Would you trade for Josh Gordon?

[groganbootleg]

Knowing that the Browns might like Mallett what are the odds of a Mallett to Browns for Gordon/Hoyer plus a pick back to the Pats?

 

[Deus Irae]

During the BB era, we have seen a few (very few) WR rookies have a full TC and get it - - Branch and Edelman, with Givens being a delayed "get it".

We have NEVER seen a veteran WR come in mid season and "get it" during that season. Doug Gabriel had one or two good games right off the bat, but then faded out quickly.

In the past 13 years, there just is no precedent.

And a list of those players brought in during the mid-season makes it pretty obvious why that is. However, it also ignores Gaffney, who clicked in the 2006 postseason. You can do that, if you stick with "regular season" as your metric, but not if you look at the playoffs as well.

 

[shmessy]

And a list of those players brought in during the mid-season makes it pretty obvious why that is. However, it also ignores Gaffney, who clicked in the 2006 postseason. You can do that, if you stick with "regular season" as your metric, but not if you look at the playoffs as well.

That's a very valid point.

So, no veteran WR ever brought into the Patriots system in mid-season ever did well in the regular season, but one had two very good games in one postseason.

What are the odds that a Josh Gordon will be a better option in January/February than a Dobson/Thompkins by that same time with a full TC and 16+ games under their belt?

My opinion, and it's only an opinion, is that he wouldn't be a better option by that time. If he came in before TC, that would be a different possibility.

 

[Ozymandias]

Define out of the league.

When said player openly acknowledges that he's on his last chance opportunity to stay in the league.

Josh Gordon says he?s on his ?last chance opportunity? | ProFootballTalk

Honestly I don't have a ton of knowledge about Gordon's history, I knew he had some red flag's I didn't know they were as severe they've been explained in here. Given that I tend to to agree it is likely best we stay away.

I look at Gordon in the same light as I do Da'Rick Rogers. Obviously both are talented but major headcases. The Patriots weren't even interested in claiming a similarly talented WR in Rogers off waivers for nothing. In that sense, I can't see any scenario that they'd even consider trading away draft capital for Gordon.

He's not worth the trouble.

 

[strngplyr]

Knowing that the Browns might like Mallett what are the odds of a Mallett to Browns for Gordon/Hoyer plus a pick back to the Pats?

About 0%. :bricks:

 

[Matt991]

If Gordon can understand the playbook than yes I would if I could have him for a third or a fourth.

I think popular opinion around the league is that the guy is a head case and is not too focused on football.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Yes---definitely, without a doubt.

I'm 100% on board with this idea, although I doubt the Browns would be.

Well if they gave up Richardson for a mid-late 1st, we should be able to get to get Jordan for a 2nd.

As for Josh Gordon. Yes, very risky acquisition, it would have to be a mid to late round pick. But we do need reinforcements. Don't even know if he's on the trading block, the guy did just get back from suspension.

 

[jmt57]

What is Cleveland's incentive for trading Gordon?

Just because they traded Richardson, I would not assume they are going to trade every other player on their team that they possibly can as well.

This isn't like the NBA where teams trade a player to get out from under a bad contract. And this isn't like MLB where teams trade a player to get something/anything for him, since Gordon is not going to become a free agent next year.

The Browns felt that trading Richardson was worth it because of the compensation that they received in return, a first round draft pick.

From their perspective it's not worth it to trade a talented WR that is under contract for the next three years for just a 4th or 5th round pick.

If somebody was to offer the Browns another first round pick for Gordon, I'm guessing that they would jump at that opportunity.

However, for the reasons that Sciz presented back in post #6, that makes little sense for the Patriots to do.

 

[JoeSixPat]

One WOULD think the Browns may be having a Fire Sale soon

Arrested Development - Fire Sale (Read-Along Script) - YouTube

 

[Avenger]

I'd rather TJ Ward

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Would you trade for Josh Gordon?

I look at Gordon in the same light as I do Da'Rick Rogers. Obviously both are talented but major headcases. The Patriots weren't even interested in claiming a similarly talented WR in Rogers off waivers for nothing. In that sense, I can't see any scenario that they'd even consider trading away draft capital for Gordon.

