Rank them 1-2-3 (Vollmer,Welker,Talib) in terms of importance to re-sign

[MoLewisrocks]

1-1-1

Sign em all.

The Brady era is ending. All hands on deck.

The salary cap is going to explode in 2 or 3 years.

The salary cap isn't ever going to explode, that was the goal of ownership in the last negotiation. It's been flat since and will remain so for another couple of seasons before it begins a slow but steady rise on the backend of the deal. They changed the formula to insure it would not outpace revenue going forward. A lot of deals that were signed in the past were predicated on the belief we'd be at or above $150M by now. They may get there by 2020. Which will set them up for another contentious CBA negotiation thereafter as owners hold firm on the concept of slow and steady.

And the era likely has another 5 years in which to compete. Could yet win one for the thumb... No reason to assume we are in now or never mode. No reason to persue the all in JETS approach and screw it up for the tail end of this era, and depending on whom they ultimately identify to replace him or transition into to screw up whatever comes afterward.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

The salary cap isn't ever going to explode, that was the goal of ownership in the last negotiation. It's been flat since and will remain so for another couple of seasons before it begins a slow but steady rise on the backend of the deal. They changed the formula to insure it would not outpace revenue going forward. A lot of deals that were signed in the past were predicated on the belief we'd be at or above $150M by now. They may get there by 2020. Which will set them up for another contentious CBA negotiation thereafter as owners hold firm on the concept of slow and steady.

And the era likely has another 5 years in which to compete. Could yet win one for the thumb... No reason to assume we are in now or never mode. No reason to persue the all in JETS approach and screw it up for the tail end of this era, and depending on whom they ultimately identify to replace him or transition into to screw up whatever comes afterward.

Winning one for the index finger will be hard enough to do in the next 5 years,let alone 5 titles as QBs coming out of the draft have become increasingly helpful to thier teams and we can assume most of those QBs will make their teams progressively better than worse as they get more experience.

While the Pats should remain competitive the next few years,they have had 2 chances in a row to either get in the SB or simply win it while they were there.....both times fell short.

It's safe to say the AFC is catching up with the Pats as teams continue to make changes and aren't afraid to face this team like they used to be,we will be lucky as hell to win a 4th title before Brady is done if all things fall in place,but the path to the SB gets tougher every year as the main cog gets closer to retirement.....

 

[upstater1]

Winning one for the index finger will be hard enough to do in the next 5 years,let alone 5 titles as QBs coming out of the draft have become increasingly helpful to thier teams and we can assume most of those QBs will make their teams progressively better than worse as they get more experience.

While the Pats should remain competitive the next few years,they have had 2 chances in a row to either get in the SB or simply win it while they were there.....both times fell short.

It's safe to say the AFC is catching up with the Pats as teams continue to make changes and aren't afraid to face this team like they used to be,we will be lucky as hell to win a 4th title before Brady is done if all things fall in place,but the path to the SB gets tougher every year as the main cog gets closer to retirement.....

The team is constructed with Brady to win now. Therefore, you go for it now.

So much time, money and energy has been spent building the defense. Love, Deadrick, Wilfork's contract, Chandler Jones, Armstead, Hightower, Mayo's contract, Spikes, McCourty, a 4th for Talib, Tavon W., Chung, Dennard, Gregory. A lot of effort.

But on the offensive side, we just had a year with a bunch of unwanted and castoffs on the OL--and all due respect to Wendell, D Thomas, Connolly and McDonald but they are only there because Brady's pocket sense and quick release. I think that offensive line could protect no one in the league other than Brady. And while Dante deserves a heckuva lot of credit, none of it would work without Brady.

That's why, as soon as Brady leaves, the whole team will have to be reweighted toward the interior of the OL. I certainly understand that a lot of $$ was spent on Mankins, but he was hurt half the year, and what you saw out there was people who were cut or unwanted from other teams.

When Brady goes, the whole team will require a massive reworking, especially if we lose cogs on defense like Spikes or Wilfork or some of the DBs.

The time is NOW.

 

[Ivan]

1) Welker

2) Vollmer

3) Talib

 

[FortressX]

Welker definitely.
The Pats must be regular season champs once again.
If the Pats are lucky and pump up the all important stats enough maybe TB will win MVP.
Boy wouldn't that be great.

