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What do Pats do if NYG use a 3-8 defense?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by betterthanthealternative, Jan 26, 2012.

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  1. betterthanthealternative

    betterthanthealternative Rookie

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    How do we take advantage of it? Move the two TE into the line and run, run, run from the no huddle, just beat them into having to call a time out in order to get different players on the field?

    What are the options?
  2. patsfan-1982

    patsfan-1982 Rookie

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    run the football
  3. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan Rookie

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    Run the Ameoba offense where we can go from a Wham 2 TE in tight package running it out to a 5 WR spread. Exploit the matchups on the LBs.
  4. xmarkd400x

    xmarkd400x Rookie

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    A 3-8? I'm assuming you mean rush 3 and drop 8 (as opposed to 3 DL and 8 LBs, that would just be hilarious).

    Presuming they do what the Ravens did (3 DL, 2 LB, 6 DB): 3 DL in the game means taking one of their best players off the field (the 4th DL), which is fine with me. They would then be taking another regular starter (LB) off the field, and replacing them both with the 5th and 6th DB.

    If they do that, ram it down their throat. Can a dime package really stop a 2TE set, even if the RB is either undersized (Woodhead, Edelman) or not really an RB (Hernandez)?

    I just hope BB doesn't get like Mike Martz was in 2001 and refuse to run the ball.
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  5. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Run Forest, RUN!!!
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  6. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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  7. Insaneirish

    Insaneirish Rookie

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    Steady dose of BJGE and Woody....but I don't really see them rushing only 3....their front 4 is their main strength.
  8. TommyBrady12

    TommyBrady12 Rookie

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    Giants have a lot of success rushing four and dropping 7 into coverage. There is no way they would deviate from that.

    The gnats are very susceptible to the run. Gore gashed them for 150 yards.
  9. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Rookie

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    its not really an option against a 2 TE offense......it'll be 5-6 yards minimum every run

    the ravens gave up long drives simply because they felt compelled to play the nickel against the pats. If the giants do this (they are substantially worse against the run than the ravens), the pats need to run the ball 55 times.

    Ridley needs to be on the roster, at least forcing the giants to ponder the pats intention to run the ball

    I'm not worried about the giants defense this year.......the pats just wwent up against a better defense that applies just as much if not more pressure on the QB, and brady was barely touched. I think the giants defense is more like the broncos than the ravens......

    the result against the giants during the regular season is exactly what this team needed
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  10. patsfaninpittsburgh

    patsfaninpittsburgh Banned

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    Bingo

    Besides, a two TE is suppose to give you this advantage.

    Also, the Giants are not that big and don't tackle very well.
  11. resdubwhite

    resdubwhite Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Gore is a damn fine footballer.

    I do think the Patriots are going to run it lots though.
  12. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No way the Giants rush only three and drop eight except in certain situations. They typically rush four and they will certainly rush four against Brady. You give Brady too much time especially since their LBs are mediocre, someone is going to get open.
  13. tatepatsfan

    tatepatsfan Rookie

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    I agree with some of the other comments on here re: the Giants' strength being their defensive front four. No way they only have 3 d-linemen, except perhaps in a few random situations.

    That being said, I agree that we will need to run the ball often and effectively. If they drop 7 in coverage and rush the front 4, then there is that little gap with can lead to solid 5-6 yard runs. If we do that well, then the Giants will have to adjust. And then it would be time for Brady to torch them.

    Anyways, the fact that we have a much improved running game over that 2007 team is what makes me feel better about this game. If the Giants focus too much on Brady and the passing game, BJGE & Co. will win us this game.
  14. Metaphors

    Metaphors Rookie

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    It is difficult to evaluate the Giants defense based on conventional norms. Their base is essentially a 4-2-5 with an extra safety playing in the box. When they go dime with Amukamara, they become a 4-1-6 formation with Kiwanuka playing DE (though he is labeled a LB). The only time they play 3 LBs is in short yardage and goal line.

    The only Giants LB that doesn't come off the field is Boley...but he is essentially a glorified safety (only slightly bigger than Barrett). That means the Giants spend a lot of time on defense with 6 or 7 players weighing 230 lbs or less...and the Pats attacking with 5 300+ lb linemen, over 500 lbs of TE and a RB that weighs between 215-225 lbs. And that is the Pats PASSING formation, meaning the Giants would have 4 DBs unable to help against the run before the 2nd level.

