The Pats NEED to start O'Connell next week...Cassel just cant cut it

[dakevdude]

I've never said he looks great out there in any of my posts. I just find it funny that people keep saying Cassel sucks, start O'connell, yet offer no real facts to back up why that would be a great move.

Just people venting man...because at this moment...Cassel does suck!

Me personally I would never say anything like start O'Connell or get a veteran QB because you leave that up to the Pats management to decide and take care of...nothing we can control...

Only thing us Pats fans can do is vent our frustrations since Cassel (I repeat) DOES really suck...he just looks so scared out there with even just a hint of line preasures.

There is not that feeling in me that would say hey we are down by 2 touchdowns but we have a chance to win this game with Cassel in center compared to the likes of Brady, or P Manning, or Favre, maybe Romo etc. etc...

 

[Batman]

Moss not making them grabs changes EVERYTHING! ever head of the butterfly effect?

I am not blaming moss, cassel our db's or anyone else.

But there are a few fundamentals I teach too the rookie DB's and WR's on my team and I am sure that every other coach teaches the same thing. Take the ball at it's highest point when anyone is in 3 yards of you. You can't just expect the ball in the basket everytime.



Upon the theory of the people here we need to start guyton crable withle wheatly and slater.

I am starting to think that Brady made that OL look better than it is too with his few steps he made just to get out of the way not many QB can do it so well so there is no way e can expect a bak up to after 5 games.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Moss not making them grabs changes EVERYTHING! ever head of the butterfly effect?

I am not blaming moss, cassel our db's or anyone else.

But there are a few fundamentals I teach too the rookie DB's and WR's on my team and I am sure that every other coach teaches the same thing. Take the ball at it's highest point when anyone is in 3 yards of you. You can't just expect the ball in the basket everytime.



Upon the theory of the people here we need to start guyton crable withle wheatly and slater.

you forgot O'connell

 

[dakevdude]

Moss not making them grabs changes EVERYTHING! ever head of the butterfly effect?

Urrrgh...okay Aston Kutcher...

Can you then please go back in time to the first game and tell Morris to block that safety cleanly on a certain play..please please???

But there are a few fundamentals I teach too the rookie DB's and WR's on my team and I am sure that every other coach teaches the same thing. Take the ball at it's highest point when anyone is in 3 yards of you. You can't just expect the ball in the basket everytime.

Mmmmm...yeah that would work if the ball wasn't...mmmmm...underthrown???

 

[Batman]

How foolish of me.

Didn't we activate a RB last night the number 42 who caught a pass? we could have him starting too.

 

[Batman]

Urrrgh...okay Aston Kutcher...

Can you then please go back in time to the first game and tell Morris block the safety cleanly on a certain play..please please???



Mmmmm...yeah that would work if the ball wasn't...mmmmm...underthrown???

The butterfly effect isn't just about going back in time it's about things that happened. Yes if morris had blocked him after he got up we could have blown out every game by now. or Brady could have been hit and concussed on the next play. but things would have been different. But being 1st goal on the 5 is better than 2nd and 10 on the 35.


If jammer jumped and got his hand to the ball which he did then moss could have jumped and got his body behind it. And taking the ball at the hight point even if it is under thrown. just by reaching for it gives himself a better chance of making the grab. If he reaches behind jumps and missed the ball we are 2nd and 10 if he makes the grab we get the ball in better field position.

 

[dakevdude]

The butterfly effect isn't just about going back in time it's about things that happened.

Mmmmm...I was being facetious you tool....

If jammer jumped and got his hand to the ball which he did then moss could have jumped and got his body behind it. And taking the ball at the hight point even if it is under thrown. just by reaching for it gives himself a better chance of making the grab. If he reaches behind jumps and missed the ball we are 2nd and 10 if he makes the grab we get the ball in better field position.

Ah yeah...you're right....I'm sure you have done this plenty of times in your life time...the thing is...Moss is sorta knew at this so we should kinda give him a break...okay???

Sheeesh....How I really hate knowitalls...

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Mmmmm...I was being facetious you tool.

Sheeesh....How I really hate knowitalls...

I'm glad to see you posting about something you're familiar with :singing:

 

[dakevdude]

I'm glad to see you posting about something you're familiar with :singing:

Not sure how stating my opinions or countering someones else opinions with logical and sound valid arguments backing it up with data is a knowitall but whatever...

