Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisions)

[D-Money]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

I wouldnt want any other coach besides BB!!!The pressure is definetly on him though this year to get this back to winning playoff games.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Mankins is the best LG in the NFL unless, of course, the 2007 Super Bowl is dispositive of his ability. The notion that one game defines Matthews is just as wrong.

Deus is schooling Jack.

Anyone see Jesus in their morning toast?

 

[folamzz]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Welcome to patsfans.

It's at about this time in the thread where the idiots show up.

They most often post stupid comments and mask it as talking about "homers".

They show off how stupid they are by claiming that other posters think BB can do no wrong. Then then display further ignorance by claiming a loss has to be an "embarassment".

The real embarassment around here are these ignoramous types who existance is to flaunt how ignorant they are.

So getting blown out home by baltimore, with a first year head coach and a QB who goes 4-10, less than 100 yards and no Tdsis not an embarassment? You are an example of a homer. Greenbay traded with BB to select both Jennings and Matthews. Jennings caught a touch down in the superbowl and matthews forced a fumble that changed the game. they have drafted well since Ted thompson got there including finding guys like sam shields and ryan grant in the bottom of the bin. I think the packers organization know football.
I like BB, but you cannot deny the extreme arrogance on this board. If BB doesn't draft a player, that means the guy can't play. Clay matthews has 23 sacks in 2 years and a solid contributor to a superbowl team, yet the homers still claim he can't play. Those same guys come here and argue that cunningham is the next best thing.
I bet you, if we the deal with the raiders had fallen through and we didn't get moss, all the homers would be saying we didn't need him anyway. They would say moss would not fit our team, he doesn't go across the middle, he's bad guy with baggage and so on.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Welcome to patsfans.

It's at about this time in the thread where the idiots show up.

They most often post stupid comments and mask it as talking about "homers".

They show off how stupid they are by claiming that other posters think BB can do no wrong. Then then display further ignorance by claiming a loss has to be an "embarassment".

The real embarassment around here are these ignoramous types who existance is to flaunt how ignorant they are.

I think it's pretty fair to call the Baltimore loss, in particular, an embarrassment. A trash-talking rival came to Foxboro, beat up the Patriots, ran the ball down their throats, and left with a win.

On the bright side, looking at all of the additions over the last couple of years on the offensive and defensive lines, as well as at linebacker, TE, and RB, we have reason to believe that we won't be seeing any more of these types of defeats.

 

[condon84]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

So getting blown out home by baltimore, with a first year head coach and a QB who goes 4-10, less than 100 yards and no Tdsis not an embarassment? You are an example of a homer. Greenbay traded with BB to select both Jennings and Matthews. Jennings caught a touch down in the superbowl and matthews forced a fumble that changed the game. they have drafted well since Ted thompson got there including finding guys like sam shields and ryan grant in the bottom of the bin. I think the packers organization know football.
I like BB, but you cannot deny the extreme arrogance on this board. If BB doesn't draft a player, that means the guy can't play. Clay matthews has 23 sacks in 2 years and a solid contributor to a superbowl team, yet the homers still claim he can't play. Those same guys come here and argue that cunningham is the next best thing.
I bet you, if we the deal with the raiders had fallen through and we didn't get moss, all the homers would be saying we didn't need him anyway. They would say moss would not fit our team, he doesn't go across the middle, he's bad guy with baggage and so on.

The only time Belichick is wrong is when "homers" thought he made a mistake.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

There are miles of difference between stating that Clay Matthews wouldn't be a great fit here and claiming that he can't play. I've seen plenty of people claim the former on this thread, but nobody that I've seen has said the latter.

 

[JackBauer]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Mankins is the best LG in the NFL unless, of course, the 2007 Super Bowl is dispositive of his ability. The notion that one game defines Matthews is just as wrong.

Where did I claim the Super Bowl was the only piece of evidence supporting my assertion?

Oh, that's right. I didn't.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Where did I claim the Super Bowl was the only piece of evidence to support that claim?

Oh, that's right. I didn't.

You called it dispositive. That's obviously not correct. No one game is dispositive when you're talking about talented players.

 

[JackBauer]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

You called it dispositive. That's obviously not correct. No one game is dispositive when you're talking about talented players.

Alright. I suppose it's always possible he'll learn how to not get owned by decent tight ends.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

Alright. I suppose it's always possible he'll learn how to not get owned by decent tight ends.

Is it possible that Mankins will learn not to get smoked by interior pass rushers?

I'm not even arguing that you're wrong about Matthews, as far as that goes. I think different coaching could help him, but that's not really my concern. I just don't buy the notion that any one game is dispositive, that's all.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

First, why is this a homer vs. cynic debate? This isn't Dez Bryant vs. Devin McCourty. The Pats would have had to trade up into the top 10 to get Watts. It isn't like Watt fell to the 17th pick and the Pats picked Solder over him.

