Why didn't we draft Everette Brown?

[TriplecHamp]

Exactly. You believe (correct spelling). You don't know. None of us knows a damn thing. The games are played on the field. Can we all agree that then, and only then, will any of us know what Woods has to give? Then, and only then, will we know just how vulnerable the Patriots are at that position, as well as any other position. I'm not harping on anyone, but c'mon. It's been said, but I'll reiterate that we haven't even made it to TC yet. That's still pretty a little less than a month away. Let's all calm down, take a breath, and just relax. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that the team is in good hands, don't you think?

EXACTLY, Yes I wanted E.Brown but we didnt get him and Im fine with that... for now. I think the team is in some of the best hands in the NFL but at the same time I know they are not perfect and Im just stating my opinion.

 

[patchick]

Look at Jon Beason. Slow, redflag forty at the combine, 4.77.

Undersized at 6'0", 237. How's he been doing? Jon Beason - Carolina Panthers He's a freakin' beast

Hmm. You've managed to find one highly touted slow, undersized LB out of the many candidates (Buster Davis? Abdul Hodge? Jon Abbate? H.B. Blades? Rufus Alexander? Lance Mitchell? Ali Highsmith? A.J. Nicholson? Mark Zalewski?) who's done well. In a 4-3 defense. At MLB. And that's supposed to prove that a small, unathletic guy is a smart pick for a 3-4 OLB? I'm not buying.

I was firmly in the draft-an-OLB camp too, but I never regretted passing on Brown. The Pats have had better luck at LB with UDFAs with prototype measurables (Woods, Guyton, Redd) than with drafted guys without the raw physical tools (Mincey, Lua, Ruud).

Beyond that, when you find yourself making two precisely opposite arguments for the same conclusion -- they should have taken him because of his great size and speed! they pay too much attention to size and speed, they should have taken him because he's small and slow! -- you might want to consider whether you're approaching this with an open mind.

 

[jays52]

The logic is really quite simple. Everette Brown is not a 34 OLB. Man, this slow time really brings out the slow people, doesn't it?

PS, watch out, BradyFTW, I think someone intends to tap you out!

 

[ctpatsfan77]

I was firmly in the draft-an-OLB camp too, but I never regretted passing on Brown. The Pats have had better luck at LB with UDFAs with prototype measurables (Woods, Guyton, Redd) than with drafted guys without the raw physical tools (Mincey, Lua, Ruud).

Not to be facetious, but why, then, do they keep drafting the latter and not the former?

 

[patchick]

Not to be facetious, but why, then, do they keep drafting the latter and not the former?

Now THERE is a fine question. Don't ask me, I wanted Barwin. :confused2:

(To be fair, Mayo and Crable last year were pretty nice physical specimens.)

 

[DaBruinz]

We nabbed Ron Brace as "insurance" at 40. He's supposedly a one-dimensional player. There are persistent questions about conditioning. And two picks after the excellent Darius Butler pick, the Panthers took Brown at 43.

What about the greatest need for the defense this year, rushing the passer, and use all those high picks next year to package a deal for the possible 3-4 NT from Mt. Olympus, Mt. Cody?

Round 2 of the N.F.L. Draft

Everette Brown

He's got the height, weight, and certainly the speed Belichick is looking for. http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/13/233004-pass-rushing-olbs-addressed.html

What am I missing? You go Buter at 40, Brown at 41. And booya! Speed, speed, and more speed at the edge--just what the doctor ordered.

Not some fat slob who likes to watch cartoons incessantly, eating himself into a "knock down the wall" visit from the local fire dept. I mean we got the adult version of this.

When Everette Brown is wrecking havoc in the NFL, remember this posting.

First off, Brown is going to be lining up as a 4-3 DE and not a 3-4 OLB. He wasn't stellar in the drills at the combine and, from what I saw, he didn't actually listen to the coaches running the drills. He just did them his own way.

Next, Brown does NOT fit the typical mold of a Patriots 3-4 OLB. He's only 6'1.5". The Pats look for 6'3 minimum.

Brown is lousy against the run and isn't great in space. So he'd have trouble covering guys coming out of the backfield or the TE position. So he'd be a one trick pony. Patriots look for their LBers to be able to do all 3. Set the edge against the run, Rush the passer and drop into coverage. And yes, even Vrabel and McGinest would drop into coverage.

The key to the Patriots pass rush in the SB years was being able to bring the rush from ANY of the 4 LB positions. And to do that, they need OLBs who can drop into coverage at times.. Brown can't do that.

So its plainly understandable why the Patriots didn't bother with an undersized DE like Brown.

 

[jays52]

Not to be facetious, but why, then, do they keep drafting the latter and not the former?

It's got to have something to do with risk management. I would assume that within the time frame of TC and preseason, the coaching staff can evaluate if a player has the je ne sais quoi to make it. Taking a flier on a UDFA with high level measurables is a fairly minimal risk. If the kid pans out, awesome. If not, cut the player to make room for the less risky, less rewarding players.

