Positional ranking 3-4 DE Pre Combine

Ochmed Jones · Dec 25, 2011

2nd biggest need on our defense is a DE.

Positional Requirement: Ability to read and read. Stand up O line guys and cover two gaps at once. Must be able to keep O line guys off the LBers.

Rankings:

1.) Still - PSU - Good size and experience. Probably off the board in the #15 to #25 range.
2.) Cox - Miss State - Great senior season in the tough SEC. Made a ton of plays and projects well to the 5 technique, with a year of learning. bottom third of the first round.
3.) Crick - Nebraska - Injured and missed most of his senior season. Late first to mid second round range.
4.) Winn - Boise State - Experienced and dependable. Projected mid to late second round.
5.) Short - Purdue - Will need time to learn the position,but projects to be able to make the transition. Early third round.

Sleeper: Randall Texas. Career underachiever. Would a switch to DE suit his skill set better? I think so. 4th round.

manxman2601 · Dec 25, 2011

I really like Fletcher Cox, but I'm not sure he's a two gapper at the moment which I think could be a problem if he's low first high second round, strikes me purely a a one gap lineman whose excellent athleticism will have him in the first round come draft day - although one advantage to the Patriots sticking with a 4-3 is that most other 4-3 teams are picking early in the first round with 3-4 teams picking later so if Fletcher Cox isn't picked early then he could well last to our first rounders.

As a sleeper, how about Dajohn Harris DT USC

6'5"
310 lbs

From NFP

Is a bit taller than most typical USC defensive tackles, but still possesses that thick trunk and base. Is a linear pass rusher who possesses a good first step off the football and when he keeps his base down can be very effective/disruptive. However, is inconsistent in his stance, gets straight-legged at times, comes off the ball upright and doesn't create the necessary burst to his game in order to get into blocks quickly. Has improved his balance as a pass rusher, which has made him a move effective laterally. Works his arms well once he gains a step using the rip to fight off blocks and when he keeps his base under him he can fight to disengage and penetrate through contact and into the backfield. Also, displays some bull rush ability as well when he plays with proper leverage.

Has done a much better job as a senior firing off the ball low, which allows him to shoot his hands and keeps his pad level down on contact. And he's doing a better job routinely anchoring and fight his way into the backfield. Plus, does a much better job creating a pop on contact, maintaining his balance and is more effective when looking to shed. However, has a tendency to stand upright if he doesn't win off the snap when looking to disengage. Will use his length and at times violent hands well when looking to get off blocks, but even when he does shed, too often he allows himself to get worked down the field. Possesses a solid motor in pursuit and will work from the backside, but isn't overly rangy.

Was listed as the number two nose tackle on the depth chart entering the 2011 season, many believed it's not due to talent/performance, but more so to motivate him to come into camp in shape.

Impression: Improved his pad level, balance and hand usage as a senior and looks like one of the better senior DT prospects. Looks like an intriguing rotational guy with some long term upside.

Should be had between rounds 5-7, an area BB likes to take DL's.

WaterfallJumper · Dec 25, 2011

Randall is my guy this year. He seems like the best confluence of talent and value. I'd take him as early as late second, although I think he could be available in the third. He's more athletic than people realize, and his work against the run is a joy to watch when he's on his game.

Ochmed Jones · Dec 26, 2011

manxman2601 said:
I really like Fletcher Cox, but I'm not sure he's a two gapper at the moment which I think could be a problem if he's low first high second round, strikes me purely a a one gap lineman whose excellent athleticism will have him in the first round come draft day - although one advantage to the Patriots sticking with a 4-3 is that most other 4-3 teams are picking early in the first round with 3-4 teams picking later so if Fletcher Cox isn't picked early then he could well last to our first rounders.

A lot of people thought TY Warren was a pure one gap DT coming out of college,but BB traded up for him and after a year of learning technique, he became very dependable and excelled for us for a while.

Cox will need a year to learn technique and get stronger,but by year two, he should own the DE spot opposite Deaderick who has become a solid player for us.

everlong · Jan 3, 2012

Only a sophomore but William Gholston was a beast vs Georgia yesterday. Before anybody starts yes he's Vernon's cousin but that's where the similarities end and I never liked Vernon as a prospect.

He plays with a motor that I never saw out of Vernon and he's listed at 6'7" 280 and looks like he could easily add 30 pounds to that frame and not lose any of his burst. I'll be interested to see his arm length because they just seem to go on for forever allowing him to keep the tackles from getting into his body. Good leverage and strength as well.

This was the first MSU game I saw this year so I don't know if he's consistent the way he was in this game but if he is I bet he declares next year and goes in the top half of the first round.

VrabelJr · Jan 3, 2012

William Gholston is a hot head punk who cost MSU a couple of games due to his after the play dirty antics. He's a liability.

