Will Bill Belichick Trade Ryan Mallett?

[supafly]

OTOH, it's possible that a team that decided not to take Mallett in 2011 (*cough* JAX *cough*) might come to their senses and offer something valuable.

I suppose that after this explanation and the one that ausbacker gave regarding the poor positional quality overall of this year's draft crop of QB's, the possibility may exist more than I initially thought.

Belichick is the only one who has enough of an idea as to what he'd part with him for, or maybe he still needs more time to evaluate altogether, but I will admit that if the price were right I am sure it would be thought about, sure.

I wonder if the position itself it harder to grasp, develop, succeed at, and even possibly analyze/evaluate here in this organization as opposed to other places, much like that of WR?

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I don't often disagree with you Grid, but I will here. Don't forget that it was the Mallett pick that precipitated my well known meltdown the night of that draft. (btw- where I predicted the beginning of the end of Pats dominance. )

It's not that I don't believe that you COULD be right. But the empirical evidence doesn't match your opinion. We have no real idea how Mallett will fare if/when he gets his chance. Even pre-season isn't a good test because of a myriad of reasons. IIRC Cassell looked a lot worse the preseason before the 2008 season.....and he ended up with 3700 yds, 21TDs and only 11 picks The point being is WE really don't know. The thing was Bill dd, and he kept him that year despite the fact none of us thought he'd even make the team.

The empirical evidence I mentioned is that Bill not only kept Mallett, he released a QB he previously trusted to be Brady's sole back up. In other words, Mallett beat out a guy who most of us thought (and some still do) was a pretty competent QB. And contrary to your harsh evaluation, BB has to feel that Mallett is a "pretty competent QB" as well, even better than Hoyer to make the move he did.

That being said, I see the Kafka signing as being a warning shot to Mallett that he'll have to compete for his job next season. I also see the signing as opening up a possibility for a trade of Mallett. As I mentioned before the Kafka signing and Cassell's eventual availability certainly sets the stage.

The only problem I see in that scenario is the lack of a market for Mallett that would bring the likes of a 2nd or 3rd round pick, or any pick for that matter. A combination of a lack of real game experience, and an existing plethora of QB's that do have some great game tapes to present.

I agree that Tom Brady will long outlast Ryan Mallett on the Patriots. But that doesn't mean his pick was as bad you and I first thought, or that he might not find some success after he leaves here. BB obviously has a higher opinion of his skills than you.

BTW- on Matt Cassell. People forget that he had a great year with KC in 2010. A year he had 27 TD's and only 7 picks. I am curious about what happened to him that allowed Brady Quinn to be able to beat him out just 2 years later.

The Hoyer to Mallett decision was driven as much by financial and roster effect as anything. Hoyer was on a $1.9M RFA tender - more than double what BB had paid for the backup position in total in some time- and BB had a lot of intriguing late rounders and TE's he wanted to retain on this years 53.

The Kafka signing is meaningless. Bill often signs a QB to a futures contract and he's long gone before camp.

What happened to Cassel was 4 different OC's in 4 years. After spending all off season working with Chan Gailey, which may in and of itself have been a mistake, Haley got him fired and took over on the eve of that first season. That worked out so well Charlie was brought in for year 2 and that resulted in a playoff appearance and pro bowl berth. Only Haley banged heads with Charlie down the stretch and Pioli chose to back the wrong dog in that fight. So in year 3 the OL coach Bill Muir became the OC in name only for another round of Haley running the offense. That resulted in Haley finally being asscanned only it also led to a guy who sucked as an OC in Cleveland and Miami and whom BB wouldn't even allow to be QB's coach when he was here taking over the offense.

 

[patsfan-1982]

the way hoyer and Cassel has played will stop any team from giveing up much for mallett that and there was 6 teams in the playoffs with rookie and 2th year QB's as there starters so way give up more then a 3rd or 4th for some teams back up QB

 

[ctpatsfan77]

the way hoyer and Cassel has played will stop any team from giveing up much for mallett that and there was 6 teams in the playoffs with rookie and 2th year QB's as there starters so way give up more then a 3rd or 4th for some teams back up QB

The difference, though, is that almost nobody was calling Mallett a day 3 pick/UDFA.

