PatsFans.com Menu
PatsFans.com - The Hub For New England Patriots Fans

Harbaugh keeps using the word "DECEPTION" during his Press conference


Status
Not open for further replies.
Harbaugh is a whiner and as arrogant as his brother. He will never admit getting OUT COACHED. No humility.

John Harbaugh: 'New England Patriots are not ready for physical game'
By Simon Sinclair, Reporter
Filed: Saturday, January 10, 2015 at 19:12 UK
Last Updated: Sunday, January 11, 2015 at 16:24 UK
Baltimore Ravens head coach John Harbaugh believes that the New England Patriots are not ready for the physical challenge of his side in the divisional round of the AFC playoffs.

The Ravens outbattled the Pittsburgh Steelers to set up the match against Bill Belichick's men.

Harbaugh is quoted by NFL Network as saying: "The Patriots don't understand what kind of game they're about to get into."

Baltimore have beaten New England twice at Gillette Stadium in three post-season matches.

Woops. Looks like his boys were the ones that weren't ready for the show.
 
He's ineligible for a bubble screen unless it's a lateral. Vereen would have had to come back a long way for that to happen, since he started on the line of scrimmage and Brady starts in the backfield.

I thought his step back was just being smart, so there's 0% chance the crying ratbirds could accuse him of being downfield illegally.
The double pass to Edelman was a lateral.
Vereen could easily get back in time. I think that was plan a but the ravens put a man on him.
 
Not surprising, but Florio is really running this with his typical anti-Patriot agenda, and duplicitous method. Every couple of hours he writes a post with tabloid sensational headlines, implying another Patriot spygate like conspiracy. Then burying at the end of the article he covers his butt by adding something to the effect of, "but it's probably legal and the Pats were just being smart,"

The is a word for some someone who instigates issues when he knows there are none. I can't quite get it. Maybe someone can help.
Actually, he was one of the first out of the gate with it's legality.
 
By throwing that word "deception" out there, now the national media is all over the "Patriots cheated again". For a Super Bowl winning coach like Harbaugh to throw that out there as an excuse for losing is deception on his part. He is deceiving the media on focusing blame for his teams loss off where the focus should be. Blowing two 14 point leads.
He had (in his words) the "best QB in the game", he had the ball, he had 5 minutes left and he had two timeouts to drive and score and win the game. They couldn't do it. And why they couldn't do that (Patriots defense) is what the national media should be talking about, not a few plays in the middle of the game.
It's pretty clear that he's doing this deliberately to avoid having to admit he was outcoached on that play.
 
I apologize for saying you made it up. The writer who wrote the piece made it up. I objected to it because I'd like it if we won with a bit of class, unlike some of the other festering sewers other teams forums are (jetsinsiders, I'm looking at you). Harbaugh is a douche and he was clearly trying to make it seem as though the Pats had pulled some sort of cheap trick. But he never said they did anything illegal, in fact, he was pretty explicit that it was within the rules.

Not sure what other accusations I've been quick on.
You were quick to accuse me of making that up.
Okay, so what did Harbaugh actually say? Here is another writer. I did not see the post game interview so I can't say.

"The Ravens were getting a big pass rush much of the game up until that point, so the Patriots took this strange strategy of taking an offensive lineman off the field. But Harbaugh cried foul, saying the Patriots should have been penalized for their "deceptive" formations and substitutions.

"It's not something that anybody has ever done before," Harbaugh said. "They're an illegal type of a thing and I'm sure that [the NFL will] make some adjustments and things like that."
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...ots-ran--illegal--plays-in-win-031722873.html
 
Oh for ****'s sake. Vinovich pointed at Vereen and they announced it over the loudspeaker. Harbaugh needs to blow the sand out of his vagina.
 
I think this topic will last until NFL committee make changes, if any for the 2015 season.
But, this ESPN article points to the specific "condition" that is in question.
Note the phrase "how long is enough time"?

ESPN - Jan 11 1:15pmEST:

The Patriots' scheme was legal, even if it pushed the envelope on the NFL's attempt to legislate substitution deception out of the game. Vinovich followed protocol, which gives him discretion on how much time to allow a defense to react to substitutions. Ravens coach John Harbaugh erred by not calling a timeout to give his defensive players their assignments. Finally, it's likely that the NFL's competition committee will at least review the Patriots' formation this offseason to ensure it complied with the NFL's sportsmanship code.

Now let's take a step back and review what happened, with the help of the NFL rulebook and common sense.

On three plays in the second possession of the second half, the Patriots removed an offensive lineman and replaced him with a player who was wearing the number of an eligible receiver. On the first instance, for example, right guard Josh Kline left the field and running back Shane Vereen -- who wears No. 34 -- replaced him.

As required by rule Rule 5, Section 3, Article 1, Vereen reported himself ineligible to Vinovich and lined up in the slot to the right of the formation. The Patriots' line included only four offensive linemen, but it was a legal formation because it included five ineligible receivers. (The rule doesn't require Vereen to be tight to the line.)