Ultimately, I think that a player's ability to fit the NE profile is having that je ne sais quoi to be a baller. Guys with outstanding measurables who go high (ie, Mayo) also have high level leadership attributes and unmitigated passion for football.

 

[DaBruinz]

Look at Jon Beason. Slow, redflag forty at the combine, 4.77.

Undersized at 6'0", 237. How's he been doing? Jon Beason - Carolina Panthers He's a freakin' beast.

Beason is playing MLB in the 4-3. A totally different position than either ILB or OLB in the 3-4.

More productive than the other Hurricane drafted 2007 on the defensive side, Brandon Merriweather? Yep. Mike Reiss thinks so, too. Ask Reiss: What's in your fave five?

Mike Reiss is not the be all end all. In fact, he's pretty horrible when it comes to whom the Patriots will draft.

Sometimes the "system" has to make way for the players, even when they don't fit the prototype.

There was a time people believed the immobile, pocket passer like Brady was an obsolete facet of the game. Michael Vick was the NFL's future.

The game's played by the players, not the calculators.

Michael Vick was NEVER the future of the NFL. Ever.. Some thought he might be until they realized that he was a horrible passer and relied too much on his legs.

While the games are played by the players, the players have to be able to perform in the system. And I really hope you aren't obtuse enough to believe that there are teams that don't have systems. Every team has one and they do require certain skill sets to succeed.

 

[Deus Irae]

Not to be facetious, but why, then, do they keep drafting the latter and not the former?

To follow up on what Jay was posting, there's also the issue of draftability, and a secondary aspect of that: whether or not the team thinks it would have a chance to sign the player if he went undrafted. After all, we're talking about guys going in round 6 or 7 as opposed to slipping through.

 

[patchick]

It's got to have something to do with risk management. I would assume that within the time frame of TC and preseason, the coaching staff can evaluate if a player has the je ne sais quoi to make it. Taking a flier on a UDFA with high level measurables is a fairly minimal risk. If the kid pans out, awesome. If not, cut the player to make room for the less risky, less rewarding players.

But how much riskier does it get than being a poor physical specimen draftee at LB for the Patriots? The only way those guys last out of training camp is on IR.

I would seriously pay money to know what BB's thinking on the OLB prospects was this year. I'm not in panic mode by any means (I'm higher on Woods than most), but the whole process -- dumping Vrabel then not drafting OLB at all after devoting a ton of visits and workouts to the position -- has me downright baffled.

 

[DaBruinz]

OMFG!!! Ive been trying to say this for the past 4 months and nobody gets it. All I hear is "This player is to dumb to play for us." when they cant think of a good excuse for why they dont want a player on the team. If you have an athlete you try and do everything you can to help him succeed. I wanted E.Brown and I think we should have drafted him but its over and we have Brace now. I like how we draft players for our system but call me crazy but I think it needs some more athletes (we havnt won a superbowl in the last 4 seasons.)I am happy with our draft for the most part but we will never know until 2-3 years down the line on who we should and shouldnt have picked. We have a system that works but we need some better players to run the system.

The problem is that most of here DO get it. Its people like you and state who DON'T get it.

If the players available can't fit into the system, what should the Patriots do? Draft players who don't fit anyways? That is what you are saying they should have done with Brown.

In the mean time, when teams are passing over Brown to the TE that chipped him and came out into the slot, you will be one of the first ones complaining that there is no one to cover the TE.

 

[DaBruinz]

Yeah haha right WTF is up with that. Hmmm I guess we have some work to do instead of talking about teams of the decade and whos better Manning or Brady. Seriously who gives two F**ks whos better all I care about is if my favorite team wins the SB. Something that the steelers have done twice since our last one. Oh what a coincidence the last four teams two win the SB all had great pass rushers....Steelers-Porter/Harrison, Colts-Freeny/Mathis, Giants-Strahan/Osi/Tuck, Steelers-Harrison/Woodley,???Patriots-AD/Willy Whistle ****...Yeah I think not. Face it, since the Decade turned over the Steelers have been "The Team".

Hey idiot. The Decade turned over in 2000. The Patriots have won 3 of 9 SBs. The Steelers had one SB handed to them. And if you think otherwise you didn't even watch it. The other one, they earned. But they also play a different defense. They play a ONE GAP. That allows them to have their LBers be one trick ponies...

 

[DaBruinz]

Since the second half of the decade the Pats haven't won S**t. Is that clear enough for you? The Steelers have won S**T. We Clear on that? You may like all those records and pretty stats because they make Brady and the Offense look cute but it doesn't mean anything to me nor does it mean anything to any true football player. You are absolutely right in that none of us have know what Crable can do and I hope he succeeds but why should I just give him the benefit of the doubt? Fact is he was a third round pick. every team passed on him multiple times as did the same teams pass on Everette Brown. How the hell do you know what we are going to see from Meriweather, Mayo, Seymour, and the Joe Schmoes we have at OLB? TBC got a chance in San Fran and what did he do? Woods has been around for 3 seasons and hasn't shown me enough to believe that he is the answer at OLB and Crable is an unknown, hes never seen action in a meaningful NFL game so has E.Brown but I belive that Brown has more potential just by watching the two play.

