Defensive players whining about a less violent NFL...

[Pats726]

defensive players with big mouths complaining have no where near the vulnerability with ther knees. NO WHERE!!! Let Ray ray and other big mouth players play QB and see what QBs have to face. My guess is that big mouths would understand WHY there are certain rules needed for QBs as they are more open to injury and have a larger impact on a team.
I don't think the Ravens HAVE had a situation with a QB injured and gone..so Ray ray is talking through a non experience. Maybe if Flacco got injured on a questionable play would his mantra change..don't know that.
BTW, local hole Felger agrees totally with Ray ray...not surprised at all.

 

[BradyManny]

I am not sure he is specifically refering to the knee rules as I would bet he agrees with that especially if you phrased it the way you just did. IMO its the collective nature of it you can't hit them high, you an't hit them low, you can't pick them up and slam, you can't bare all your weight on them, and you can't sneeze in their direction because of n1h1. Whats next no blind side hits those seem dangerous?

Sure, when you put it that way - I can see your point. But again, I just think these defensive players are so biased in this argument, that their opinion just shouldn't be taken at all (and again, they oughta just be playing by the rules that have been established). I'm damn sure I've complained about RTP on Wilfork or AD in the past, but I would be disappointed if those guys went off on a rant about the league b/c of those calls.

 

[Ghost of Ben Dreith]

There are a lot of solid comments in this thread on protecting player's knees:

1. OL can't go high/low on a DL man

2. Can't block at the knees on KR/PR

3. No crackback blocks

4. QB's get fined for going at the knees of a Defensive player too..(Sanchez with the personal foul against NO on the 99yd int. return)


To sum it up, it just seems that this was a long time coming in the need to protect QB's. Lewis is being a little beotch just because the Pats stiffed the Ravens again. This should be such a non-story....or if it was a story should have been titled......."QB's Get Same Protection as Other Players".

 

[signbabybrady]

Well, I don't disagree - let me just put it this way - we, as fans, can b*tch, moan, do whatever - we are not paid to play this game. But the players, as professionals who know the rules & have an obligation to play by them, have no right to. Especially on the defensive side of the ball when they are the guys inflicting these hits. Did AD or Wilfork go on a tirade after the game about the physicality of the game, or the new rules? Hell no.

And I think Synovia makes a great point above - "you punish the action, not the outcome" - very well put. Suggs dove at Brady's knee, if Brady doesn't hop out the way, we'd be in trouble right now.

I would perfer no one b*tch and moan but to say that the defense cant only the offense can is kind of foolish.

Why? Why should Suggs be penalized less for Grazing a QB's knee than blowing someone's knee out. You punish the action, not the outcome. If you don't penalize guys for diving at the knees and missing, they keep diving until they hit.

As I said twice in that post knees should definitely be protected but some of the other ones could use a little descretion. Do you think A.D. should have been called for one vs the Bills?

 

[TruthSeeker]

I don't think Ray was taking a shot at Brady. He was taking a shot at the rules. I didn't hear anything that was a shot at Brady. I think they have a healthy respect for each other.

If you make these statements right after losing a game in which you frankly state that there were questionable calls, it's called whining and sour grapes.

If you want to address the level of physicality allowed in the NFL and how it is enforced, you have to discuss it outside of the context of the last game which was a tough loss. In the context it was discussed, Ray Lewis' comments are meaningless.

Another possibility is to discuss this issue when it is your side that is the beneficiary of these calls and complain about how you got an unfair advantage because of the way the rules are enforced. Hey, when was the last time that happened?

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I would perfer no one b*tch and moan but to say that the defense cant only the offense can is kind of foolish.



As I said twice in that post knees should definitely be protected but some of the other ones could use a little descretion. Do you think A.D. should have been called for one vs the Bills?

sign

I really think this is a three topic discussion

Ray Ray is a whiner and needs to do Kotex commercials.

Should officials call approved rules.

Are the rules correct?

My guess most would think it's a little too restrictive.

 

[Synovia]

Do you think A.D. should have been called for one vs the Bills?

I think the whistle should have been blown before AD started his takedown. That was as clear a "in the grasp" play as I've ever seen. As the play ran though, yeah, he should have been called. He lifted the QB off the ground. The rule says thats a penalty.

 

[mayoclinic]

I think the whistle should have been blown before AD started his takedown. That was as clear a "in the grasp" play as I've ever seen. As the play ran though, yeah, he should have been called. He lifted the QB off the ground. The rule says thats a penalty.