 

[Stilla]

Trading away Mallet without a viable backup is worthless.

The coaching staff knows more about Mallet now, than they do about any other QB that would be brought in. Right now the team knows what offence he is capable of running.

Any returning QB or new QB would have to sit the bench as a third string QB and compete for the backup job against Mallet for an entire year.

It not just about the player, its more about the system. Can a player fit the play calls, and/or can a system be built around the QB. That sort of thing can only be developed over time. And of right now Mallet holds the job.

Its about building a team, not collecting talent or draft picks.

Only when we have carried 3 or more QBs for a season would this conversation become valid.

 

[Deus Irae]

Trading away Mallet without a viable backup is worthless.

The coaching staff knows more about Mallet now, than they do about any other QB that would be brought in. Right now the team knows what offence he is capable of running.

Any returning QB or new QB would have to sit the bench as a third string QB and compete for the backup job against Mallet for an entire year.

It not just about the player, its more about the system. Can a player fit the play calls, and/or can a system be built around the QB. That sort of thing can only be developed over time. And of right now Mallet holds the job.

Its about building a team, not collecting talent or draft picks.

Only when we have carried 3 or more QBs for a season would this conversation become valid.

They could trade away Mallett and have an entire offseason to prepare his "successor". That's not an issue.

 

[rookBoston]

Nobody in this thread has mentioned the possibility of an injury to Tom. Seeing that he wants to "play until 40" he better not be planning on taking shots like the Haynesworth pre-season shot or Mallet is going to be the man.

And that makes me cringe.

In the new NFL, you get flagged for sneezing on a QB. There's always a chance someone rolls up on his knees, but with the type of OL the Pats wrap around the pocket, Brady doesn't take the kind of toll that RG3 is subjected to. Running QBs may be all the rage, but pocket passers live longer.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Will BB Trade Mallett?

Trading away Mallet without a viable backup is worthless.

The coaching staff knows more about Mallet now, than they do about any other QB that would be brought in. Right now the team knows what offence he is capable of running.

Any returning QB or new QB would have to sit the bench as a third string QB and compete for the backup job against Mallet for an entire year.

It not just about the player, its more about the system. Can a player fit the play calls, and/or can a system be built around the QB. That sort of thing can only be developed over time. And of right now Mallet holds the job.

Its about building a team, not collecting talent or draft picks.

Only when we have carried 3 or more QBs for a season would this conversation become valid.

Generally speaking BB doesn't play the political game here. It's a meritocracy although other factors can be weighed in depending on circumstances. That's kind of what happened this off season. Mallett showed a little more life late and given his desire to save a roster spot and about $1.3M in cap...Mallett stuck. And knowing the league I think BB was confident Hoyer would remain just a phone call away, as he did until the last month of the season. (Which btw was kind of a ****ty thing to do to a kid who did nothing but bust his ass here for 3 year - but I guess that was just business). Hoyer came in as an UDFA and kicked 3rd rounder KOC to the curb despite a default season as the #2 here. Cassel quietly did the same as Flutie became more of a mentor/emergency depth/veteran feel good guy we allow to try a trick play as the 2005 season wore on. He retired because he knew he'd been passed on the depth chart and in his opinion deservedly so.

A fully developed system exists here that was built around Brady's strengths and skillset. The best backup for that system is someone who can run it as closely as possible to the way Brady runs it. We haven't had a backup play package around here since Cassel knocked Rohan off the roster. That's one reason Mallett made no sense to some of us. The only thing Mallett has in common with guys like Cassel and Hoyer is he isn't remotely good enough at what he is best suited to to push Brady or cause the braintrust to shift gears in their offensive approach. Ergo the only job available to him is backing up Brady...and he seems ill suited to the task even compared to Cassel or Hoyer from what little we'd ever seen from any of them.