Vinovich announced to the Ravens' defense that Vereen was ineligible, as required by the same rule. According to ESPN Patriots reporter Mike Reiss, within the stadium Vinovich could even be heard to tell the Ravens defense not to cover him. At the snap, Vereen ran into the backfield as if he was going to catch a lateral pass; in truth, his "route" was a decoy.

Understandably confused, the Ravens still covered Vereen and left open tight end Michael Hoomanawanui, who caught a 16-yard pass.

After the second such instance, Harbaugh ran onto the field and took an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty, he said later, so that he could implore Vinovich to provide the Ravens more time to adjust to the unconventional ineligible receiver. Harbaugh appeared to be referencing Rule 5, Section 2, Article 10, which begins:

"If a substitution is made by the offense, the offense shall not be permitted to snap the ball until the defense has been permitted to respond with its substitutions. While in the process of a substitution [or simulated substitution], the offense is prohibited from rushing quickly to the line of scrimmage and snapping the ball in an obvious attempt to cause a defensive foul [i.e., too many men on the field]."

The rule further calls for the umpire to stand over the ball until the referee has determined "that the defense has had a reasonable time to complete its substitutions."

This rule originated from the NFL's disapproval of "deceptive" substitution patterns. It wants to avoid strategies that quickly assemble a formation via new players and snap the ball before the defense can match up appropriately.

Did Vinovich give the Ravens enough time to react to a formation that put an ineligible receiver in the slot? Via the TV copy of the game, I counted roughly 10 seconds between the time of the first substitute and the snap. Was that enough time? Should Vinovich have instructed the umpire to stand over the ball while the Ravens identified, adjusted and possibly substituted?

Former NFL referee Jim Daopoulos, speaking Sunday morning on "SportsCenter," said anything longer would have effectively worked as a disadvantage to the Patriots.
 
You were quick to accuse me of making that up.
Okay, so what did Harbaugh actually say? Here is another writer. I did not see the post game interview so I can't say.

"The Ravens were getting a big pass rush much of the game up until that point, so the Patriots took this strange strategy of taking an offensive lineman off the field. But Harbaugh cried foul, saying the Patriots should have been penalized for their "deceptive" formations and substitutions.

"It's not something that anybody has ever done before," Harbaugh said. "They're an illegal type of a thing and I'm sure that [the NFL will] make some adjustments and things like that."
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nfl-s...ots-ran--illegal--plays-in-win-031722873.html
I said before. In fact, if you go back earlier in the thread, I posted exactly what Harbaugh said taken directly from the presser video. He didn't use the word illegal. Likely because he knew it /wasn't/ illegal. The word illegal seems to have stemmed entirely from that one story that you originally linked to where Harbaugh was misquoted.

Here's what he actually said in that sentence, taken from the video:

"Normally you get a chance to make some substitutions and things like that it's not something that anybody's done before. The league will look at that type of thing and make some adjustments and things like that."

I'm not particularly interested in defending Harbaugh. He's clearly trying to deflect attention from the fact that he got outcoached.
 
I think this topic will last until NFL committee make changes, if any for the 2015 season.
But, this ESPN article points to the specific "condition" that is in question.
Note the phrase "how long is enough time"?

ESPN - Jan 11 1:15pmEST:

The Patriots' scheme was legal, even if it pushed the envelope on the NFL's attempt to legislate substitution deception out of the game. Vinovich followed protocol, which gives him discretion on how much time to allow a defense to react to substitutions. Ravens coach John Harbaugh erred by not calling a timeout to give his defensive players their assignments. Finally, it's likely that the NFL's competition committee will at least review the Patriots' formation this offseason to ensure it complied with the NFL's sportsmanship code.

Now let's take a step back and review what happened, with the help of the NFL rulebook and common sense.

On three plays in the second possession of the second half, the Patriots removed an offensive lineman and replaced him with a player who was wearing the number of an eligible receiver. On the first instance, for example, right guard Josh Kline left the field and running back Shane Vereen -- who wears No. 34 -- replaced him.

As required by rule Rule 5, Section 3, Article 1, Vereen reported himself ineligible to Vinovich and lined up in the slot to the right of the formation. The Patriots' line included only four offensive linemen, but it was a legal formation because it included five ineligible receivers. (The rule doesn't require Vereen to be tight to the line.)

Vinovich announced to the Ravens' defense that Vereen was ineligible, as required by the same rule. According to ESPN Patriots reporter Mike Reiss, within the stadium Vinovich could even be heard to tell the Ravens defense not to cover him. At the snap, Vereen ran into the backfield as if he was going to catch a lateral pass; in truth, his "route" was a decoy.

Understandably confused, the Ravens still covered Vereen and left open tight end Michael Hoomanawanui, who caught a 16-yard pass.

After the second such instance, Harbaugh ran onto the field and took an unsportsmanlike conduct penalty, he said later, so that he could implore Vinovich to provide the Ravens more time to adjust to the unconventional ineligible receiver. Harbaugh appeared to be referencing Rule 5, Section 2, Article 10, which begins:

"If a substitution is made by the offense, the offense shall not be permitted to snap the ball until the defense has been permitted to respond with its substitutions. While in the process of a substitution [or simulated substitution], the offense is prohibited from rushing quickly to the line of scrimmage and snapping the ball in an obvious attempt to cause a defensive foul [i.e., too many men on the field]."

