2017 Training Camp - Day 4 (7/30/17)

[BaconGrundleCandy]

Bedard noted that Lawrence Guy had another great day vs. the run & pushing the pocket. He was one of his 3 Up. That'd be sick if we found an Akiem Hicks type.



Obviously fans want pass rush from the edge, but a defense such as the 2010 Jets/2015 Broncos vs. the Pats that was rush 3 and drop 8 with an elite secondary could end a lot of offenses.

Like this team as a whole people won't know how special it is until he hits the field in love action.

Guy is a Patriot Type Player 100%

He knows he has to play different positions and prides himself on it. 1, 5, 3, 0 tech etc it doesn't matter. He understands his role in order to make it in this league and tries to max out everything he does.

Inside in 4 fronts and outside in 3.

Super excited for this guy.

 

[Mack Herron]

Strengths
Will not be outworked in practice. Mentally tough and extremely resilient overcoming obstacles from junior high up to college. Consistent in his play speed in and out of his breaks. Uses burst and above average routes to uncover against man and twitch-to-field awareness to open windows against zone. Able to sell complex routes and makes them work for him. Makes contested catches he has no business making and plays with great feet near the sideline. The more you watch, the more you like. High school quarterback and point guard with leadership traits. Has strong, supportive parents.
Weaknesses
Expected to measure at under 5-foot-10. Doesn't have the length to protect the ball against intrusive, tight coverage. Willing blocker but teams may not trust the size. Quick, but lacks a top gear. Scouts believe he might be limited as a short-area slot target only. Used as jet-back but didn't show enough wiggle to be a consistent threat. Low throws give him some trouble.

2016 NFL Draft Profile: K.J. Maye

 

[Tony2046]

Only 77%?! Well, he's no Ryan Mallett, that's for damn sure.

I think he was joking or at least I thought so.

 

[Wheelman]

This is an offense driven league. Just like "chicks dig the long ball" in baseball, fans dig the long pass in football. But they did cheer Gilmore breaking up a pass in a vid the other day.

Sounds like a bunch of fantasy football fans!

 

[Tony2046]

Bedard noted that Lawrence Guy had another great day vs. the run & pushing the pocket. He was one of his 3 Up. That'd be sick if we found an Akiem Hicks type.



Obviously fans want pass rush from the edge, but a defense such as the 2010 Jets/2015 Broncos vs. the Pats that was rush 3 and drop 8 with an elite secondary could end a lot of offenses.

Great point. An elite secondary could create coverage sacks/pressure. Giving the big guys up front a little more time to get to the QB can make a lot of difference.

What's the difference between a good pass rusher and a great pass rusher? Getting to the QB a second faster? If so this secondary could make a good pass rusher look great.

Or is that wishful thinking?

 

[Tony2046]

2016 NFL Draft Profile: K.J. Maye

Was this the guy wearing 16 today?

 

[maineman209]

I think he was joking or at least I thought so.

I'm fairly certain that I was joking.

 

[Tony2046]

I'm fairly certain that I was joking.

Wow. I can't believe I missed that.

 

[maineman209]

Was this the guy wearing 16 today?

Apparently.

Maye was UDFA in 2016, signed originally by the Giants. Cut at the end of TC, he was signed at the end of December by TEN to their PS. TEN cut him in May, and he's been with Edmonton since.

Maye is 5081/191 and not a spectacular athlete. Camp body.

 

[maineman209]

Wow. I can't believe I missed that.

No worries. I nearly missed it myself.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Using BB's usual approach, I can see him trading for a pass rush specialist to augment the DEs. But only after he determines that the rookies are too raw; and the present veterans are falling short.

BB's MO is to sign FAs that are fits and bargains, build in the Draft, trade to close possible holes. So that there is at least two at least adequate possibilities everywhere.

Only then does he trade and pay for a usually experienced veteran short termer, to ensure there is no glaring exploitable hole anywhere on the Team. He wants an adequate player or two, everywhere there is a starting position.

 

[Mack Herron]

Was this the guy wearing 16 today?

Would appear to be.