 

[kennyb]

I think they let all of them walk. Can't afford them and Welker and Vollmer will be priced away from the pats. The only chance to keep welker is if he doesn't get as much from the FA market as he thinks he's worth.

 

[aluminum seats]

I don't think I'd make any extraordinary effort to keep Vollmer.

Honestly, I'm a little frustrated with the O-line. Actually, that's the wrong way to put it. Dante Scarnecchia does an excellent job keeping the line strong regardless of who's in there...to an extent.

Pats-Ravens, Pats have the ball 3rd & 2. You have confidence the Pats will just buckle the chin straps, dig in, and overwhelm the defensive line? Any feeling that, yup, they're running right this time...or left....whatever?

Me neither.

So until we have a guy that generates that kind of confidence, then I don't think we should pay like we do.

(Oh yeah--pay Welker. Talib would be nice, but I doubt it'll happen and won't be particularly upset if it doesn't.)

 

[signbabybrady]

1) Welker - By a mile

2) Talib - sort of by default but not as important as some would think

3) Volmer - I just cant put RT up there in a list of importance plus Scar can work with a lot less(not to say I dont want him back).

Kind of a mute question because none of them are the type that you just let walk. The only reason any of the three wont be back is if the money gets to high.

 

[stinebot]

Ya huge difference with Talib and Pollard. You cant take out a defensive backs legs and think they can be affective.

100%? No. But I'd prefer a Talib pumped full of whatever the strongest legal painkiller they have over a 100% Arrington covering Boldin or whoever. Instead, we got Mr. Sit and Watch. If you want to be paid like a big time player, you need to suck it up and play through the pain.

 

[upstater1]

Pats-Ravens, Pats have the ball 3rd & 2. You have confidence the Pats will just buckle the chin straps, dig in, and overwhelm the defensive line? Any feeling that, yup, they're running right this time...or left....whatever?

Me neither.

Why wouldn't I have confidence? The Patriots are better at it than anyone else.

We do need Gronk out there though.

 

[supafly]

The team is constructed with Brady to win now. Therefore, you go for it now.

So much time, money and energy has been spent building the defense. Love, Deadrick, Wilfork's contract, Chandler Jones, Armstead, Hightower, Mayo's contract, Spikes, McCourty, a 4th for Talib, Tavon W., Chung, Dennard, Gregory. A lot of effort.

But on the offensive side, we just had a year with a bunch of unwanted and castoffs on the OL--and all due respect to Wendell, D Thomas, Connolly and McDonald but they are only there because Brady's pocket sense and quick release. I think that offensive line could protect no one in the league other than Brady. And while Dante deserves a heckuva lot of credit, none of it would work without Brady.

That's why, as soon as Brady leaves, the whole team will have to be reweighted toward the interior of the OL. I certainly understand that a lot of $$ was spent on Mankins, but he was hurt half the year, and what you saw out there was people who were cut or unwanted from other teams.

When Brady goes, the whole team will require a massive reworking, especially if we lose cogs on defense like Spikes or Wilfork or some of the DBs.

The time is NOW.

The goal is to compete at a very high level now, AND also in the future.

That's the way it's always been and the way that it will always stay, at least with Bill Belichick at the helm.

As you saw in 2008, there was more than one way to win games.

Changing the entire philosophy to win now and risk screwing up years and years of careful planning and balance would be absurd..

They are trying to do both, and have done a very good job of putting themselves in the last 2-4-6 teams of the league every single year for more than a decade now.

Welker dropping a ball (this yr in the AFCCG which would have been a dramatic difference + last yr in the SB which would have won it) or weird helmet catches/ last gasp catches to Manningham cannot be planned for.

They are simply an unfortunate series of events, or else they'd have at least one more, if not two.

 

[supafly]

The team is constructed with Brady to win now. Therefore, you go for it now.

So much time, money and energy has been spent building the defense. Love, Deadrick, Wilfork's contract, Chandler Jones, Armstead, Hightower, Mayo's contract, Spikes, McCourty, a 4th for Talib, Tavon W., Chung, Dennard, Gregory. A lot of effort.

But on the offensive side, we just had a year with a bunch of unwanted and castoffs on the OL--and all due respect to Wendell, D Thomas, Connolly and McDonald but they are only there because Brady's pocket sense and quick release. I think that offensive line could protect no one in the league other than Brady. And while Dante deserves a heckuva lot of credit, none of it would work without Brady.

