We are on to the Heat and Jimmy Butler.

[Triumph]

Luck ran out just like the Bruins.

 

[VrabelJr]

Derrick White and Robert Williams are the only guys who showed up last night. Jaylen Brown singlehandedly gave the Heat two double digit leads. I've been a pro-Brown fan but hard to after this year. It seems clear to me that Smart and Brown are the two players we need to get rid of.

 

[TheRainMaker]

So you win 3 straight, then get blown out at home with all the momentum?

That's this generation of the NBA for you.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Jaylen Brown is in Russell Westbrook territory. Advanced stats show Celtics have a consistently better net rating with him off the court. Basically all the intangibles that don’t show up in the boxscore are his negatives: off-ball defense, off-ball offense, basketball IQ, playmaking, creating shots for others…then you add in his absurdly high turnover rate, anemic assist rate, and relatively average shooting efficiency.

Spoelstra still doubled/tripled Tatum despite Tatum’s ankle injury. And Tatum is still infinitely better than Brown, despite the injury.

You can’t really run a smart, decisive, passing based offense like the Warriors or Heat when you have a guy like Brown. He’s a black hole. Has no vision and can’t create. Look at the ball movement by the Heat. Imagine if they had an isolation guy on the court who shot 20-25 per game like a mid 2000s Melo/Kobe and what that does to the flow. Which is why I think the Cs are actually a better team without Brown, but they need to find guys to replace the volume.

There’s a lot of debate about these metrics (hence why Westbrook is so controversial) but I really hope they don’t pay $300M to this type of player. This is the type of contract that sentences teams to 5 years of non-contending frustration, like the Westbrook OKC Thunder or the Carmelo Knicks. The new CBA is going to make the cap more difficult to navigate with max players, and if they pay Brown, and Tatum, it will be those two guys and six scrubs.

Not sure why people criticize Tatum. Am I watching the same games? Tatum makes everyone around him better.

 

[VrabelJr]

Not sure why people criticize Tatum. Am I watching the same games? Tatum makes everyone around him better.

Tatum gets his criticism for taking too many iso, stepback 3s and turning the game into 4on5 on defense due to falling down or whining. Very fixable things if he wants to mature compared to Jaylen's laundry list.

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Well that was painful

 

[lancerman]

Derrick White and Robert Williams are the only guys who showed up last night. Jaylen Brown singlehandedly gave the Heat two double digit leads. I've been a pro-Brown fan but hard to after this year. It seems clear to me that Smart and Brown are the two players we need to get rid of.

Brown did this before in an ECF game 7. He gets way too many touches when he is cold and kills momentum

 

[Tunescribe]

Jaylen Brown is in Russell Westbrook territory. Advanced stats show Celtics have a consistently better net rating with him off the court. Basically all the intangibles that don’t show up in the boxscore are his negatives: off-ball defense, off-ball offense, basketball IQ, playmaking, creating shots for others…then you add in his absurdly high turnover rate, anemic assist rate, and relatively average shooting efficiency.

Spoelstra still doubled/tripled Tatum despite Tatum’s ankle injury. And Tatum is still infinitely better than Brown, despite the injury.

You can’t really run a smart, decisive, passing based offense like the Warriors or Heat when you have a guy like Brown. He’s a black hole. Has no vision and can’t create. Look at the ball movement by the Heat. Imagine if they had an isolation guy on the court who shot 20-25 per game like a mid 2000s Melo/Kobe and what that does to the flow. Which is why I think the Cs are actually a better team without Brown, but they need to find guys to replace the volume.

There’s a lot of debate about these metrics (hence why Westbrook is so controversial) but I really hope they don’t pay $300M to this type of player. This is the type of contract that sentences teams to 5 years of non-contending frustration, like the Westbrook OKC Thunder or the Carmelo Knicks. The new CBA is going to make the cap more difficult to navigate with max players, and if they pay Brown, and Tatum, it will be those two guys and six scrubs.

Not sure why people criticize Tatum. Am I watching the same games? Tatum makes everyone around him better.

What does your crystal ball tell you about Brown being back next season? It seems a shakeup is in order but how that manifests, who knows? For all its alleged talent this team lacks essential chemistry.