 

[maineman209]

Using BB's usual approach, I can see him trading for a pass rush specialist to augment the DEs. But only after he determines that the rookies are too raw; and the present veterans are falling short.

BB's MO is to sign FAs that are fits and bargains, build in the Draft, trade to close possible holes. So that there is at least two at least adequate possibilities everywhere.

Only then does he trade and pay for a usually experienced veteran short termer, to ensure there is no glaring exploitable hole anywhere on the Team. He wants an adequate player or two, everywhere there is a starting position.

Agree about the approach and the process. I don't think he's there yet, though.

I strongly suspect that Nink didn't leave BB or Kraft in the dark about his thoughts for very long. He may even have spoken with them at the end of last season. If that's the case, BB already had a contingency plan in place for this moment.

I'm actually not sure that the pass-rush is all that short-staffed, even now.

 

[captain stone]

I'm actually not sure that the pass-rush is all that short-staffed, even now.

Surely you can't be serious.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Great point. An elite secondary could create coverage sacks/pressure. Giving the big guys up front a little more time to get to the QB can make a lot of difference.

What's the difference between a good pass rusher and a great pass rusher? Getting to the QB a second faster? If so this secondary could make a good pass rusher look great.

Or is that wishful thinking?

I remember quite a few coverage sacks in 2014, including in the SB against SEA. Wilson didn't complete his first pass until 5:41 or so in the second quarter. I wonder if this year's secondary is going to end up being better than the one in 2014 overall.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Every single times I see Cooks running a route . . . it just gets me so hyped. I can't wait to see this man when the games count.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Coverage - especially disguised/unexpected coverages - plus pressure up the middle that deforms the pocket and leaves QBs with no "escape square" is what allows the edge guys to get home these days. Pure pass-rushing edge guys who can consistently get home on their own are rare and expensive and - if you have the first two things - you don't really need them. Better to have guys who can set the edge, defend against the run, drop into coverage and get pressure on the rush when the time is right.

I hear you, maineman. I'm not disagreeing with you, but this is one of those things that is easier in theory than in practice. I think the Pats have been trying to accomplish this very thing for years, and it's hard. Finding guys who can consistently push the pocket can prove to be just as difficult and rare as a Von Miller type on the edge. They felt they had it with Haynesworth, but he was a sad sack of sh*t. Malcolm Brown showed some of it his rookie season but not so much last season. Really, the best thing today is to have four guys who can all bring a unique skill set to get to the passer. The Giants of 2007 are a really good example. But that's probably the hardest of all to do.

I think the Pats have a unique mix in the front seven and I don't know if we'll see the same struggles to generate pressure. The secondary is also going to be very very good, and that will help too. High may be used more on the edge, but he is so good rushing that A-Gap. I expect a lot of movement pre-snap and disguising. The D will be very good.

 

[maineman209]

Surely you can't be serious.

Why, yes, I am being serious.

And don't call me Surely.

 

[Tony2046]

Every single times I see Cooks running a route . . . it just gets me so hyped. I can't wait to see this man when the games count.

I've watched a lot of his last season film. He can stretch the field and he has good hands. But, from the film I've seen so far, he can get occasionally stuffed at the line of scrimmage which I expect will improve this season. But even if that stays the same he is still a speedy threat that can score from anywhere on the field which still should, imo, force the defense to adjust for him and that alone frees up Edelman and crew to do their stuff.

So he may not light up the field every game but because he's on the field someone will.

That's my really novice opinion btw.

Side note: Having Edelman on the field should help him too. It will definitely be fun to watch.

 

[PatsBoy12]

I've watched a lot of his last season film. He can stretch the field and he has good hands. But, from the film I've seen so far, he can get occasionally stuffed at the line of scrimmage which I expect will improve this season. But even if that stays the same he is still a speedy threat that can score from anywhere on the field which still should, imo, force the defense to adjust for him and that alone frees up Edelman and crew to do their stuff.

So he may not light up the field every game but because he's on the field someone will.

That's my really novice opinion btw.

Side note: Having Edelman on the field should help him too. It will definitely be fun to watch.

As Rodney said, "You can't double everybody."