No where in any of my posts did I say to do this or to do that...I never even said Cassell should be benched...I just said he...mmmm....sucked!

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I'm glad to see you posting about something you're familiar with :singing:

These dregs from the ESPN boards just know how to identify sucking. People that want to talk actual x's and o's performance make their peabrains hurt so they lash out and show them...

I'm not giving Ian another nickle unless it's to hire a waste management firm to clean up this expansion mess he's created.

 

[dhamz]

I just find it funny that people keep saying Cassel sucks, start O'connell, yet offer no real facts to back up why that would be a great move.

It is just what this place has become.

You have the two extreme crowds - the doomsayers blaming Cassel for everything even when he plays well and the homers who blindly defend him and will tell you things are never his fault. There are very few people who will post that he has played well at times and at other times has been horrendous.

The truth is Cassel has done what he was here to do, what really every backup QB is asked to do, play a few games if Brady got hurt and keep the team in contention. He's done that. It is just that Brady's injury is season ending and Cassel is being asked to do more, asked to be the starter for the year. When judged against the expectations that go with that, so far he has been a mixed bag and last night he (and he was not alone) was terrible.

O'Connell is probably not going to play unless Cassel is injured or the team falls out of contention for the playoffs. He's a rookie and it shouldn't surprise anyone.

It also shouldn't surprise anyone that this team and in particular the offense is going to struggle with Brady out - he is only the best player in the NFL today.

Now what Brady's injury has to do with a secondary that Norv Turner and co. told Madden and Michaels pregame was terrible in coverage and could be exploited and then was shown to be terrible and repeatedly exploited - I'm not sure. Then again, the homers spent all offseason telling us that losing the top CB (and I wouldn't have paid him) and not replacing him wouldn't matter because anyone can play CB in this system.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

These dregs from the ESPN boards just know how to identify sucking. People that want to talk actual x's and o's performance make their peabrains hurt so they lash out and show them...

I'm not giving Ian another nickle unless it's to hire a waste management firm to clean up this expansion mess he's created.

I'll volunteer to be a MOD if Ian shows me where the "ban" button is.

 

[DaBruinz]

Cassel needs to be benched. I have watched every game and have he has looked lost and out of sorts in all of them. Yeah he beat the 49ers and the Chiefs those are 2 very bad football teams.

As the defense hasn't performed either, as I understand it football is a game of momentum and Cassel and the offense have lost it everytime the defense steps it up.

Really?

Cassels' avg pass is 6.4 and he has been sacked 19 times, offensive line has been horrible at times, but how many times have we seen Tom step up step to the side and make the completion? Cassel is no Tom but it seems he can't make a second/ third read witout tapping the ball 3-5 times and getting happy feet and always goes with the first option. He has no pocket presence whatsoever. He can't throw the ball down the field. Mcdaniels has him throwing short because he can't make the 10+ yard throws as we saw last night.

What was Brady's yards per attempt his 1st season? 6.9. It dropped to 6.3 his second season. Tom also had 32 sacks his 1st season.

Cassel has made the longer throws. Watch some of the other games. The issue is that, to make the longer throws, you have to have time. An average offensive line is supposed to give you 4.5-5 seconds. Cassel is getting 2-3 at best.

How can one have pocket presence when there is no pocket to begin with? Watch the plays. On just about every passing play, one side of the pocket has collapsed within the 2-3 seconds and it prevents Cassel from being able to step into his throws. This O-line is playing worse than the 2001 O-line ever did.

This team seems like it is not responding to him as there leader. We saw it in preseason and are seeing it now. Bill Belichick has made a mistake and it is time to try something else and pick this team up.

If Cassel is this teams QB then expect a 5-11 season. We have seven tough games ahead with all better football teams right now than what we are.

People saw only what they wanted to see in pre-season. And they only see now what they want to see. They refuse to look at the bigger picture. Is Cassel THE ANSWER to the Pats future at QB. Nope. And he was never meant to be. The expectation of another Tom Brady is a fallacy on many people's parts. My expectation of Cassel is to take what's he's given and do his best to not lose the game. Its hard to do more than that when the rest of the team isn't stepping up as they need to be.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Not sure how stating my opinions or countering someones else opinions with logical and sound valid arguments backing it up with data is a knowitall but whatever...

No where in any of my posts did I say do this or to do that...I never even said Cassell should be bench...I just said he...mmmm....sucked!