 

[Real fan 02]

This.

One minute they look like the best team in the league.

The next a bunch of front-running, soft, dysfunctional stat-chasers with a coach who has a deer-in-the-headlights look about him.

Offseason must do's

Trade for a playmaking, natural point guard. The ball cannot be handled by tatum or brown turnover machines.

Aquire a defensive minded wing

Inquire about DeAndre ayton

Recommit to defense 1st.

 

[Real fan 02]

What does your crystal ball tell you about Brown being back next season? It seems a shakeup is in order but how that manifests, who knows? For all its alleged talent this team lacks essential chemistry.

I honestly believe brown is going to be moved.. I would like the team to look into DeAndre ayton he is scoring version of Williams. We need a natural PG, Lamelo ball would be my choice.

 

[IcyPatriot]

I have nothing to say except I hope the finals are a grind it out series ... be nice to see the Heat healthy ... will be fun to watch.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

What does your crystal ball tell you about Brown being back next season? It seems a shakeup is in order but how that manifests, who knows? For all its alleged talent this team lacks essential chemistry.

I think he’ll be back as the contract situation hits after next season. Unfortunately you have these personnel guys who are proud that they drafted and developed “their guy” and Brown has improved each year (based on box score stats and accolades anyway, even though I think his improvement is really just based on jacking up more shots and cherry picking even more.)

I was shocked when there were rumors the Celtics wouldn’t part with Brown for guys like Davis and Durant. And now they’re sitting there saying “see, he’s an all nba second team, all star, 26 ppg scorer, and improving, and he’s 26, so we were right to continue investing him and refusing to trade him.”

Last night’s game was the culmination of this disastrous overrating of Brown. When Tatum got hurt the first play, everyone in the building, and everyone watching, had to acknowledge the truth, and the next 48 minutes was one of the more painful Celtics games.

I’m trying not to overreact but I’ve been down on this guy for so long. His ppg comes at a great cost. No idea why people say Tatum-Brown is “the best duo” as though scoring output is the only measurement. You have one superstar and one guy who is literally an overall neutral player because all those flaws. It really does remind me of Pierce-Walker. Pierce was a great (or at least very good) player while Walker scored a lot of points too even though he actually wasn’t good.

 

[Betterthanmost]

Did not think either of the eastern teams had a chance against Denver anyway.

 

[Real fan 02]

Did not think either of the eastern teams had a chance against Denver anyway.

Denver, they have the kryptonite to deal with Miami. Athletic wing defenders that show up every game. Jamal gets into the paint at will.. Joker can score, pass, set up guys better than any big man I've seen that can pass since vlade divac. On top of it all they have a coach with balls in Malone!

 

[Real fan 02]

I think he’ll be back as the contract situation hits after next season. Unfortunately you have these personnel guys who are proud that they drafted and developed “their guy” and Brown has improved each year (based on box score stats and accolades anyway, even though I think his improvement is really just based on jacking up more shots and cherry picking even more.)

I was shocked when there were rumors the Celtics wouldn’t part with Brown for guys like Davis and Durant. And now they’re sitting there saying “see, he’s an all nba second team, all star, 26 ppg scorer, and improving, and he’s 26, so we were right to continue investing him and refusing to trade him.”

Last night’s game was the culmination of this disastrous overrating of Brown. When Tatum got hurt the first play, everyone in the building, and everyone watching, had to acknowledge the truth, and the next 48 minutes was one of the more painful Celtics games.

I’m trying not to overreact but I’ve been down on this guy for so long. His ppg comes at a great cost. No idea why people say Tatum-Brown is “the best duo” as though scoring output is the only measurement. You have one superstar and one guy who is literally an overall neutral player because all those flaws. It really does remind me of Pierce-Walker. Pierce was a great (or at least very good) player while Walker scored a lot of points too even though he actually wasn’t good.