Exactly right on both counts. Even though AD cradled the QB and didn't body slam him, it was a dumb play. But the play should have been blown dead. If the refs really want to protect the QB they would have blown the play dead. The problem is, the NFL wants to protect the QB but still allow for Rothlisberger-type miracle completions when he is in the grasp.

 

[olschool]

The main problem is, we all get to see the play in super slo-mo from many angles, after the fact, while the official has to make a snap decision from his single point of view. Officials often consult with each other, and sometimes pick up the flag. Every added or tweaked up rule just makes their job harder.
That's why the NFL is so reluctant to keep changing rules.

Rules will always be argued about, no matter what they are. It just depends on whether your team is on the receiving end or not, as to whether it's a good call.
I don't remember any Patriots fans complaining about the tuck rule, even if it is a lame rule. And years later, the rule is still there, so someone must think it's a good idea.

In the end, the game has become more violent than ever imagined,because the players are bigger than ever imagined.Too many players are being lost to injury, and the league is going to change it, whether we, or the players, like it or not.

 

[spacecrime]

no where did I say the knees shouldn't be protected.

You can't have it both ways. Either you think a QB's knees should be protected or you think they shouldn't. If you do, then a penalty for diving at a QB's knees, as SUggs did, is appropriate. The fact that Brady hopped sp he wasn't caught with his cleats in the turf is irrelevant. If Brady had lost an ACL you would be crying a different tune. You can't only call penalties when the dive results in a season-ending injury because that isn't protecting the QB at all. The defender dives at the knees, 15 yards. Simple as that.

The problem with Lewis and Harrison is they keep saying a QB should man up and take hits like they do.

When Ray Lewis says I will stand here with my arms up in the air and look the other way when an OG runs at me full speed and hits me in the back a few times (which is legal on a QB) and gets up and does it a few more times and says he will do it every week, then I will respect his opinion. Until then he is merely a coward wanting to hit players who are not in a position to defend themselves.

QBs take horrific legal hits, worse than anyone on the field. All the NFL is doing is protecting their heads and knees.

It is like PI. Don't arm bar a guy unless you expect a flag. Well, don't dive for a QB's knees or hit his head unless you expect to get a flag.

 

[Kontradiction]

Wow. Some of you should really start following ballet dancing as you have no clue what football is all about. The game is losing it's physicality. I'm all for the QBs knees being protected but that call on Ngata was ridiculous. If you're going to play that way, put a pink skirt on the quarterback and tell defenses not to hit him. Same thing about rules on the defense as well. The more the NFL continues to pull this crap, the more viewers it will lose.

 

[BradyFTW!]

I emphasis that they are on the defensive side of the ball b/c they are essentially on the attack at all times - Rodney and Ray get to run around the field and throw their bodies at people. At no time do Rodney or Ray Ray face the same threat, particularly to their knees, that a QB in the pocket planting their feet and throwing a ball does. It's not even close to comparable.

Well, there is the rule against chop blocks- instituted to protect defenders who are otherwise engaged, and in no position to protect their knees. Let's ask Rodney how he feels about that rule, and whether he think chop blocks should be 'just part of the game'. Actually, wait, we already know how Rodney feels about that:

Rodney Harrison: Titans, Kevin Mawae are 'Classless' -- NFL FanHouse

Harrison is angry about the knee injury he suffered in the season finale against the Titans, which forced him to miss the playoffs. Harrison says on that play, Titans receiver Bobby Wade intentionally dove into his knees while blocking him even though they were nowhere near the ball at the time

So basically, it's just part of the game as long as it's not his knees getting attacked.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

NFL for QBs views is starting to become Never Fear Lineman hitting you.

 

[signbabybrady]

You can't have it both ways. Either you think a QB's knees should be protected or you think they shouldn't. If you do, then a penalty for diving at a QB's knees, as SUggs did, is appropriate. The fact that Brady hopped sp he wasn't caught with his cleats in the turf is irrelevant. If Brady had lost an ACL you would be crying a different tune. You can't only call penalties when the dive results in a season-ending injury because that isn't protecting the QB at all. The defender dives at the knees, 15 yards. Simple as that.

The problem with Lewis and Harrison is they keep saying a QB should man up and take hits like they do.

When Ray Lewis says I will stand here with my arms up in the air and look the other way when an OG runs at me full speed and hits me in the back a few times (which is legal on a QB) and gets up and does it a few more times and says he will do it every week, then I will respect his opinion. Until then he is merely a coward wanting to hit players who are not in a position to defend themselves.