Gotta love your BS schtick. You make an arse of yourself, get called on it and immediately start backtracking. Why don't you stop for a change and actually think before you post.

How do I know that we will see Mayo pass rush more? Because that is the natural progression of someone learning the ILB position for the Patriots. If you had actually followed the team for any length of time, you know that.

How could Woods "have shown you enough" when the coaches limited the situations he was in? Nothing like making an arse of yourself again.

TBC is fighting for a job in camp. Also, San Fran runs a hybrid 4-3/3-4 One Gap system. And, unless you studied their defense, you have no idea why things went the way they did for him.

 

[DaBruinz]

Before you question my reading comp Id just like to let you know I scored a 720 on my critical reading. I am aslo not dumb enough to think that that is our biggest question mark. In case you forgot...1)Brady is comming back from a serious injury.2) Our projected starting Corners are both newcomers.3) The Depth at LB is very questionable.4) We lack a consistant pass rush....Hmm I think thats four question marks that can be considerd the biggest depending on who you are talking to. Oh and I can use google to find pictures too, look....

If you scored a 720 on Critical reading, then the test was the one given to 3rd graders and not High School Seniors.

1) Brady's injury, while serious, doesn't hamper his best weapon. His mind. Or his second best weapon, his arm.

2) While our project starting corners are "newcomers" to the team, they are veterans in the league.

3) Considering that the depth at linebacker hasn't been established yet, how can it be questionable?

4) The Pass rush from the linebackers doesn't just come from the OLBs. It also comes from the ILBs. Last year, the Patriots didn't use Mayo on the pass rush hardly at all. This was to limit his responsibilities while he gained knowledge about the ILB and make it easier for him. He'll have more responsibilities this year as the SILB and that includes rushing the passer more. This will help the Patriots disguise the rush better and be able to generate pressure more from different positions. Making the Pass Rush that much better.

Hopefully, your poor spelling won't limit your reading comprehension too much. That way you'll be able to understand that most of the people on this board know a helluva lot more than you and you spouting off and acting like an internet tough guy doesn't do anything to get people to listen to you. It only gets their ire up and gets them to want to pound you with the facts even more.

 

[RayClay]

No argument here. Great pass rushing moves from the video I saw. I don't see what the problem with 6'2" is either.

Of course we're not allowed to question these things.

 

[BradyFTW!]

The logic is really quite simple. Everette Brown is not a 34 OLB. Man, this slow time really brings out the slow people, doesn't it?

PS, watch out, BradyFTW, I think someone intends to tap you out!

Yeah, gotta watch my back for Mr. 720. Wolfslair means business, you know.

 

[apple strudel]

I don't see what the problem with 6'2" is either.

The problem is that BB likes taller OLBs with long arms. He said as much after the draft. Hence, no Everette Brown. It would seem pretty straightforward. Taller guys do a better job of disrupting passing lanes. You can't measure the contribution the OLB makes to pass defense completely in sacks and hurries.

 

[apple strudel]

Before you question my reading comp Id just like to let you know I scored a 720 on my critical reading.

This is just too good to be true. And I'm not talking about the score.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

OMFG!!! Ive been trying to say this for the past 4 months and nobody gets it. All I hear is "This player is to dumb to play for us." when they cant think of a good excuse for why they dont want a player on the team. If you have an athlete you try and do everything you can to help him succeed. I wanted E.Brown and I think we should have drafted him but its over and we have Brace now. I like how we draft players for our system but call me crazy but I think it needs some more athletes (we havnt won a superbowl in the last 4 seasons.)I am happy with our draft for the most part but we will never know until 2-3 years down the line on who we should and shouldnt have picked. We have a system that works but we need some better players to run the system.

Well said... intelligence is important, but my guess is you wouldn't win the Super Bowl if you only drafted guys from Harvard, Yale, and Stanford.

 

[State]

No argument here. Great pass rushing moves from the video I saw. I don't see what the problem with 6'2" is either.

Of course we're not allowed to question these things.

RayClay, you're like Galileo here. “I do not feel obliged to believe that the same God who has endowed us with sense, reason, and intellect has intended us to forgo their use.” ~ Galileo Galilei

Belichick was basically run out of Cleveland. Jetsdom folk thought he was clinical when he walked away from that job. And Pats fans think he's some deity whose judgments must not be questioned.

The truth, however, is somewhere in the middle. Is he the best coach in the NFL? Yes, I think so. Does he make mistakes? On occasion.

Does he appear to be putting the team on a mental straitjacket by looking only at OLBers 6'4" or taller? Absolutely.

Who needs 6'3" Lawrence Taylor when there's 6'5" Lawrence McGrew RIP?