That's why, as soon as Brady leaves, the whole team will have to be reweighted toward the interior of the OL. I certainly understand that a lot of $$ was spent on Mankins, but he was hurt half the year, and what you saw out there was people who were cut or unwanted from other teams.

When Brady goes, the whole team will require a massive reworking, especially if we lose cogs on defense like Spikes or Wilfork or some of the DBs.

The time is NOW.

The goal is to compete at a very high level now, AND also in the future.

That's the way it's always been and the way that it will always stay, at least with Bill Belichick at the helm.

As you saw in 2008, there was more than one way to win games.

Changing the entire philosophy to win now and risk screwing up years and years of careful planning and balance would be absurd..

They are trying to do both, and have done a very good job of putting themselves in the last 2-4-6 teams of the league every single year for more than a decade now.

Welker dropping a ball (this yr in the AFCCG which would have been a dramatic difference + last yr in the SB which would have won it) or weird helmet catches/ last gasp catches to Manningham cannot be planned for.

They are simply an unfortunate series of events, or else they'd have at least one more, if not two.

Of course one could certainly argue that devoting 1/3 of your 121 million dollar cap to a total of three players would be sufficient enough for the "win now at all costs" fans. That's certainly going all-out in some form.

It could also point opposite towards my theory of "compete at a high level both now and towards the future too," but I think we've seen enough evidence over the past decade to back that up myself.

 

[Kontradiction]

1. Welker
2. Vollmer
3. Talib

I really don't want either Vollmer or Talib back unless they come cheap (at least cheap to what their perceived value).

If the Pats are going to pay a CB good money, I would rather have them pursue Brent Grimes or Sean Smith. Talib is a decent, not great CB. Everyone talks how the defense improved while he was here, but it wasn't his play itself which was the difference since he was wildly inconsistent at best (great in press coverage and an usher to the endzone in zone). It was that with a decent LCB it allowed McCourty to move to safety and Arrington to move inside. Without McCourty moving to safety, Talib's addition would have been a waste.

As for Vollmer, he is a Pro Bowl caliber RT when healthy, but he is an injury risk. He will ask for and possibly get decent LT money somewhere else since he could be moved to LT in another offense. If Vollmer's back wasn't a concern, I would say he was the top priority and possibly a franchise tag candidate. With major questions about his durability, his value goes down.

Welker is a must re-sign or a must replace with a top tier WR free agent. If the Pats choose to go in another direction, they will need to get a pretty good WR to replace him. A healthy Gronk will minimize the loss of Welker, but they need a goto WR to compliment Gronk.

You should surround yourself with more Dolphins fans. Once you do, converse with them and get their thoughts on Sean Smith.

 

[supafly]

You should surround yourself with more Dolphins fans. Once you do, converse with them and get their thoughts on Sean Smith.

You don't care for S.Smith too much, Kontra?

Personally I am surprised that he isn't ranked above Talib on most of the FA lists for CB's, instead of #2/#3 vice versa.

One good thing about Smith is that he's very durable IIRC. He doesn't miss much time. That's something that I would like to see addressed, and also a concern about retaining Talib.

I liked Smith coming out of Utah, due to his size and physical nature. I think that he has progressed the past year or so personally.

I can understand if you don't care for him, but I am leery about most Dolphins' fans opinions to be honest.

 

[Kontradiction]

You don't care for S.Smith too much, Kontra?

Personally I am surprised that he isn't ranked above Talib on most of the FA lists for CB's, instead of #2/#3 vice versa.

One good thing about Smith is that he's very durable IIRC. He doesn't miss much time. That's something that I would like to see addressed, and also a concern about retaining Talib.

I liked Smith coming out of Utah, due to his size and physical nature. I think that he has progressed the past year or so personally.

I can understand if you don't care for him, but I am leery about most Dolphins' fans opinions to be honest.

That size is about the only reason why most people are giddy over him. Again, talk to any honest Dolphin fan and they'll tell you their thoughts on Sean Smith. Talib is better.

 

[stcjones]

Vollmer is dead last in any scenario imho......I would rate it....

