But I don't see them winning the AFCS, which leaves them as a lower seed than the Pats
 
An update after the week ten games, with as small amount of math as possible:


- Texans will soon be 8-1, Pats 6-3
-- Pats need to win one more game than the Texans do, plus beat Houston in Foxboro in week 14 (Dec 10); Pats would then finish ahead on the head-to-head tie-breaker

--- OR

- Ravens are 7-2, Pats 6-3
-- Baltimore has the head-to-head tie-breaker, so Pats need to win not one, but two more games than the Ravens do to finish ahead of them

--- ALSO

- Broncos are 6-3, Pats 6-3
-- Pats win the tie-breaker since they beat Denver in week 5, so the Pats just need to win at least as often as the Broncos do to remain ahead of them

--- DON'T FORGET

- Steelers are 5-3
-- Like Freddy Kreuger and Michael Myers, they come back from the dead

- Colts are also 6-3
-- But I don't see them winning the AFCS, which leaves them as a lower seed than the Pats

Thanks for the information, but I just want to beat Indy next week and then worry about two straight Division Games on the road.
 
Thanks for the information, but I just want to beat Indy next week and then worry about two straight Division Games on the road.

That's all it comes down to my friend.

One game at a time, never underestimate the competition (especially with this secondary), never take anything for granted.

We will get the absolute best shots from Indy, the Thanksgiving spectacle that is shaping up to be in NY for the storm victims (no offense to anyone affected in any way), and the always tough Miami game on the road.

If they get through those 3, they'll have already helped to decide their fate in the playoff bye circus as it is, putting themselves at a 9-3 record.

Your above scenario is certainly key for even bringing this conversation up.
 
An update after the week ten games, with as small amount of math as possible:


- Texans will soon be 8-1, Pats 6-3
-- Pats need to win one more game than the Texans do, plus beat Houston in Foxboro in week 14 (Dec 10); Pats would then finish ahead on the head-to-head tie-breaker


As long as they can pull to within ONE game of Houston between now and then + beat them on 12/10 we'd overtake their spot.

Tough obstacle, but not impossible, although their opponents before the big game are as follows, which doesn't help much at all:

--Jags

--Lions

--Titans
 
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An update after the week ten games, with as small amount of math as possible:


- Texans will soon be 8-1, Pats 6-3
-- Pats need to win one more game than the Texans do, plus beat Houston in Foxboro in week 14 (Dec 10); Pats would then finish ahead on the head-to-head tie-breaker

--- OR

- Ravens are 7-2, Pats 6-3
-- Baltimore has the head-to-head tie-breaker, so Pats need to win not one, but two more games than the Ravens do to finish ahead of them

--- ALSO

- Broncos are 6-3, Pats 6-3
-- Pats win the tie-breaker since they beat Denver in week 5, so the Pats just need to win at least as often as the Broncos do to remain ahead of them

--- DON'T FORGET

- Steelers are 5-3
-- Like Freddy Kreuger and Michael Myers, they come back from the dead

- Colts are also 6-3
-- But I don't see them winning the AFCS, which leaves them as a lower seed than the Pats

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Pats can still finish ahead of Balitmore if Pittsburgh sweeps them and we finish with the same record as the Steelers and Ravens, right? First tie breaker would be for their division which Pittsburgh wins head to head and then we would likely beat Pit in conference record for the higher seed.
 
Prepare for the 4 seed, 3 seed if Denver collapses
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Pats can still finish ahead of Balitmore if Pittsburgh sweeps them and we finish with the same record as the Steelers and Ravens, right? First tie breaker would be for their division which Pittsburgh wins head to head and then we would likely beat Pit in conference record for the higher seed.

Yes, you are right. Division tiebreakers are determined first, and then the conference tiebreakers.

Good point, I had not considered that scenario.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the Pats can still finish ahead of Balitmore if Pittsburgh sweeps them and we finish with the same record as the Steelers and Ravens, right? First tie breaker would be for their division which Pittsburgh wins head to head and then we would likely beat Pit in conference record for the higher seed.

Excellent point. That's a very realistic scenario IMO if Ravens, Steelers, Broncos, us all finish 12-4 we'd get the 2 seed at least. I still anticipate Ravens and Steelers finishing 11-5 at best but this is alot more comforting. The Ravens have gotten some awful lucky wins.
 
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Wouldn't even be surprised if the Texans finish 14-2 with a loss vs. us.

JAX
@DET
@TEN
@NE
IND
MIN
@IND
 
Wouldn't even be surprised if the Texans finish 14-2 with a loss vs. us.

JAX
@DET
@TEN
@NE
IND
MIN
@IND

Me either but that Detroit game looks a bit tougher now, plus keep in mind that's the Thanksgiving game.

Also Indy could potentially pull one off *praying*
 
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