Manziel and the Patriots

[SammyBlueCat]

Please leave racist stereotypes about size out of this.

Wait, I’m confused. A “short” leash for a “huge” if?

No racism stated or implied. He may be brought into camp if the draft does not produce a satisfactory QB. Otherwise we are on to next year.

 

[Clonamery]

No racism stated or implied. He may be brought into camp if the draft does not produce a satisfactory QB. Otherwise we are on to next year.

Clever kitty, you’re not dealing with some mice to be toyed with and “on to next year.” Now, stop ****yfooting and tell us what you really think.

 

[Vindicate]

First alcohol abuse is at least 100 times bigger problem than marijuana abuse.

Second if a player basically walks away from his career over not accepting he has a problem then we can talk.

Finally I see no problem with seeing if Manziel has actually admitted his problem and taken steps to never get back their. If he's convincing in being serious about it and you still think his skills are worth the risk then kicking the tires is OK by me.

Just to be clear, the guy has been saying he needs to "change things in his life" since 2012. His father said some cold words about him to ESPN in 2016 - "He's a druggie. It's not a secret that he's a druggie. Hopefully, he doesn't die before he comes to his senses. I mean, I hate to say it, but I hope he goes to jail. I mean, that would be the best place for him. I'm doing my job, and I'm going to move on. If I have to bury him, I'll bury him."

I dunno, I can only assume what growing up in a household would be like with a father who'd say that - to a national news outlet, none the less.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Clever kitty, you’re not dealing with some mice to be toyed with and “on to next year.” Now, stop ****yfooting and tell us what you really think.

Evaluating players to determine if they are Cat like quick is demanding work.

 

[fnordcircle]

No racism stated or implied. He may be brought into camp if the draft does not produce a satisfactory QB. Otherwise we are on to next year.

I'm just tired of hearing about how white guys have small leashes.

 

[mgteich]

Right

So folks think that Harmon has never broken the law before, and that this is the first time that he has carried weed on a plane.

So, using an illegal drug in violation of his contract isn't an issue in violation. Carrying drugs across state lines isn't an issue. Getting caught is an issue. And that sometimes is an issue, only if the player gets caught twice, and THEN he is a problem child [for getting caught twice make a player more likely to punished by the league].

Yeah, because everyone is saying Gordon's issues are nbd since it's not drinking.

Complete misrepresentation of Harmon vs Manziel. If Harmon becomes a repeat offender everyone here will be just as quick to label him a problem child as they were with Manziel.

 

[fnordcircle]

Right

So folks think that Harmon has never broken the law before, and that this is the first time that he has carried weed on a plane.

So we're supposed to work suspicions into the equation now?

The weed isn't the deal. Manziel being drunk isn't the deal. It's repeat offenses and a pattern of bad decisions that put the team in a bad position as well as highlight a lack of priority.

Nobody who isn't insane cares if Manziel was doing some lines of blow or drinking one time. It's that he has shown that he has dysfunction/addiction that has was so bad he sabotaged his career.

So yeah, if you're gonna extrapolate from one incident with a substance that the majority of Americans if not the world has come to realize isn't the big bad we were taught that Harmon is part of a drug ring or something, then I guess there's no reasoning with you on it.

For what it's worth, I'd love to see what Manziel could do for the Patriots, but I agree with @SammyBlueCat 's comment that he'd be on a short penis.

 

[mgteich]

Where we differ is that for me, using illegal drugs in violation of contract is an issue. (no one cares what a player did before he came here)> For you, it seems, what matters is getting caught twice.

So we're supposed to work suspicions into the equation now?

The weed isn't the deal. Manziel being drunk isn't the deal. It's repeat offenses and a pattern of bad decisions that put the team in a bad position as well as highlight a lack of priority.

Nobody who isn't insane cares if Manziel was doing some lines of blow or drinking one time. It's that he has shown that he has dysfunction/addiction that has was so bad he sabotaged his career.

So yeah, if you're gonna extrapolate from one incident with a substance that the majority of Americans if not the world has come to realize isn't the big bad we were taught that Harmon is part of a drug ring or something, then I guess there's no reasoning with you on it.

For what it's worth, I'd love to see what Manziel could do for the Patriots, but I agree with @SammyBlueCat 's comment that he'd be on a short penis.

 

[Clonamery]

I'm just tired of hearing about how white guys have small leashes.

That’s a huge if white guys have small leashes.

 

[primetime]

Where we differ is that for me, using illegal drugs in violation of contract is an issue. (no one cares what a player did before he came here)> For you, it seems, what matters is getting caught twice.

It's a violation of league rules. I doubt it's mentioned in his personal employment contract.

 

[mgteich]

It's a violation of league rules. I doubt it's mentioned in his personal employment contract.

I'd be shocked if complying with league rules isn't in the personal employment contracts.

I expect that players also have to agree to comply with union rules.

 

[primetime]

I'd be shocked if complying with league rules isn't in the personal employment contracts.

I expect that players also have to agree to comply with union rules.