The rule further calls for the umpire to stand over the ball until the referee has determined "that the defense has had a reasonable time to complete its substitutions."

This rule originated from the NFL's disapproval of "deceptive" substitution patterns. It wants to avoid strategies that quickly assemble a formation via new players and snap the ball before the defense can match up appropriately.

Did Vinovich give the Ravens enough time to react to a formation that put an ineligible receiver in the slot? Via the TV copy of the game, I counted roughly 10 seconds between the time of the first substitute and the snap. Was that enough time? Should Vinovich have instructed the umpire to stand over the ball while the Ravens identified, adjusted and possibly substituted?

Former NFL referee Jim Daopoulos, speaking Sunday morning on "SportsCenter," said anything longer would have effectively worked as a disadvantage to the Patriots.
The rule is fine. 10s is plenty. Harbaugh wasn't prepared for the formation. No reasonable amount of time would have made up for that.

I guarantee if he'd come up with this strategy he would be complaining that the officials caused a delay hindering his offense. His schtick has and always will be to consistently cross the line and scream constantly about officiating.
 
SHOCKING NEWS!!! The NY Post/Jet propaganda paper agrees with Harbaugh...

111.jpg
 
You would think after ray rice lied to him, and then he in turn lied to the nfl, that Harbaugh would be used to a little deception.

"I liked ray rice a lot before... I like him a lot today"

Ravens are a classy bunch
 
Quick someone get him a "Wamburger"

God I can't stand either Harbaugh, easily the worst NFL siblings next to "Goober and Gomer".....piss and moan to Roger until they change the rules every time the big bad Patriots beat 'em
 
I like John, his reaction surprised me a bit, he acted like his brother, which isn't the norm for him. He's usually pretty level headed and respectable (again, outside of this subject).

Again, hate the Raven's but John Harbaugh has always been towards the top of the most likeable NFL coaches until now.
 
I'd give the guy a break. He was being humiliated on national tv. A lot of the posts (overreaction) in the game day thread when the pats are losing are way worse. Lol.
 
  • Agree
Reactions: PP2
Again, hate the Raven's but John Harbaugh has always been towards the top of the most likeable NFL coaches until now.

Likeable like that time when he tried to pick a fight with the chain gang and called them cheaters? John is a complete azzhole DB (which means he fits in wonderfully as the coach of that team). Just not quite as bad as his insane brother.
 
I like John, his reaction surprised me a bit, he acted like his brother, which isn't the norm for him. He's usually pretty level headed and respectable (again, outside of this subject).

Again, hate the Raven's but John Harbaugh has always been towards the top of the most likeable NFL coaches until now.
I agree. I thought Jim was the jerazoid.

I was wrong thinking Hernandez was OK too.

Not the first time I was wrong. Will not be the last. Wasn't even the worst.

Learning experience, and shocked but,.... Movin' on.
 
Brady was not pleased with Harbaugh's Claims of Patriots 'Deception'


tom%20brady%20pats%20ravens.jpg


"Ravens head coach John Harbaugh was not pleased with what he called “deception” on the part of the Patriots following New England’s 35-31 win over Baltimore in Saturday’s divisional playoff."

http://www.boston.com/sports/footba...dismisses_john_harbaughs_claims_of_patri.html

Patriots quarterback Tom Brady didn’t see the big deal.

“Who knows. Maybe those guys gotta study the rule book and figure it out,” Brady said. “We obviously knew what we were doing and we made some pretty important plays. It was a real good weapon for us. Maybe we’ll have something in store next week.”

Brady said he didn’t understand where Harbaugh was getting so deceived. “They should figure it out,” he said.

That seems to be something Harbaugh might still be struggling with.​
 
I just realized another lie that Harbaugh spewed at his press conference.

He said that the refs were confused about it/didn't know what to do.

That's total BS. It is standard practice that before a game each team will go over with the officials (or at least the ref) any trick plays/formations/etc. they are thinking about using. Teams do this in order to avoid an unaware official being taken off-guard and accidentally flagging a legal play.

So I'm virtually sure that Vinovich knew all about what NE was doing. He just didn't know when or if NE was going to break it out. But when Hooman or Vereen reported in as ineligible, he knew what was going on.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.


Friday Patriots Notebook 5/3: News and Notes
Thursday Patriots Notebook 5/2: News and Notes
Wednesday Patriots Notebook 5/1: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Jerod Mayo’s Appearance on WEEI On Monday
Tuesday Patriots Notebook 4/30: News and Notes
TRANSCRIPT: Drake Maye’s Interview on WEEI on Jones & Mego with Arcand
MORSE: Rookie Camp Invitees and Draft Notes
Patriots Get Extension Done with Barmore
Monday Patriots Notebook 4/29: News and Notes
Patriots News 4-28, Draft Notes On Every Draft Pick
Back
Top