NFL Appeal oral arguments thread

Bob McGovern ‏@BobMcGovernJr 5m5 minutes ago


From my vantage: Judge Denny Chin seemed most likely to side with the NFL, but he peppered the league in process.

TBR said:

I thought asians were intelligent.

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Bob McGovern ‏@BobMcGovernJr 10m10 minutes ago


Just getting out of the #DeflateGate hearing... much different than what happened in front of Berman.

Rob0729 said:

"Based on the questioning to the NFL attorney, it is quite clear that the three judge panel feel Judge Richard Berman severely abused his powers and will rule in the NFL's failure. All the questioning to the NFL suggests that they feel that Roger Goodell wrote a well thought out and unimpeachable decision. I fully expect them to ignore protocol and overturn Judge Berman's decision at the end of the hearing and carry the NFL's attorney on their shoulder as they exit the court room," Lester Munson

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I wish people would stop with these fake Munson quotes. The man is such a moron, it is difficult to tell when someone is really quoting him or being facetious.

Ben Volin ‏@BenVolin 3m3 minutes ago


At one point Kessler became exasperated with the judges. “I sense that you all are influenced by your version of the facts.”


Ouch

sb1 said:

Bob McGovern ‏@BobMcGovernJr 5m5 minutes ago


From my vantage: Judge Denny Chin seemed most likely to side with the NFL, but he peppered the league in process.

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So the best case scenario for the NFL seems to be "Legally, we have to let you be an a—hole."

Froob said:

What were the decisions Berman used? Can't remember.

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Proper notice of punishment for violations, ability to cross examine Jeffrey Pash, and lack of consistency in punishment for similar violations.

It could be the judges decide to split the baby and overturn some of the rulings, but not all.

NFL in court: "We have no actual evidence of Brady's involvement in a ball deflation scheme."

Chin: "I find that evidence to be compelling."

Whaaaaaa?

Froob said:

If the NFL wins CBAs are 100% useless. Unions should be furious if the NFL wins.

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Not just unions. Considering the growing prevalence of binding arbitration agreements in everything from employer contracts to consumer agreements, all Americans should be furious if it is determined that those in positions of power can pick arbitrators who will guarantee them the result they want without any guarantee of impartial proceedings that follow the rules.

Pete Brush ‏@PeteBrush 14m14 minutes ago


'We're an expeditious court,' says Judge Katzmann. Vows to rule quickly #DeflateGate

ctpatsfan77 said:

Berman only decided on the first issue, and declared the other three "moot"—since Brady only needed to prevail on one issue.

If they reverse Berman on this, they could send it down to him to decide on the other three, or they could decide it themselves.

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No he decided on multiple issues, but left other arguments to be decided.

Does not sound good for Mr. Brady from the early tweets.

Froob said:

What were the decisions Berman used? Can't remember.

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Berman found: (1) Goodell denied Brady equal access to investigative files; (2) Brady had inadequate notice of the potential penalties; (3) that Brady had no notice that what he allegedly did constituted an infraction; and (4) that Goodell improperly denied Brady the right to cross examine Pash.

Berman specifically did not address: (1) evident partiality (in short, Goodell designating too much authority to Vincent); (2) that Goodell's grounds for punishment were not factual findings from the Wells Report, but rather, after the fact conclusions reached by Goodell and Goodell alone; and (3) Goodell was bound by the Wells Report and couldn't veer from it to Brady's detriment.

I may have missed something, but that's what I recall.

ViperGTS said:

View attachment 12346

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Good thing Chin isn't Polish or the Archie Bunkers would all be coming out of the woodwork.

sb1 said:

Even if that were the case, that's not what they are ruling on. They are all working from a presumption of guilt. So did Berman btw.

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Yes, I remember clearly how that went. And that they can rule on the Berman judgement.

I was speaking more from an emotional POV, which is why I threw the caveat that anything we get from that twitter court reporter should be taken with a grain of salt until the dust settles.

Pete Brush ‏@PeteBrush 6m6 minutes ago


I just had a horrible vision: Judge Parker and Chin reverse on #DeflateGate, Judge Katzmann dissents and it goes to en banc 2nd Circ.

Can't believe we are spending another off-season dealing with this BS. I am sooo farking done once Tom and Bill retire.

TBR said:

I thought asians were intelligent.

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wow.

sb1 said:

Pete Brush ‏@PeteBrush 14m14 minutes ago


'We're an expeditious court,' says Judge Katzmann. Vows to rule quickly #DeflateGate

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If they rule quickly in NFL favor..will punishment still take a while ect?

sb1 said:

Pete Brush ‏@PeteBrush 6m6 minutes ago


I just had a horrible vision: Judge Parker and Chin reverse on #DeflateGate, Judge Katzmann dissents and it goes to en banc 2nd Circ.

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I can promise you that a 2-1 decision either way will result in the losing side seeking rehearing en banc. That doesn't mean they'll get it though.