Second, speaking of how high Watt got picked, did anyone really expect him to go 11th overall. Most mock drafts had the Pats taking him at 17 (although late mocks had him moving up to the 13-15 pick range). Maybe Belichick would have taken him if he dropped and/or he expected him to be available at least until the next few picks after the Texans selected him.

Third, did people see what teams gave up to get into the top 10. Again, I pointed out the Jags traded up to get to the #10 pick (one pick before the Texans took Watt). They gave up their first rounder and second rounder to get there. Since the Pats were one pick back and would have had to compete with the Jags to move up, they might have had to give up a lot more.

This isn't a case of Belichick had Watts sitting on his lap and chose to pass on him by trading down or taking another player. Watt was taken higher than expected and even if the Pats knew that the Texans were targetting him they would have had to give up two or three first and second day picks to get Watt. If you think me taking that into consideration is being a homer, then so be it.

Now if one or more of the d-linemen taken after 17 turn into studs and Solder doesn't, then people can start questioning Belichick's pick.

 

[folamzz]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

The op was not even bashing BB about Watts. All he said was he likes Watt and wish we could have gotten him. But a homer came into the thread thinking it was an attack on BB, then decided to attack jj watts instead. The same poster was having a lovefest about mallett last week over a preseason game against back-ups.
I like good players, i don't try to denigrate their play simply because they're not on the patriots or are on a rival team. I love the haynesworth(sp) trade because he's a good player not because BB decided to trade for him. If he had gone to the jets instead, i would say it's a good move for them.

 

[reflexblue]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

First, why is this a homer vs. cynic debate? This isn't Dez Bryant vs. Devin McCourty. The Pats would have had to trade up into the top 10 to get Watts. It isn't like Watt fell to the 17th pick and the Pats picked Solder over him.

Second, speaking of how high Watt got picked, did anyone really expect him to go 11th overall. Most mock drafts had the Pats taking him at 17 (although late mocks had him moving up to the 13-15 pick range). Maybe Belichick would have taken him if he dropped and/or he expected him to be available at least until the next few picks after the Texans selected him.

Third, did people see what teams gave up to get into the top 10. Again, I pointed out the Jags traded up to get to the #10 pick (one pick before the Texans took Watt). They gave up their first rounder and second rounder to get there. Since the Pats were one pick back and would have had to compete with the Jags to move up, they might have had to give up a lot more.

This isn't a case of Belichick had Watts sitting on his lap and chose to pass on him by trading down or taking another player. Watt was taken higher than expected and even if the Pats knew that the Texans were targetting him they would have had to give up two or three first and second day picks to get Watt. If you think me taking that into consideration is being a homer, then so be it.

Now if one or more of the d-linemen taken after 17 turn into studs and Solder doesn't, then people can start questioning Belichick's pick.

:agree::ditto::yeahthat:

 

[reflexblue]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

Can somebody come up with another player besides Matthews as an example, its been beaten to death. Matthews had potential steroid issues, he gained about 30-40 lbs in a couple of years which raised questions about him being juiced up. I'm one of the people here that questions some of BB's picks specifically not drafting OLB's or D-lineman (does anyone think that Fat Albert will make it through the year without being injured?) But i'm not second guessing BB on passing on Clay Matthews.

 

[folamzz]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

Can somebody come up with another player besides Matthews as an example, its been beaten to death. Matthews had potential steroid issues, he gained about 30-40 lbs in a couple of years which raised questions about him being juiced up. I'm one of the people here that questions some of BB's picks specifically not drafting OLB's or D-lineman (does anyone think that Fat Albert will make it through the year without being injured?) But i'm not second guessing BB on passing on Clay Matthews.

Let me give you another name, greg jennings. The packers are very happy that BB thought neither jennings nor matthews were good enough to play on his team. If another team made trades with the packers that netted them two key players on their superbowl team they would get killed for it, but BB gets a pass.

 

[Shelterdog]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

Let me give you another name, greg jennings. The packers are very happy that BB thought neither jennings nor matthews were good enough to play on his team. If another team made trades with the packers that netted them two key players on their superbowl team they would get killed for it, but BB gets a pass.

What's your point--that he makes bad moves sometimes? We all agree with that. But if your point is that he's a bad GM because he's made a few bad moves, you're wrong: he's made a lot more good moves than bad as shown by the fact the team hasn't won fewer than 9 games since 2000.