"Union rules" and "league rules" are the same thing, for what it's worth (except insofar as it refers to union bylaws, which this doesn't have anything to do with). They're collectively bargained, so the league's area of purview is set through bargaining (i.e. they must bargain for the right to make rules in a specific area).

There's generally a vague "personal conduct" clause in NFL player contracts but since such contracts are at-will it doesn't really matter at all. Player contracts normally specify that "during the period any salary cap is legally in effect, this contract may be terminated if, in Club’s opinion, Player is anticipated to make less of a contribution to Club’s ability to compete on the playing field than another player or players who Club intends to sign or attempts to sign, or another player or players who is or are already on Club’s roster, and for whom Club needs room."

In other words, the team can cut a player at any time, regardless of whether they were smoking weed or just not good enough. You might argue that a player shouldn't do anything that would make a team more likely to cut him, but that also includes missing a tackle. Appeals to "contract violations" are absurd when the employer has all the power. You can just admit you just don't like guys smoking weed.

 

[Froob]

So we're supposed to work suspicions into the equation now?

The weed isn't the deal. Manziel being drunk isn't the deal. It's repeat offenses and a pattern of bad decisions that put the team in a bad position as well as highlight a lack of priority.

Nobody who isn't insane cares if Manziel was doing some lines of blow or drinking one time. It's that he has shown that he has dysfunction/addiction that has was so bad he sabotaged his career.

So yeah, if you're gonna extrapolate from one incident with a substance that the majority of Americans if not the world has come to realize isn't the big bad we were taught that Harmon is part of a drug ring or something, then I guess there's no reasoning with you on it.

For what it's worth, I'd love to see what Manziel could do for the Patriots, but I agree with @SammyBlueCat 's comment that he'd be on a short penis.

It’s not about the weed, the alcohol, the bad attitude, the repeated incidents, the police run ins, it’s about the cover up.

 

[fnordcircle]

It’s not about the weed, the alcohol, the bad attitude, the repeated incidents, the police run ins, it’s about the cover up.

But Manziel's emails!

 

[Kontradiction]

It’s not about the weed, the alcohol, the bad attitude, the repeated incidents, the police run ins, it’s about the cover up.

There’s enough evidence to take this before the Supreme Court IMO.

 

[Froob]

There’s enough evidence to take this before the Supreme Court IMO.

Bernie could still win IMO.

 

[fnordcircle]

Bernie could still win IMO.

RNC screwed Ron Paul, but if we pool all our dogecoin we can hire a lawyer and right this wrong.

 

[Clonamery]

RNC screwed Ron Paul, but if we pool all our dogecoin we can hire a lawyer and right this wrong.

A whole lot of hooha for a pile of dead leaves (ie, Manziel).

 

[mgteich]

I agree that the teams have all the power.

The players need to rely on their union and the rules that the union negotiates.
I believe that the use of controlled substances is against those rules. There is a setoff prescribed penalties.

But, yes, employees are at will, and can be fired for no reason at all.

I don't see how that somehow justifies a player who chooses to violate local, state and federal laws. As I said before, if Harmon were a bottom of the roster player, he'd be fired.


primetime, post: 5289370, member: 3645"]"Union rules" and "league rules" are the same thing, for what it's worth (except insofar as it refers to union bylaws, which this doesn't have anything to do with). They're collectively bargained, so the league's area of purview is set through bargaining (i.e. they must bargain for the right to make rules in a specific area).

There's generally a vague "personal conduct" clause in NFL player contracts but since such contracts are at-will it doesn't really matter at all. Player contracts normally specify that "during the period any salary cap is legally in effect, this contract may be terminated if, in Club’s opinion, Player is anticipated to make less of a contribution to Club’s ability to compete on the playing field than another player or players who Club intends to sign or attempts to sign, or another player or players who is or are already on Club’s roster, and for whom Club needs room."

In other words, the team can cut a player at any time, regardless of whether they were smoking weed or just not good enough. You might argue that a player shouldn't do anything that would make a team more likely to cut him, but that also includes missing a tackle. Appeals to "contract violations" are absurd when the employer has all the power. You can just admit you just don't like guys smoking weed.[/QUOTE]

 

[DW Toys]

Right

So folks think that Harmon has never broken the law before, and that this is the first time that he has carried weed on a plane.

So, using an illegal drug in violation of his contract isn't an issue in violation. Carrying drugs across state lines isn't an issue. Getting caught is an issue. And that sometimes is an issue, only if the player gets caught twice, and THEN he is a problem child [for getting caught twice make a player more likely to punished by the league].

Agree, So the message is that addicts like Snoop Dog Harmon, and you have to be an addict to pull that crap, their transgressions are just brushed off? . Like it or not, he's a stoner. The worse part is he is a Team captain.
If I am GM he is cut.
Don't give me crap about it's not a Drug. Too many things close to me to just sit still while stoners tell me the old alcohol versus smocking dope crap.
If the black players (or white) need to cry out that this isn't fair, I'll tell them about it for real.
We certainly can find a non stoner to take his place.
DW Toys