Great post, however I've posted that we need a natural PG. I don't ever recall seeing a G or F like tatum and brown just constantly turn the ball over. Take the ball our their hands let them get open like Miller, Hamilton and many others used to do. They need to learn that aspect of thier game. Lamelo ball would be my choice. A natural PG, who can score and get everyone involved. This would allow the offense to he more fluid and efficient. The off-season needs aren't much. If somehow we were able to aquire ball that would take so much pressure off tatum and brown. But my instincts tell me I believe brown gets moved.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Great post, however I've posted that we need a natural PG. I don't ever recall seeing a G or F like tatum and brown just constantly turn the ball over. Take the ball our their hands let them get open like Miller, Hamilton and many others used to do. They need to learn that aspect of thier game. Lamelo ball would be my choice. A natural PG, who can score and get everyone involved. This would allow the offense to he more fluid and efficient. The off-season needs aren't much. If somehow we were able to aquire ball that would take so much pressure off tatum and brown. But my instincts tell me I believe brown gets moved.

This might sound crazy but what about trying to trade/package for Chris Paul and just playing him 15-20 mpg including the 4th qtr? Hedge that he can stay healthy with low usage and use him for crunch time. CP and JB make similar money and both on last year of contract. Always thought Paul is exactly the player they need. He’ll be 39 but looking at JB’s deal, it’s about who makes you better in 2023-24.

 

[Real fan 02]

This might sound crazy but what about trying to trade/package for Chris Paul and just playing him 15-20 mpg including the 4th qtr? Hedge that he can stay healthy with low usage and use him for crunch time. CP and JB make similar money and both on last year of contract. Always thought Paul is exactly the player they need. He’ll be 39 but looking at JB’s deal, it’s about who makes you better in 2023-24.

Yeah.. I've thought about CP3 before.. I know he's still a great player at his age, he still can create and he's a natural playmaker.. it feels like the team would be better off with trading brown for a playmaking PG and or lock down wing defender.. those guys are a necessity these days.. look at Denver KCP, Bruce brown, Gordon.. those guys pride themselves on the defensive end. We need guys that are going to be committed to playing defense.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Did not think either of the eastern teams had a chance against Denver anyway.

I didn't see us beating DEN.

 

[aluminum seats]

Great post, however I've posted that we need a natural PG. I don't ever recall seeing a G or F like tatum and brown just constantly turn the ball over. Take the ball our their hands let them get open like Miller, Hamilton and many others used to do. They need to learn that aspect of thier game. Lamelo ball would be my choice. A natural PG, who can score and get everyone involved. This would allow the offense to he more fluid and efficient. The off-season needs aren't much. If somehow we were able to aquire ball that would take so much pressure off tatum and brown. But my instincts tell me I believe brown gets moved.

Agree 100% on a real pg. As presently constructed, with that coach (who I'm afraid is coming back), they don't actually have an offense. They take shots, and they're talented so a decent amount usually go in. But they don't have an offense.

Agreed too with all that they weren't beating Denver, and you couple that with not feeling a huge amount of affection for this team, this has been a pretty easy loss to shake off.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think he’ll be back as the contract situation hits after next season. Unfortunately you have these personnel guys who are proud that they drafted and developed “their guy” and Brown has improved each year (based on box score stats and accolades anyway, even though I think his improvement is really just based on jacking up more shots and cherry picking even more.)

I was shocked when there were rumors the Celtics wouldn’t part with Brown for guys like Davis and Durant. And now they’re sitting there saying “see, he’s an all nba second team, all star, 26 ppg scorer, and improving, and he’s 26, so we were right to continue investing him and refusing to trade him.”

Last night’s game was the culmination of this disastrous overrating of Brown. When Tatum got hurt the first play, everyone in the building, and everyone watching, had to acknowledge the truth, and the next 48 minutes was one of the more painful Celtics games.

I’m trying not to overreact but I’ve been down on this guy for so long. His ppg comes at a great cost. No idea why people say Tatum-Brown is “the best duo” as though scoring output is the only measurement. You have one superstar and one guy who is literally an overall neutral player because all those flaws. It really does remind me of Pierce-Walker. Pierce was a great (or at least very good) player while Walker scored a lot of points too even though he actually wasn’t good.

Brown turns the ball over too much. He has become a better shooter but not from 3. Better defensive player but he won't remind anyone of Scottie Pippen.

I would not pay him a supermax deal.