Rewatching the game vs Bears

[jah]

You disagreed with two facts. That's interesting. Obviously you disagreed with the inference made, but it's quite amazing that you disagreed with indisputable facts. Also, the college facts are probably more in reference to the perceived value of the player around the league at the time of receiving his opportunity. As Cassel was a 7th who wasn't expecting to get drafted, and Jimmy was a 2nd, he has more perceived value right now throughput the league.

RGIII went for 3 first round picks, Matt Hasselbeck went for 2 without having ever started a game. Carson Palmer went for a 1st when he was hurt and Cincy had no leverage. Trent Green was an 8th Rd pick who'd played ok for a half season. Jay Cutler. Drew Bledsoe. Rob Johnson for goodness sake.

You disagreed with facts and then asserted non facts based on one precedent, Matt Cassel. Your post was absurd.

Hasselbeck and a 1st were traded for a slightly better 1st and 3rd.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

You disagreed with two facts. That's interesting. Obviously you disagreed with the inference made, but it's quite amazing that you disagreed with indisputable facts. Also, the college facts are probably more in reference to the perceived value of the player around the league at the time of receiving his opportunity. As Cassel was a 7th who wasn't expecting to get drafted, and Jimmy was a 2nd, he has more perceived value right now throughput the league.

RGIII went for 3 first round picks, Matt Hasselbeck went for 2 without having ever started a game. Carson Palmer went for a 1st when he was hurt and Cincy had no leverage. Trent Green was an 8th Rd pick who'd played ok for a half season. Jay Cutler. Drew Bledsoe. Rob Johnson for goodness sake.

You disagreed with facts and then asserted non facts based on one precedent, Matt Cassel. Your post was absurd.

I disagree, in case you wonder, with your assessment of my post as absurd.

Washington traded up from 6 to 2 to get RGIII. So they swapped one first rounder same year. They were also comically enamored enough to trade 2 additional 1s. So characterizing it as RGIII going for 3 first round picks is a little silly. First, they got the Ram's 1st round pick in return. Second, Garoppolo is already drafted. RGIII was a bad gamble, something the 'Skins specialize in. But they thought they were getting a franchise QB at the ground floor.

JG was not somebody's idea of THE top of his draft class or a once-in-a-decade talent. He was a good QB who was there when we picked.

Do you think somebody is lining up to trade 3 first round picks - or more accurately, 2 first round picks - for RGIII right now? Please correct me if I'm wrong - did RGIII cost DRAFT PICKS for Cleveland to sign? I am not following the 'Skins... but it would seem your strange characterization of RGIII going for 3 1st rounders is based on the draft - and frankly, he didn't. The Skins did wayyyyyyy overpay (2 1s in the future) to trade the 6th pick for the 2nd.

Jimmy Garoppolo might be the greatest thing since sliced bread. He is at present a prospect who has thrown 31 NFL passes. He will have an additional 4 games under his belt at the end of 2016.

We have him under contract through '17. Where will these 3 first round picks come from? Why didn't one of these teams spend a single first round pick on him 3 years ago and do this the easy way? Do you think he has shown a tremendous improvement - from the POV of somebody else's GM - since that time?

All signs are positive. Great, love it. The polyannas on here are out of their minds though. There is always a "wow we'll get 3 first rounders, worst case" scenario floated around, as if we can just declare our guy worth that, and other teams will come running to pay it.

Idiotic.

When will JG get time to prove that he's worth a 1 now, even though he was not worth a 1 when he came out? You think you're getting a 1st round pick on the basis of 4 good games... never mind "3 first round picks"?

He won't have won a division title for a moribund franchise. He won't have suddenly wowed a starstruck Dan Snyder and impressed the Redskins as the athlete of the decade. He will have played 4 games.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

I disagree, in case you wonder, with your assessment of my post as absurd.

Washington traded up from 6 to 2 to get RGIII. So they swapped one first rounder same year. They were also comically enamored enough to trade 2 additional 1s. So characterizing it as RGIII going for 3 first round picks is a little silly. First, they got the Ram's 1st round pick in return. Second, Garoppolo is already drafted. RGIII was a bad gamble, something the 'Skins specialize in. But they thought they were getting a franchise QB at the ground floor.

