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Pats = Yankees?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by marionbutts1995, Feb 6, 2008.

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  1. marionbutts1995

    marionbutts1995 Rookie

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    I know how much bostonians hate new york but the two latest dynasties are strikingly similar.

    Brady vs Jeter
    Both came onto the scene briefly the year prior to starting their dynasty.
    Both are considered the leaders of their team
    Both hang out in NY and are considered golden by the media and date supermodels and actresses
    Both were essentially rookies when leading their team to the championship.
    Both had critical bad calls go for them in that first year to help their team in the playoffs (tuck rule, jeffrey maier)
    Both are often compared to all time greats (Montana, Dimaggio)

    BB vs Torre
    Both came to the job being criticized for their lack of success
    Both had 1 playoff appearance before coming to their dynasty team
    Both have quiet demeanors and are usually surly with the press
    Both are now considered geniuses and hall of fame coaches

    Pats vs Yankees
    Both won 3 championships in 4 years (yanks did win 4 in 5 but still)
    Both missed on that 1 championship the 2nd year
    Both came into their first championship as serious underdogs
    Both had a team first concept which captured america and had the majority rooting for them
    Both began to get hired guns (retooling with big names) after not winning a championship for a few years.
    Both lost to their arch rivals after previously having their number in awful
    collapses (pats had colts 3 scores down, yankees had redsox 3 games down)
    Both teams when they were at their weakest in their dynasty period came up with a huge play to preserve their season (Jeters flip play against Oakland, Brown's strip of Marlon McCree against SD)
    Both would eventually lose that season anyway
    Both went back to the championship as a hated team against an upstart team that was on a roll (2003 marlins, Giants)
    Both were huge favorites
    Both lost
    Most were not rooting for them

    So I dont know if this has been brought up before, but I would say its pretty eerie how similar they are.
  2. Lifer

    Lifer Banned

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    Both had championships seemingly won in Phoenix and lost in a stunning fashion. (Jeter-2001 at Arizona, Brady on Sunday)
  3. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Patriot Fans vs. Yankee Fans

    Both are considered arrogant a holes by everyone.
    Both have a sense of entitlement
    Both consider a season in which you don't win the championship and utter failure.
  4. SeymourTrophies

    SeymourTrophies Rookie

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    #93 Jersey

    The tuck rule play was the right call, it was just blind luck. His arm was hit at the perfect time to make it look like he threw the ball. If the defender comes half a second earlier or later, it's a fumble.
  5. PF1996

    PF1996 Rookie

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    Great job! I've noticed and mentioned the similarities before but you have mentioned some that I never even thought of (i.e. the flip/Brown's strip & tuck rule/JM)


    I think the most disturbing similarity, particularly for the future, is that like the Yankees moved away from the formula for their success (great pitching/defense + efficient offense) so have the Pats also moved away from the formula for their SB success (great defense + well balanced offense).

    The Pats need to focus on their defense this offseason as this year clearly demonstrated that we cannot rely on Brady to carry a team, even one loaded with offensive talent, to victory. Brady can perform well ONLY when EVERYTHING is clicking well on offense (i.e. OL provides flawless protection receivers are wide open, and he only needs to throw less than 55 yards) but flops when he is pressured or he faces a good secondary. This is why we haven't been able to win with the mediocre defense of the past two years and why we MUST focus on improving this defense so that it returns to greatness like the 2003 version.


    However, much like the Yankees, the Pats haven't done a good job of acquiring and developing talented backups so it's looking like the similarities between the two teams will continue which suggests that the Pats are looking at one and done for the next few years.
  6. Sean Pa Patriot

    Sean Pa Patriot Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I know alot of people hate us, but I cant compare it...
  7. Eugene Chung

    Eugene Chung Rookie

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    I don't understand how Brady and Jeter hanging out in NY with supermodels means the Pats are like the Yankees. It's fine if you want to compare individuals with individuals, but I don't see how it relates to teams.

    The business in which the Yankees operate is way different than the NFL. The Yankees ALWAYS had a huge payroll. They were always acquiring talent. From '94 to '06, they led the league in payroll 11 times; they were second the 2 other years. And remember, this is in a league that doesn't feature a salary cap. The Pats did most of their rebuilding with lesser names and wise drafting; the MFYs had some key homegrown players (Jeter, Posada, Rivera, Williams, Pettitte), but their farm system was poor during the championship runs.

    If there is any team that is comparable to the Pats, it's the Spurs. They both have:
    -an incredible front office operating on a tight cap/luxury tax,
    -a hall of fame coach (Pops/BB),
    -a star that was once underappreciated, but is now considered one of the best players in league history (Duncan/Brady),
    -an aging superstar who made way for this player (Robinson/Bledsoe),
    -several key role players (Horry, Bowen, Elliot/take your pick from the Pats),
    -fantastic draft picks (Parker and Ginobli/pick your poison), and
    -fans outside of the respective regions don't enjoy them.
  8. marionbutts1995

    marionbutts1995 Rookie

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    To answer your first question, it doesnt. It shows how similar the faces of each team's franchise is similar. That is why I wrote to preface those similarities Brady vs Jeter.

    Youre right, the way they operate financially is way different. that is why I didnt use that in my comparison. They did both go after big names after a couple of years in a row of coming up short in the playoffs. the pats this year had the 2nd highest payroll.

    I dont think your analogy with the spurs is correct.