 

[stcjones]

True. But, I don't think anyone foresaw TFB coming in and taking over the QB position from Bledsoe either. You don't know what you have sometimes until a player gets thrown in there. BB is high on Mallett right now....that's good enough for me

The 2 best QBs in the NFL this year were 35 and 36 years old. Neither shows much "deterioration", as you put it. Any team that loses a QB of that magnitude is going to experience a significant "deterioration", no matter who steps in.

Mallett assuredly has value. No one's suggesting dumping him. BB clearly values him. But do you really see him starting over Brady in the next 2 years? And do you really see him taking over as the successor to Brady after 2014? If not, then he's likely gone, as he won't want to ride the pine forever, and even if he somehow agreed the cap hit of keeping 2 QBs with high priced deals (which it would take to keep him if the Pats convinced him that he was "the successor") would be prohibitive, so if there is an opportunity to get something of value for him (which there may not be), then it's not unreasonable to consider it.

 

[Snake Eyes]

BB is high on Mallett right now....that's good enough for me

What are you basing that on, aside from the fact that he's on the roster?

 

[stcjones]

BB named him practice player of the week a few times...obviously he beat out Hoyer for the backup position ...and BB early on commented on Mallett saying that he was happy with his progress at this point. Obviously at this point in the season, you aren't going to have too many reporters asking BB about the backup QB position. Anyways, BB Seems to like the kid...he's the backup...and IF BB changes his mind and decides to move him...that's what will happen. For now BB is comfortable with Mallet being there if Gawd forbid Brady gets hurt!

What are you basing that on, aside from the fact that he's on the roster?

 

[AzPatsFan]

Trading away Mallet without a viable backup is worthless.

The coaching staff knows more about Mallet now, than they do about any other QB that would be brought in. Right now the team knows what offence he is capable of running.

Any returning QB or new QB would have to sit the bench as a third string QB and compete for the backup job against Mallet for an entire year.

It not just about the player, its more about the system. Can a player fit the play calls, and/or can a system be built around the QB. That sort of thing can only be developed over time. And of right now Mallet holds the job.

Its about building a team, not collecting talent or draft picks.

Only when we have carried 3 or more QBs for a season would this conversation become valid.

Our resident draftniks over time have been converted to BB's demonstrated requirement for good reserves in every case, except the most important position on a team the QB. In order to secure a fourth or fifth WR or Safety, they would strip the club of an adequate repacement QB, hoping that Tom Brady will not be injured.


But Blil Belechick does not operate that way. He carried 4 QBs so his developing QB candidate could be carried, despite having a $100 million dollar Star at QB. Similarly, he tested Cassell in all kinds of purposely created disasters in training camp to test Cassell's POISE, which they never recognized; and then used him to win 11 games when callled on to replace injured Tom in the first game of the season.

Your commentary makes absolute sense.

OT OTG,

Yes I admit I suggested that BB draft Locker as I wanted to start training a replacment as Brady's career wound down. Instead, Locker was tossed into a nightmare in Tennessee. If he, like Mallett, had spent two years learning on the bench, I'm not sure the Patriots would not have a good replacement QB candidate.

BTW, I did read BB's mind, he did spend a high pick on a QB when Ryan Mallett fell into his grasp. Nor was this BB's first attempt. He spent a high pick on KOC as well if you recall, so finding a suitable Tom Brady backup replacement; and maybe even a successor, is/was on BB's mind.

 

[Bhelmet]

What are you basing that on, aside from the fact that he's on the roster?

Mallett is a film nut (and knows how to break it down) - much like BB - that is why Mallett is here/still here.

 

[1%er]

Mallett is a film nut (and knows how to break it down) - much like BB - that is why Mallett is here/still here.

I don't think Mallet has value of a 3rd rounder right now and I can't see BB selling for less then he paid at this point.

 

[bagwell368]

Not to BB, apparently. . . .

Being the current back-up has nothing to do with being the heir to Brady.