Why isn't Quinton Coples on this list? He looks to be the perfect 5 technique DE. I'm still not sold on Devin Still. I think he fits better in a 4-3. Jared Crick is worth a shot if it's late in the 2nd.

everlong · Jan 3, 2012

Good to know. Although I don't condone the actions of a guy like Suh the Pats could use a little more nasty so if he can be controlled I wouldn't knock him down for it. Seymour could be flat out nasty and Mankins is for example.

VrabelJr · Jan 3, 2012

Mankins is smart nasty. Seymour is stupid nasty. Suh is spoiled nasty. Gholston is flat out ******ed nasty.

FreeTedWilliams · Jan 3, 2012

Why are we even discussing DEs? You know he is not going to pick one....

MSU · Jan 3, 2012

VrabelJr said:
William Gholston is a hot head punk who cost MSU a couple of games due to his after the play dirty antics. He's a liability.

Why isn't Quinton Coples on this list? He looks to be the perfect 5 technique DE. I'm still not sold on Devin Still. I think he fits better in a 4-3. Jared Crick is worth a shot if it's late in the 2nd.

That is complete bull. William "Too Tall" Gholston has yet to cost the Spartans a game. He got a bad rap from this years annual beatdown of the Stinkbeavers because of a punch / helmet twist. What the biased Michigan media failed to show was the UM lineman ramming his head into the ground.

I've watched every MSU game this year, and they weren't even close to losing one from Gholston. Please inform me what game they lost due to his antics.

Also, only look at this photo if you want nightmares tonight.

h ttp://media.247sports.com/Uploads/Boards/673/21673/342775.jpg

MSU · Jan 3, 2012

VrabelJr said:
Mankins is smart nasty. Seymour is stupid nasty. Suh is spoiled nasty. Gholston is flat out ******ed nasty.

Did he sleep with your wife or something? Or are you upset about the beatdown he put on Miller and OSU this year? Or should I say O$U.

MP-Logick · Jan 3, 2012

FreeTedWilliams said:
Why are we even discussing DEs? You know he is not going to pick one....

You mean...the position he has used two first round picks on in his tenure already?

pats63 · Jan 3, 2012

VrabelJr said:
Mankins is smart nasty. Seymour is stupid nasty. Suh is spoiled nasty. Gholston is flat out ******ed nasty.

good one dude I am still laughing

sg14 · Jan 3, 2012

Speaking of the MSU-Georgia game, that was a good game to watch.

I like Worthy, he looked a little bit quicker off the LOS than #98. Both 99 & 98 looked the right size..

What is the status of those two??

Ghoulston got several free passes, nobody blocked him. So have to say he may have looked better than he actually is in that game.

Sciz · Jan 4, 2012

FreeTedWilliams said:
Why are we even discussing DEs? You know he is not going to pick one....

Belichick has won a Super Bowl every season after drafting a first round DL with the Pats. Maybe he should pick one more often!

(Seymour 2001, Warren 2003, Wilfork 2004)

reflexblue · Jan 4, 2012

MP-Logick said:
You mean...the position he has used two first round picks on in his tenure already?

One first round pick which was Seymour, VW wasn't taken to play D-end.

Off The Grid · Jan 4, 2012

Sciz said:
Belichick has won a Super Bowl every season after drafting a first round DL with the Pats. Maybe he should pick one more often!

(Seymour 2001, Warren 2003, Wilfork 2004)

It All Starts In The Trenches.

Allways has.

Allways will.

So Let It Be Written.

Yes, I'm certain that I read that somewhere, once...

MSU · Jan 4, 2012

sg14 said:
Speaking of the MSU-Georgia game, that was a good game to watch.

I like Worthy, he looked a little bit quicker off the LOS than #98. Both 99 & 98 looked the right size..

What is the status of those two??

Ghoulston got several free passes, nobody blocked him. So have to say he may have looked better than he actually is in that game.

Worthy has said he hasn't made a decision about coming back or going pro yet. General consensus among MSU fans is he's leaning towards pro. Rashard-White, the big guy who blocked the kick, is a JUCO transfer. He had a bit of injury issues earlier in the year, nothing serious, but it hampered his playing time. I would be shocked if he came out this year.

MP-Logick · Jan 4, 2012

reflexblue said:
One first round pick which was Seymour, VW wasn't taken to play D-end.

Is Ty Warren not a defensive end?

Ochmed Jones · Jan 5, 2012

Off The Grid said:
It All Starts In The Trenches.

Allways has.

Allways will.

So Let It Be Written.

Yes, I'm certain that I read that somewhere, once...

I could not agree more. That is why I think we really need to draft DE Cox in the first round at #32. At #30 we need to take a pass rushing demon like Montgomery of LSU.

As for Worthy, I see him as a pure 4-3 DT with little chance of converting to a 3-4 DE.

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