    You cant compare with how baseball teams spend with football teams. so how can you compare between football and basketball teams? Basketball may have a cap but the rules are way different than football.

    HOF Coach. Torre is HOF coach as well and seems to have more in common than BB has with Pop.

    Brady was underappreciated because he was a 6th round pick. After Superbowl XXXVI the media was comparing him to Montana.
    Duncan was a #1 overall pick who was never disrespected by the media or scouts alike. they thought he was great, he turned out to be great. From a fans perspective (according to the media) Duncan is seen as boring, Brady has never been accused of being boring.

    Bledsoe had to get injured for Brady to start playing. Robinson was on the court when they won their first title and was an integral part of their first championship. I could understand the analogy if Robinson got injured and Duncan came in and led the team to a championship but that just didnt happen.

    Every team has several key role players that step up from time to time. Believe it or not, those yankee teams that won championships didnt have too many stars. Like you said, Jeter, Bernie, Mariano, Posada, Pettitte, Mendoza etc were home grown. Plus I wouldnt call Brosius a stud, or Mariano Duncan, or even Tino or Paul Oneill, not anyone they trudged out there in LF and certainly not Luis Sojo or Joe Girardi.

    I dont follow the draft all that closely but I assume you are talking about finding players late in the draft (like a sleeper pick) Asante Samuel as a 4th rounder looks good, Brady obviously (though dont pretend that the pats knew what they were getting when they drafted him) and Bruschi in 1996. Hobbs came out of the third round but I would say the jury is still out on him. Hes no Ginobili or Parker.

    Your last point that fans outside dont enjoy them. Well the spurs have been dubbed unenjoyable to watch and were in the lowest rated finals in nba history. The pats are enjoyable to watch because people want to see them lose or want to see them go undefeated. They were just involved in the most watched superbowl of all time. No one enjoys watching the spurs but no one hates them like fans hate the pats which is a lot more similar to the yankees.
  9. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    #93 Jersey

    As of today, when accounting for the top 51 Patriots players under contract for 2008, the Patriots have $8.365 million in space under the $116 million cap.

    That currently ranks 25th out of the league's 32 teams.

    http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/

    The New York Yankees have a payroll more than doubling the average payroll of the 30 MLB teams.

    http://sportsline.com/mlb/salaries


    If the Patriots could double their payroll without consequence, then the comparison could begin
  10. marionbutts1995

    marionbutts1995 Rookie

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    Like I said, the salaries are uncomparable. There are different rules for baseball than for football. Can you really disregard every other similarity because of salary? I dont think so.
  11. richpats

    richpats Banned

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    Right now, yes. I hate it, but I can't argue the obvious similarities. If we keep losing in the playoffs we'll be more and more alike.
  12. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    #93 Jersey

    The BB/ Torre comparisons ring true, though Torre is WAAAYYYY more media-savvy.

    Jeter would never be considered among the very top shortstops of all time. A leader, sure, a hall-of-famer, sure, but not in the company of the top shortshops of all time like Brady is among all time top 5 QBs.

    The late 90s "do the dirty work" Yankees with Brocious, Paul O'Neil, etc... hard workers who are dependable, reminds me of the Patriots mindset.

    The jealousy of rivals, media attention, high expectations, etc. are very similar.

    But the payroll thing is huge and overriding... the Yankees can blow money on 10 players like Carl Pavano who never play for them and not suffer. If the Pats did that they would be 4-12 every year.
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2008
  13. nittanylions52

    nittanylions52 Banned

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    I think I'd have to agree with the original poster. If only because of so many people's hate for the Patriots. That and the appearance of trying to buy a championship last offseason.
  14. Tunescribe

    Tunescribe PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #61 Jersey

    What is a Yankee? You mean, people who live in New Hampshire? I don't know if any Patriots players live in New Hampshire. What difference does it make anyway? Who cares?
  15. marionbutts1995

    marionbutts1995 Rookie

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    Hmmm, I think Jeter and Brady are very similar. Granted Jeter never had a year like Brady had this year but Brady until this year never was considered a "Great" qb. Just a winner. Jeter as well. I read a book where they rank the greatest baseball players of all time and jeter was #60. Now I realize this isnt the be all end all of discussion but out of that top 60 I think there was one old time SS, Ripken, (who Jeter is probably better than) and A Rod who isnt a SS anymore.

    I dont know if statistically you can say Brady is better than people like Marino, Elway, Peyton, Favre. And is hard to compare with people like Unitas and doesnt have the 4 SB rings of Bradshaw and Montana. Dont get me wrong, that doesnt mean brady isnt better than some of them or all of them, but Jeter is comparable to all time SSs just as easily as Brady is compared to all time QBs.

    Both are ultra competitors both step up their game for the playoffs yet have also had failures that usually go unreported. Jeter has had some awful playoff series but no one seems to remember these. Brady has had some bad games as well, he did throw 3 picks against SD the last 2 playoff games and definitely didnt have a great game against the Giants, yet he usually finds a way to win. Jeter also has 5 more years on Brady which unfortunately has given him more time to fail. We will see what happens to Brady, if he falls into this same category.
  16. marionbutts1995

    marionbutts1995 Rookie

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    Well, I think some of the similarities are show a pattern on how to be a winner. I also think its funny how comparable they are when most Boston fans hate New York teams and vice versa. In essence you are rooting for a team that you hate, that being the New York Yankees of football. I dont know, i think that in itself is pretty interesting.
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