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A Football Puzzle for Gurus

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by JR4, Nov 6, 2008.

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  1. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Here's the situation

    WR goes deep and is covered man on man.
    Makes the catch at the 2 yd line and goes in for the TD.

    Ref calls pass interference at the 5 yd line.

    Offense Head Coach declines the penalty.

    Defense Head coach throws red flag and challenges the TD
    because WR stepped on side line before crossing goal line.

    After review it is determined that indeed the WR stepped out of bounds
    at the 2 yd line.

    So who has the ball, where and why?

    (remember offense coach decline the pass interference call )
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2008
  2. Patsfanin Philly

    Patsfanin Philly Rookie

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    #95 Jersey

    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    decline the penalty and take it at the 2....

    If you meant he stepped out before making the catch, the offense can accept the penalty after the review because of changed circumstances. When they originally declined it, they thought they had a TD. When it was overruled they get the option to decide again...
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2008
  3. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    I presume that you want the situation to be 4th and goal before the play.

  4. Patsfanin Philly

    Patsfanin Philly Rookie

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    #95 Jersey

    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    They you obviously take the penalty at the 5 for a new set of downs.....
  5. ScottieC

    ScottieC Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus


    Replay down if it was not 4th.
  6. tobias funke

    tobias funke Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    1st and goal at the 2

    or

    1st and goal at the 5

    i'm pretty sure this is a no-brainer
  7. MoLewisrocks

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    I thought the Offensive HC declined the penalty...which would mean the penalty was on the defender.

    He would have the chance to revisit declining the penalty after the call on the field is overturned. Ball is either at the spot of the foul 1st and goal from the 5 or where it went out of bounds. Since in this case out of bounds is closer to the goal line the HC of the offense would still likely still decline the penalty and the ball would be on the 2 - unless of course the play didn't result in a first down - in which case you take the penalty and 1st and goal on the 5.
  8. JR4

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    Just for future clarification of where threads belong.

    WHY IS THIS NOT a MAIN FORUM THREAD?????

    IS this not Football? certainly not draft talk.

    Please Clarify moderator.

    BTW, threads as this have been in this main forum for years and I have been here a very very long time.
  9. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    "I thought the Offensive HC " Yeah I correct the initial post

    I think you hit the nail on the head:

    He would have the chance to revisit declining the penalty after the call on the field is overturned.

    This is logical anything after the ruling in the field is void if the ruling on the field is changed which it would be by the challenge being upheld.

    Thanks mo
  10. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    2 yard line. Still decline the penalty. Why would you want it on the 5 yard line?
  11. DaBruinz

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    #50 Jersey

    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    OK.. You mention that the WR stepped out of bounds at the 2 yard line.

    Was it determined the WR stepped out of bound before or after the catch? I

    If the player stepped out of bounds at the 2-yard line before the catch was made, then the Offensive Head Coach would clearly accept the penalty and have a new set of downs from the 5 yards line.

    If the player stepped out of bound at the two AFTER the catch was made, then the penalty would be declined and the ball placed at the 2-Yard Line and have a new set of downs.
  12. JR4

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    Ok let's adjust the scenario.

    The WR wasn't out of bounds but never had control the ball in the End zone
    when he went to ground with the ball.

    Interference still called on the 5yd line which is declined by the Offense HC.

    Defense HC challenges the ruling of a TD.

    On review the TD call is reversed. According to Mo, the Offense HC can
    now accept the interference call and instead of an uncompleted pass the ball
    is now at the 5 yd line at point of interference even though that penalty
    was initially declined.
  13. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    Sorry about that. I moved another and then this one by mistake. The system is not allowing me to move this thread back.

    mg

  14. jmt57

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    I'm pretty sure Mo is correct. Once the cicumstances of the play change, it is once again now time to decide on whether or not to accept the penalty.
  15. spacecrime

    spacecrime Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    Mo is correct.
  16. JR4

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    Good points DaBruin. But if Player catches ball After stepping out of bounds
    then - no catch is the rule and - the interference penalty would be accepted. This all happens because Defense challenged the TD.

    I think the important point I learned here is what Mo said.
    If the call on the field is reversed, conditions reset to that point which allows any decision with regard to penalties to be made again.
  17. Batman

    Batman Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    At the conclusion of the play a coach or captain is given a choice based on what the referee and his assistants have called the play as if there is a change to the conclusion of the play the coach or captain has the opportunity to make his call based on the new play.

    That is something similar to what the NCAA football rules and interpretations say on the matter this rule book is the version modified for british and european use. I think it may have been for NFLE too which may be why that aspect in included.
  18. Deec77

    Deec77 Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    If the ruling on the field was a touchdown. Defense HC challenges the ruling of a TD not a catch therefore the catch itself never came into question. and yes the offensive coach would have the chance to revisit declining the penalty after the call on the field is overturned.

    So the only really info you would need to answer would be down and distance.

    What if it was 4 down? Wouldn't you want a new set of downs?
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2008
  19. JR4

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    aha .... another gotcha. Good one Deec.

    If it were 4th down and catch was made before going out of bounds one the 2 yd line then Offense really has only one choice
    ... take the penalty and new set of downs at the 5yd line.

    Because the ruling on the field of a completed catch for TD was changed,
    the Offense HC can then choose to take the interference penalty and
    get a new set of downs.
  20. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Re: A Football Puzzel for Gurus

    the original question starts, "WR goes deep and is covered man on man."

    If the WR is going deep and makes a catch. It is now 1st down.
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