 

[RayClay]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

Why, it's almost like draft analysis is an imperfect science.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Re: OT: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight

So getting blown out home by baltimore, with a first year head coach and a QB who goes 4-10, less than 100 yards and no Tdsis not an embarassment? You are an example of a homer. Greenbay traded with BB to select both Jennings and Matthews. Jennings caught a touch down in the superbowl and matthews forced a fumble that changed the game. they have drafted well since Ted thompson got there including finding guys like sam shields and ryan grant in the bottom of the bin. I think the packers organization know football.
I like BB, but you cannot deny the extreme arrogance on this board. If BB doesn't draft a player, that means the guy can't play. Clay matthews has 23 sacks in 2 years and a solid contributor to a superbowl team, yet the homers still claim he can't play. Those same guys come here and argue that cunningham is the next best thing.
I bet you, if we the deal with the raiders had fallen through and we didn't get moss, all the homers would be saying we didn't need him anyway. They would say moss would not fit our team, he doesn't go across the middle, he's bad guy with baggage and so on.

Let's just say Mensa is going to be calling you anytime soon. Don't hold your breath waiting.

Clueless has never been in style, it doesn't even look good on you.

Try some perspective here. reality cures everything.

Reasonable intelligence told anyone that 2009 was going to be rough year and a transition year.

Brady off ACL
Seymour/ Bruchi/Vrabel/Harrison gone

The reasonable expectation was that the year would be tough but hopefully the team would gel at the end. In week 16, the team played their best football but week 17 has Welker (the key offensive piece) tear his ACL.

Once Welker went the playoffs were academic. Based on the limitations of 2009, a bad playoff loss was not only plausible but realistic. A team cannot change the offensive dynamic that quickly going into the playoff. As such, the loss was disappointing (as all playoff losses) but drawing extrapolated conclusions simply isn't bright.

Sorry to burst the bubble.

Now let's discuss your arrogance.

I frequent this site and have yet to see anyone call Matthews a bad player. Matthews is a very good player who benefits from having and complimenting an outstanding secondary.

As part of those 23 sacks, Matthews has had more untouched sacks that anyone the past two years. You probably think that's unique talent.

Matthews simply isn't good against the run. You remind me of mediot praising Matthews for a fumble he caused late in the season against the Giants. The mediot was extolling on NFLN, then Dukes makes the point that the only reason he caused the fumble 40 yards down the field was because Jacobs got sprung because Matthews got road graded.

NFLN sits there dumbfounded.

I was very happy to see the Packers win. However, where exactly have they been the past 10 years in the playoffs? Also, ya might want to gander though history to find when the Packers were as young as the Patriots. (Hint: try back in 2005 when they were 4-12)

What's fascinating is that on the boards of 31 NFL teams, the homers are delusional. On New England Patriots boards, the Belichick haters are delusional.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

First, why is this a homer vs. cynic debate? This isn't Dez Bryant vs. Devin McCourty. The Pats would have had to trade up into the top 10 to get Watts. It isn't like Watt fell to the 17th pick and the Pats picked Solder over him.

Second, speaking of how high Watt got picked, did anyone really expect him to go 11th overall. Most mock drafts had the Pats taking him at 17 (although late mocks had him moving up to the 13-15 pick range). Maybe Belichick would have taken him if he dropped and/or he expected him to be available at least until the next few picks after the Texans selected him.

Third, did people see what teams gave up to get into the top 10. Again, I pointed out the Jags traded up to get to the #10 pick (one pick before the Texans took Watt). They gave up their first rounder and second rounder to get there. Since the Pats were one pick back and would have had to compete with the Jags to move up, they might have had to give up a lot more.

This isn't a case of Belichick had Watts sitting on his lap and chose to pass on him by trading down or taking another player. Watt was taken higher than expected and even if the Pats knew that the Texans were targetting him they would have had to give up two or three first and second day picks to get Watt. If you think me taking that into consideration is being a homer, then so be it.

Now if one or more of the d-linemen taken after 17 turn into studs and Solder doesn't, then people can start questioning Belichick's pick.

Rob

This just the next series of unending debates about the pass rush.

It's easy to spot because when the battle is joined, Clay Matthews appears on the hill.

We have a certain section that thinks Clay Matthews is so great; he's got to be the love child of Chuck Norris and Adam Seward.

 

[folamzz]

Re: Watt Looked Unreal Tonight (update: homers vs cynics debate re: Pats draft decisi

The only delusional people here are the homers. matthews has 23 sacks in 2 years but they apparently came untouched. Do you even believe your own crap? He was a prominent contributor to a superbowl team despite playing with lower leg injury for the whole year.
i concede, the only good players in this league are those on the patriots. BB is the only only good coach/gm in the league and everybody else are just idiots. Although those idiots seem to prevent BB from winning superbowl or playoff game recently.