He's not worth the trouble.

I agree with him probably not being worth the trouble but Gordon has proven capable of playing in the NFL at a high level, he had 50 receptions for 805 receiving yards and 5 touchdowns as a rookie playing with a below average quarterback. Gordon was also taken in the second round of the supplemental draft and Rogers wasn't even drafted in 7 rounds the standard draft.

Gordon is a much more talented and proven player, it is a shame he is a headcase because he has the talent to be a top five wide receiver.

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Would you trade for Josh Gordon?

What is Cleveland's incentive for trading Gordon?

Just because they traded Richardson, I would not assume they are going to trade every other player on their team that they possibly can as well.

This isn't like the NBA where teams trade a player to get out from under a bad contract. And this isn't like MLB where teams trade a player to get something/anything for him, since Gordon is not going to become a free agent next year.

The Browns felt that trading Richardson was worth it because of the compensation that they received in return, a first round draft pick.

From their perspective it's not worth it to trade a talented WR that is under contract for the next three years for just a 4th or 5th round pick.

If somebody was to offer the Browns another first round pick for Gordon, I'm guessing that they would jump at that opportunity.

However, for the reasons that Sciz presented back in post #6, that makes little sense for the Patriots to do.

There is some speculation that the Richardson trade was motivated by Haslams financial troubles.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeoza...-of-haslams-legal-problems-at-pilot-flying-j/

 

[Deus Irae]

What is Cleveland's incentive for trading Gordon?

Just because they traded Richardson, I would not assume they are going to trade every other player on their team that they possibly can as well...

What makes the most sense in the interim could be even more trades. During a separate appearance on PFT Live, Tony Grossi of ESPN Cleveland suggested that other players acquired before Jimmy Haslam bought the team could be available, including receiver Josh Gordon, receiver Greg Little, and left tackle Joe Thomas.

Thomas acknowledged that to Mike Silver of NFL Network, saying that everyone is currently on the trading block.

Banner calls speculation regarding quarterback pursuit ?well founded? | ProFootballTalk

 

[Brady6]

Re: Re: Would you trade for Josh Gordon?

That's a very valid point.

So, no veteran WR ever brought into the Patriots system in mid-season ever did well in the regular season, but one had two very good games in one postseason.

What are the odds that a Josh Gordon will be a better option in January/February than a Dobson/Thompkins by that same time with a full TC and 16+ games under their belt?

My opinion, and it's only an opinion, is that he wouldn't be a better option by that time. If he came in before TC, that would be a different possibility.

It is not that I think Dobson or Thompkins are don't have a ton of talent but I do think if you just look at talent and nothing else Gordon is a superior talent to both of them.

That just my opinion, not that it really matters, as we learned from Hernandez talent doesn't mean jack crap if you're a moron which based on the feedback I've read in this thread Gordon is.

 

[Ozymandias]

I agree with him probably not being worth the trouble but Gordon has proven capable of playing in the NFL at a high level, he had 50 receptions for 805 receiving yards and 5 touchdowns as a rookie playing with a below average quarterback. Gordon was also taken in the second round of the supplemental draft and Rogers wasn't even drafted in 7 rounds the standard draft.

Gordon is a much more talented and proven player, it is a shame he is a headcase because he has the talent to be a top five wide receiver.

His stats look great, but his baggage doesn't make it worth it. By his own admission he's one more failed drug test away from being on a year long vacay, or out of the league altogether. Even if he was a street free agent right now, I still wouldn't touch him with a 10-foot pole. I'd want guys that I could depend on and that football is priority #1 for them. Gordon has clearly demonstrated that he can't be relied upon.

As for Rogers, based on his college tape alone, he went undrafted for character issues, not because of a lack of talent. Anyone who's followed NCAA football closely knows that these two players are similar in terms of raw talent. One has gotten the opportunity to showcase his talent while the other has not.

Anyway, it's redundant to talk about him, as I only brought him up to illustrate how the Patriots wanted no part of one problem child for free. Why would they want any with another when it would cost capital? That was the point being made. The risk outweighs the cost big time.