1)Welk
2)Talib
3)Vollmer......IF Welk will work on a deal that is REALISTIC for his age and abilities going forward in a multi year deal.....Which I do not expect him to do....so therefore it would be....

Talib
Welk
Vollmer

Talib brought alot to the defense this year...and as soon as he went out....our secondary went to sh$t again. It is not all about Talib back there obviously...we need to draft and sign some top CB/S this year and stop with the patchwork/bandaid/guy UDFA who is bagging at Walmart but BB sees something in him guys that have contributed to our defense being "part" of the achilles heel of this team the past several years. Talib's primary concerns is can he stay healthy and is that "character issue" that has been following him wherever he goes...going to pop up once he signs a contract. Vollmer...time to get on the bus.

We all know the top 3 priority players to resign and one to likely tag will be either Sebastian Vollmer,Wes Welker & Aqib Talib


If you had to rank who to re-sign in terms of importance to the team in 2013,how would you rank them?

I think...

1) Vollmer - The top priority is to get this guy signed back up,he is in charge of protecting the team's most valuable asset on the edge and thereby should be #1 because he is going to be tough to replace if he goes.

2) Welker - Makes some drops in the postseason but he is to Brady what Branch was to him back in the glory years....a player that is well in sync with the QB and hard to replace.

3) Talib - Hard to put him last because he is the best player of an overall poor secondary,but I still am not convinced that a big raise will keep him from being a bad boy again,in fact it might backfire once the contract is signed.

Your choices in order?

 

[stcjones]

PatsFanPa....always appreciate reading your level headed posts on here...another good one. Pats have squandered their opportunities in SB and playoff games since the 04 season closed. You can not get to the big stage and NOT take advantage of at least ONE of those trips! Like you say it is HARD to make it to the SB....every player has to come out with fire in the gut and take their games to an unbelievable level. We had SO many chances to get another banner or two or three (suppose you could keep going) over the past 8 years. And the Pats have come out in these games...flat, unemotional, tight, easily rattled....don't adjust to offset the other teams strategy/scheme etc

Now, as you say the other teams in the AFC are catching up.....and it is going to be MUCH harder now for the Pats to get back again. We are going to be very good again next year....IF we can get some TOP QUALITY additions in the secondary, DL (again ad nauseum...need more pass rushers), WR (look at these other teams that are winning SB's...what do they have? TALENTED, BIG, FAST WR's that can stretch the field and open it all up. We have Brandon Lloyd and Wes Welker (for now) thank you very much! We need some Beast mode WR's!!! OL...is also an area that is going to need some shoring up. Vollmer will be gone....the OL was very good last year....but the depth overall is kind of scary.

I hope Brady and BB can win ONE MORE SB here before they retire....but unfortuneatly, I doubt it. Will always have to look at those wasted opportunities.....Took 4 years for the Pats to get back after 07......going to be a much harder road from here on out over the next several years...(especially next year....12th hardest schedule....) We shall see

Winning one for the index finger will be hard enough to do in the next 5 years,let alone 5 titles as QBs coming out of the draft have become increasingly helpful to thier teams and we can assume most of those QBs will make their teams progressively better than worse as they get more experience.

While the Pats should remain competitive the next few years,they have had 2 chances in a row to either get in the SB or simply win it while they were there.....both times fell short.

It's safe to say the AFC is catching up with the Pats as teams continue to make changes and aren't afraid to face this team like they used to be,we will be lucky as hell to win a 4th title before Brady is done if all things fall in place,but the path to the SB gets tougher every year as the main cog gets closer to retirement.....

 

[kennyb]

I would keep Talib if he were on a short incentive laden contract with minimal SB.

Vollmer will be priced out as he can play LT and Welker isn't worth the 9M a year he wants.

I think the pats need to change things up on offense. The super short passing game isn't working.

 

[JackBauer]

That size is about the only reason why most people are giddy over him. Again, talk to any honest Dolphin fan and they'll tell you their thoughts on Sean Smith. Talib is better.

Word on the street is that Smith wants a boatload of cash, too.

 

[Kontradiction]

Word on the street is that Smith wants a boatload of cash, too.

The Dolphins are well under the cap and undermanned in the secondary. That they'll be more than happy to let Smith walk should be telling. Most Dolphins fans I know (and I know quite a few) are also happy to let him go.