    I expect the Pats to key off of Chase Blackburn, who was unemployed as recently as Thanksgiving. If he is at MLB, isolate him in coverage and attack him. If he gets pulled for an extra DB, just run the ball right at Boley. Unless the OL gets beat in their 1-on-1 run blocking assignments, you will have BJGE or Ridley just having to avoid a single safety in the hole to get a big play. I like those odds.
  15. Nunchucks

    Nunchucks Rookie

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    If the Giants ruin a 3-8, chances are that Kiwanuka (sp) will be dropped into coverage. He is a guy that can play on the line or drop in coverage, so I don't think the Patriots will be able to take advantage of that personnel grouping.
  16. NEP4Life

    NEP4Life Rookie

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    I have to say that Chris Canty is a weapon for the Giants, even against the run. In the regular season game, 1st quarter, 5:59 to go, 3rd and 1, the Giants are clearly anticipating a run up the middle. Even though the Pats have spread their receivers out, the Giants have 6 in the box, and appear to have the D-line shaded toward the interior.

    At the snap, Canty lunges into the backfield so fast he could have taken the handoff from Brady. That blows up the play. Woodhead runs for a loss of 2.

    The analyst Aikman seemed to point the finger at Gronk, who had motioned across and had responsibility for interior blocking. It actually appeared that the ball was snapped before Gronk was set, so he had his weight shifted to his outside foot. He had no chance to react and block Canty.

    It seems like the difference in this play would have been delaying the snap by half a second to let Gronk get set. I hope this type of timing error can be corrected by the Super Bowl.
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  17. TheComeback

    TheComeback Rookie

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    Canty is a highly inconsistent player.
  18. godef

    godef Rookie

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    They'll respond with a little 8-3.
  19. VJCPatriot

    VJCPatriot Rookie

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    If they line up in that formation, run the ball down their throats! That's what double TE formation kills.
  20. juny

    juny Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Giants have become a pass happy offense. Maybe the Pats should return the favor and drop 8 in coverage.
  21. Keyser Söze

    Keyser Söze Rookie

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    screw em, we'll run a 2-9.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 26, 2012
  22. Patspsycho

    Patspsycho Rookie

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    That was an idiotic choice as far as the play call, it was the same play as the previous one. The Giants formation was so compressed and all the backers walked up to the line; it was pretty obvious what they were going to do, and that they knew exactly what was coming.

    EDIT: BTW it wasn't Canty who blew up the play since he went past Woodhead and at Brady's feet, it was Deon Grant who was in man to man on Gronk and shaded him strongside and came in for the unchecked stop.
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  23. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Do you mean after they stop laughing at them?
  24. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Not sure how making one play because no one blocked him convinces me a player is a big threat.
  25. NEP4Life

    NEP4Life Rookie

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    Looking at it further, Light also stepped on Mankins' foot and tripped, falling to one knee. Mankins engages Kiwanuka and Kiwanuka sheds him and helps make the play. Connolly at C slips toward the other backer #59 Boley. With the C and G slipping to the backers directly, this was an interior run.

    At the snap there are really 3 Pats blockers playside and 4 Giants defenders, so the numbers just don't seem to add up.

    When the Pats ran an outside run on the previous snap, they had two tight ends playside (Gronk after motioning, and Solder), and they blocked down toward the play, clearly going for the outside.

    I'm interested in examining the running plays from the regular season, because a growing hypothesis on the board seems to be that the Pats Oline and tight ends can outmuscle the Giants' front and have success running the ball.

    Added: Another Pats run occurred 1st and 10, 12:50 remaning in the 1st. This was clearly an attempt to run the ball down the Giants' throat -- 3 TE , I formation. The Giants had 8 in the box, 10 including the DB's squatting 1 yard outside. The Pats give to Benny and he gets stuffed, with Kiwanuka slipping in almost unblocked to make the tackle.
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2012
  26. Patspsycho

    Patspsycho Rookie

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    Well the encouraging thing I see is that we converted all our short yardage situations when we had to, and remember this is without Polite as FB.

    That particular run you're talking about is puzzling; you just don't see the tank personnel on the field in a 1st and 10 situation which makes me think they wanted to test that particular play out. It failed because Vollmer didn't seal the backside crashing will (Kiwanuka).
  27. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey

    Cry.....but then run
  28. makoute

    makoute Rookie

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    We all know the Pats should run the ball on the Giants, but will they actually do it? And if they start to do it, will they actually stick with it (especially when it is working!)
  29. guardplay320

    guardplay320 Rookie

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    Not to mention that the stat is wrong. The 49ers as a team ran for 150. Gore for 74, Alex Smith for 42, Hunter for 31 and Dixon for 3.

    As for them being undersized, that is not true on rushing downs. Joseph and Canty are big bodies and do a decent job of clogging up the middle on those downs. The key against the Giants is to keep them guessing in terms of pass and run, and getting into favorable 2nd and 3rd down situations. The Giants can't have Osi, Tuck and JPP all on the field all the time. That lineup is reserved mainly for passing downs. Avoid 3rd and long and you're a step ahead against the Giants. If I were the Pats, I'd use a heavy dose of run (especially on the edges), play action and screens.
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2012
  30. serifyn

    serifyn Rookie

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    The Patriots are playing with house money thanks to Sterling Moore, they can run the ball all they want.
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