 

[supafly]

Well if they gave up Richardson for a mid-late 1st, we should be able to get to get Jordan for a 2nd.

As for Josh Gordon. Yes, very risky acquisition, it would have to be a mid to late round pick. But we do need reinforcements. Don't even know if he's on the trading block, the guy did just get back from suspension.

Not on board whatsoever with Gordon at the moment due to the reasoning provided about needing to allow the young WRs room to grow, the potential problems with Gordon (or any outsider) being able to contribute too much this year with the unfamiliarity of the system, and the risk involved with some of his character concerns.

Like I said though, I think a guy like Jordan Cameron would be one who I'd give some extra thought to as a good young TE with lots of upside.

The TE position isn't quite on par with the complexity of the WR position (in my opinion at least), so even if Cameron slowly progressed throughout the season he'd probably at least be able to pick up the blocking assignments and improve on the depth that we currently have of Hooman, Mulligan, and Sudfeld. It's more possible that an outsider could contribute much more at TE due to the blocking aspect alone, and it is also a position that could use an upgrade as our current corps isn't exactly filled with high upside at the moment.

I'd be more than happy offering a solid 4th for Cameron, although I doubt they'd bite on that. If Belichick felt that he was going to explore a TE in the draft next year within the top 3-4 rounds then I'd be happy with even offering a 3rd, although that would be pushing it.... (edit: After thinking of it, I wouldn't go any higher than a 4th at best)

I'd rather TJ Ward

There are a handful of guys on the Browns defense who I'd like to have, such as Ward, Jackson, Haden, and possibly even Sheard or Taylor. There's also that DT they paid nicely for in free agency who I can't think of from OAK, but obviously Belichick wasn't interested in that price.

I wouldn't imagine CLE parting with many of their defensive players though, as that part of the team is currently what may allow them to compete should they eventually find a viable QB within the next year or so.

 

[JPsPats]

Without a doubt, Gordon put up great numbers as a rookie with Brandon freaking Weeden as his qb.

 

[jmt57]

There is some speculation that the Richardson trade was motivated by Haslams financial troubles.

Did Browns Trade Trent Richardson Because Of Haslam's Legal Problems At Pilot Flying J? - Forbes

If they are financially motivated to dump salaries, there are 24 players being paid more than what Gordon is making on the Cleveland roster; it would make more sense to move them instead.

What makes the most sense in the interim could be even more trades. During a separate appearance on PFT Live, Tony Grossi of ESPN Cleveland suggested that other players acquired before Jimmy Haslam bought the team could be available, including receiver Josh Gordon, receiver Greg Little, and left tackle Joe Thomas.

Thomas acknowledged that to Mike Silver of NFL Network, saying that everyone is currently on the trading block.

There are about 25 other players that were acquired before Haslam bought the team as well. Are the Browns going to attempt to trade half their roster?


Bases on Banner's statements I do not doubt that anybody and everybody "could be available". The critical motivation is going to be what Cleveland gets in return. Receiving a 1st round draft pick in exchange for Richardson is one thing; getting (for example) a 4th or 5th for Gordon is an entirely different situation.

 

[VJCPatriot]

If they are financially motivated to dump salaries, there are 24 players being paid more than what Gordon is making on the Cleveland roster; it would make more sense to move them instead.

Well Richardson was only making 2.2m per season in salary and they were well under the cap. In fact they are top 3 in cap room. I'd hardly term that move as a salary dump.

Cleveland is clearly stocking up on assets for the 2014 draft. The new management wants a 'do over' and is shipping out any players they feel don't fit into their future in exchange for picks. I doubt any player currently on that roster is safe if the right offer comes along.

There are about 25 other players that were acquired before Haslam bought the team as well. Are the Browns going to attempt to trade half their roster?

Why wouldn't they? The only thing that is stopping them is that draft picks come at a premium in the NFL and most of those 25 players won't fetch a return that would be worthwhile.

 

[Deus Irae]

Browns aren't shopping their stars. But they have talked to teams about Josh Gordon, including #49ers. They'd like a 2nd rounder in return

https://twitter.com/RapSheet/status/387311283961614336