JG was not somebody's idea of THE top of his draft class or a once-in-a-decade talent. He was a good QB who was there when we picked.

Do you think somebody is lining up to trade 3 first round picks - or more accurately, 2 first round picks - for RGIII right now? Please correct me if I'm wrong - did RGIII cost DRAFT PICKS for Cleveland to sign? I am not following the 'Skins... but it would seem your strange characterization of RGIII going for 3 1st rounders is based on the draft - and frankly, he didn't. The Skins did wayyyyyyy overpay (2 1s in the future) to trade the 6th pick for the 2nd.

Jimmy Garoppolo might be the greatest thing since sliced bread. He is at present a prospect who has thrown 31 NFL passes. He will have an additional 4 games under his belt at the end of 2016.

We have him under contract through '17. Where will these 3 first round picks come from? Why didn't one of these teams spend a single first round pick on him 3 years ago and do this the easy way? Do you think he has shown a tremendous improvement - from the POV of somebody else's GM - since that time?

All signs are positive. Great, love it. The polyannas on here are out of their minds though. There is always a "wow we'll get 3 first rounders, worst case" scenario floated around, as if we can just declare our guy worth that, and other teams will come running to pay it.

Idiotic.

When will JG get time to prove that he's worth a 1 now, even though he was not worth a 1 when he came out? You think you're getting a 1st round pick on the basis of 4 good games... never mind "3 first round picks"?

He won't have won a division title for a moribund franchise. He won't have suddenly wowed a starstruck Dan Snyder and impressed the Redskins as the athlete of the decade. He will have played 4 games.

I do not personally have any idea what trade value he will have, I was responding to the idea that a 2nd round pick was the ceiling for his trade value. There are a lot of stupid teams out there and the market for quality QBs with game experience is usually non existent. I can understand the ranking of my post as "disagree", especially after a well articulated reply. I found it strange to disagree with a post that was merely a statement of two facts. I can understand pushing back against the notion that the 4 starts Jimmy is slated to make will be enough to fuel a Herschel Walker trade, let alone an RGIII trade. I just wouldn't rule out a team overpaying for him should he perform well, as there is recent precedent. I found the Carson Wentz haul to be an overpay, but it only takes one yes as it is said. I find disagreeing with facts absurd, but your reasoning in your reply to my post is certainly logical.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Well, it's not a terribly hard position to be in, but let's stop fooling ourselves about this kings ransom stuff. Bear in mind that every trade needs a trade partner. You get a second rounder if someone really shows promise - after Cassel went 11-5, we got a second rounder for him plus Vrabel... so forget the "Let's trade him for 3 first rounders and five seconds" crap you see around here.

Think about what you'd give to Team X for their "2nd year sensation" quarterback. Every trade isn't the Ricky Williams trade.

His ceiling is a 2. Singular.

But like you say, nothing we can't cope with (if we lose a promising JG)

You can't use Cassel as an exact analogue, because Cassel had $14.6M in guaranteed salary counting against New England's cap.

 

[GodBrady]

Well, it's not a terribly hard position to be in, but let's stop fooling ourselves about this kings ransom stuff. Bear in mind that every trade needs a trade partner. You get a second rounder if someone really shows promise - after Cassel went 11-5, we got a second rounder for him plus Vrabel... so forget the "Let's trade him for 3 first rounders and five seconds" crap you see around here.

Think about what you'd give to Team X for their "2nd year sensation" quarterback. Every trade isn't the Ricky Williams trade.

His ceiling is a 2. Singular.

But like you say, nothing we can't cope with (if we lose a promising JG)

Excellent post. Fans always overestimate what a player will return in a trade. Do you think Ravens fans thought Anquan Boldin, fresh off a dominant Super Bowl run, would fetch a 6th-round pick from the 49ers? How about Brandon Marshall -- a perennial 100-catch, 1,000-yard receiver -- netting only a 5th round pick from the Bears?

The examples are endless. Now obviously, a quarterback and wide receiver have different values, and in fairness, Marshall/Boldin were both older, but the point is that fans of those teams would never have envisioned such a pedestrian return.