QBs take horrific legal hits, worse than anyone on the field. All the NFL is doing is protecting their heads and knees.

It is like PI. Don't arm bar a guy unless you expect a flag. Well, don't dive for a QB's knees or hit his head unless you expect to get a flag.

Oh but I can have it both ways since I was talking about different body parts. I totally agree that as other players on the field have their knees protected by rules the QB should too where I am saying the judgement should come in is on the blows to the head and the slamming QBs because you can incidently touch a QBs helmet or you can carefully pick a QB up and not slam him but if either happens right now its a penalty. In order to get a QB by the knees you have to go low no judgement needed. Basically what I am saying is that if a roughing the QB is to be called you should actually have to be rough with the QB and not just tap the helmet or flip him over you, there should be an aspect of excessive force.

I will fully admit there is a fine line here but from my point of view I don't want to see QBs getting hurt but I also think one of the funnest things about football is seeing a vicious hit (legal).

 

[alamo]

I believe the league will only get less violent in the coming years, specifically where it comes to anything affecting the head. The recent stories on PFT about studies into brain injury point to a future where noone will be able to deny that repeated head contact, even if short of concussion, causes long term health problems.

The league will have to change the rules for all players, even linemen, to limit jarring hits to the head. It will be a slow but inevitable process of change, and fans may scream now but will adapt. A beneficial side effect for the league is injuries in general should be lessened.

 

[Satchboogie3]

Oh but I can have it both ways since I was talking about different body parts. I totally agree that as other players on the field have their knees protected by rules the QB should too where I am saying the judgement should come in is on the blows to the head and the slamming QBs because you can incidently touch a QBs helmet or you can carefully pick a QB up and not slam him but if either happens right now its a penalty. In order to get a QB by the knees you have to go low no judgement needed. Basically what I am saying is that if a roughing the QB is to be called you should actually have to be rough with the QB and not just tap the helmet or flip him over you, there should be an aspect of excessive force.

I will fully admit there is a fine line here but from my point of view I don't want to see QBs getting hurt but I also think one of the funnest things about football is seeing a vicious hit (legal).

I think one of the reasons why they penalize ANY hit to the head is to help keep it in the defensive player's mind. With the way the rule is now, defensive players have to go out of their way to not hit a QB in the helmet, because of that, you see less injuries. If they changed the rule so that only "rough" hits to the head resulted in a penalty, you likely wouldn't see the focus of "never contact the helmet", thus you might see more injuries. Sure, I don't like see someone get a flag for brushing their hands against a helmet, but if it means less concussions, I'm all for it.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Honestly I think that Instead of throwing a flag for "going low" on the qb, the league should look over these hits and hand out fines to the players who do.

 

[upstater1]

The NFL is oriented to offense and specifically to the passing game. That's what produces big numbers, big ratings, big plays, and big stars like Manning, Brady and Brees. We didn't start it. In fact, we were victims of it when Polian and his Rules Committee made changes to prevent us from physically intimidating and beating up the Colts.

It's sometimes a fine line between physical and dirty play, and I can understand the need to protect players. But personally I prefer a bit more physical play on both sides of the ball. Highlights are fine, but it's not an NBA slam dunk contest, after all. The physical nature of the game is part of what makes football what it is.

I sympathize with defensive players feeling that the NFL is being overprotective. But to ignore the rules and try and play the way you used to when you know it's going to get called is stupid. The league instituted rules about blows to the head and the Brady rule, and they're going to call those things until someone changes the rules.

If they want to open up the passing game a little more, they could have probably done it by not instituting the new rules, and instead allowing chop blocks on Suggs. The corresponding lack of pressure from that would have opened up the passing game.

 

[JSn]

Honestly I think that Instead of throwing a flag for "going low" on the qb, the league should look over these hits and hand out fines to the players who do.

Terrible idea. There would then be bounties GALORE.

 

[BradyManny]

I'm all for the QBs knees being protected but that call on Ngata was ridiculous. If you're going to play that way, put a pink skirt on the quarterback and tell defenses not to hit him.

Come on, you added but nothing but cliches with no content or argument. You gotta call the rules as they are written - if the refs didn't do that, we don't make it to the AFCCG in 2001.

You can still lay out a hard hit without going for the knees or the head. Of all people, Brian Billick was on NFLN defending the rules, citing all the problems players are having in their retirement now with dementia, brain problems, etc. There's nothing macho about being an invalid for the rest of your life.