I must have missed the post where you gave "logical, and sound arguments backed with data" as to why you think Cassel sucks

So when you were calling the other poster a tool, you were just offering an opinion? ok, i get it now.

 

[DaBruinz]

I don't know much about Chris Simms to be honest.......Garcia would have been a great move.....too late now.........I like the idea of bringing in Culpepper....or would have to see who else may be available.....Listen, at this point, they couldn't do any worse than what Cassel has given us.....and maybe we could re-establish some kind of confidence/fire/..........COHESION....that we desperately need. This whole teams "nutsack" has shrunken up like a raisin....

If we stay on this present course....be ready for the worst season in many, many years.....because right now....this team seems to be giving up........just goes to show you how BB really should have recognized the MASSIVE impact Brady had on the entire PSYCHE and operation of this entire franchise......not the best decision/backup strategy that BB has made in his brilliant career.....

]

Why are you not calling out the other "LEADERS" on this team? Guys like Tedy Bruschi, Mike Vrabel, Rodney Harrison, Richard Seymour, Randy Moss, Larry Izzo. Guys who we've all said are LEADERS on this team. Its their responsibility to step up and show the confidence in Cassel to begin with.

Culpepper hasn't been healthy in 3 years. Garcia was never really available. Actually, at this point, they could easily do worse than Cassel. While Cassel hasn't been perfect, he's far from the main cause of this team's issues.

 

[stcjones]

Please let me know when I have worn the rose colored glasses and have been unable to see any faults/weaknesses in the team or the coaches.

Cause, even in this thread, I've pointed out issues. People like Sivy just want to blame ONE person, Cassel. Unfortunately, one just has to go back to the first game and see that the O-line was inconsistent before Brady got injured. Every one of them has been inconsistent in their play. Light, Mankins, Koppen, Yates, Kaczur. All of them.

If they were playing consistently average, then I'd have no issue putting more "blame" on Matt Cassel and finding fault with his inexperience. But their play hasn't been consistent or average. And its affected both the running game and the passing game more than anything that Cassel has done.

As for Cassel being a leader, please show me another team in the Salary Cap era that has had that sort of capable leader as a back-up QB other than the 2001 Patriots.

I wasn't referring specifically to you at all with that comment/phrase...but there are so many people on here that can't see the forest for the trees....and can't see the faults and problems that this team has very clearly......you on the other hand make some good points on here....respect the opinions....I agree that Cassel is not the only problem by a long shot.......But it starts with him I think.....the team has NO confidence in him.....yesterday was equally as bad.....and disturbing....as the blowout loss to Miami....this after the team had 2 weeks to repair some of the leaks.....problem is....no confidence in themselves and NO leader.......

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

Now what Brady's injury has to do with a secondary that Norv Turner and co. told Madden and Michaels pregame was terrible in coverage and could be exploited and then was shown to be terrible and repeatedly exploited - I'm not sure. Then again, the homers spent all offseason telling us that losing the top CB (and I wouldn't have paid him) and not replacing him wouldn't matter because anyone can play CB in this system.

Admittedly, I was one of the persons in the offseason who really didnt think we would drop off that much in the secondary. I really just didnt want to pay mr. "get paid", but I still thought we'd be ok, and we still might be a few games from now. I'll keep believing that Bill knows more than me. I wish others on here would do the same.

 

[dakevdude]

These dregs from the ESPN boards just know how to identify sucking. People that want to talk actual x's and o's performance make their peabrains hurt so they lash out and show them...

I'm not giving Ian another nickle unless it's to hire a waste management firm to clean up this expansion mess he's created.

Wow such a superiority complex for one that's a total failure as a forum debater...

 

[dakevdude]

I must have missed the post where you gave "logical, and sound arguments backed with data" as to why you think Cassel sucks .

I did my best...on this thread and the other one...you have seen them...if its your opinion that they are not sufficient...so be it...

But your "rolleyes" doesnt do much to counter what I have put forth...

So when you were calling the other poster a tool, you were just offering an opinion? ok, i get it now.

Of course...its an opinion...what else could it be???

 

[dhamz]

Admittedly, I was one of the persons in the offseason who really didnt think we would drop off that much in the secondary. I really just didnt want to pay mr. "get paid", but I still thought we'd be ok, and we still might be a few games from now. I'll keep believing that Bill knows more than me. I wish others on here would do the same.

And maybe they will be but so far this year this team has trouble stopping the pass except in obvious passing situations. On plays where both run and pass were possibilities SD threw at will.