 

[bagwell368]

Yes. The 4th QB was Brady. Someone speculated Brady will retire in '14 or '15. I think that's premature, barring serious injury. The man still has the competitive fire. He's stated numerous times he'd like to play until he's 40. While that may be overly optimistic it isn't under the realm of impossibility.

A look at the history of HOF QB's should sober anyone up when it comes to stated goals and the most likely actual outcome.

He's not a great QB because of his athleticism.

Brady has been slowed by his injury in '08, and his age. Did you fail to see him trying to duck shadows earlier this year? Brady has been taking shots lately. It just takes one.

It's his football IQ, ability to read defenses and the speed with which he can go through his progressions that make him great. When all of that slows down, it'll be time to walk away.

Irrelevant if he can't play due to injury.

I can't see Mallett still on this team when that happens. Brady's replacement probably just graduated high school.

Brady is going to play 5-6 more years? Please.

 

[bagwell368]

Yeah I remember a backup who looked just like that before he got his first start for the Patriots. His name was Tom Brady, no.12 I think!

Utter rubbish. Brady never looked as clueless, slow of foot OR brain, or as inaccurate as Mallet in his first camp/pre-season, and Mallett has progressed "experience" wise past that. Too bad his results are as stark as they are poor since he came here.

Mallett vs Hoyer - dress up both of the pigs to look like QB's - Mallett is the one that will draw more trade interest because of the arm. Lots of evaluators can't resist an arm like that - in particular after its been through the Pats system. It's like a GM in baseball can't resist a lefty that brings it, even though he can't throw to 1B, field, or control the ball - just look up Matt Young in Boston for the perfect match for Mallett. He once threw a "no-hitter" with 8 or 9 walks.

 

[bagwell368]

You draftniks are really DUMB.

The Patriots have a 35 going on 36 year old QB, that y'all think will play forever, or another 5 years. We can already see some deterioration of his long passing skills, yet you think its a good idea to trade an extraordinary talented QB prospect, that Bill Belichick's skill has brought to Foxboro.

Now he may or may not be a great or even good QB, but no one doubts that he has rare talent and size, with a rocket arm. Sure he can't run around like RG III or Russell Wilson, but he has an even better arm than Luck, and running QBs are exciting, but don'tseem to win anything.

Wilson is an interesting name - Marc Wilson - ever hear of him, see him play? Another big arm that looked great in practice that couldn't play. He had Al Davis fooled, he even had a shot here too. Bum. Very similar to Mallett IMO - but achieved certainly much more.

BTW Luck is possessed of more skill as a QB than Mallett will ever have. It's ridiculous to try and compare the two. The only extraordinary skill he has is the million dollar arm to go with the 10 cent head.

In case you have forgotten, Tom Brady is a pocket passer and not a runner either. The only criticism of Mallett was an amorphous critique of his character, that was NOT buttressed by any facts, just press insinuations.

He has already demonstrated that he is not lazy, is coachable, and Belichik is impressed with his studiousness. He has not played much, but he is team oriented and works hard, given the numerous "Black Shirts" he was awarded.

In his time with the Patriots he has kept his nose clean; and to the grindstone, studying and diligently practising and learning. Sooner or later the Patriots will need either a backup or a replacement QB, and no one else is as close to being prepared to step forward, if needed.

His footwork is several degrees worse than Bledsoe at his worst. That's not an insinuation, it's a fact.

 

[bagwell368]

umm really? multiple picks? unless we can get a couple of 2nd rounders for mallet it's not worth it. and i d on't htink any team would pay that price.

Just curious, what did you think the Pats should have got for Hoyer? Lots of people had him as 2nd, 3rd, and even late 1st.

Typical over-inflation of value of ones teams resources.

 

[supafly]

Brady is going to play 4-6 more years? Please.

Considering the fact that he still has 2 years left on his deal and will be a very good candidate for an extension/restructuring in the offseason, I certainly would not bet against it..

I think 4 years is a very reasonable goal to be honest.