NY Times says Mangini's job on the line - might not work again

[Deus Irae]

No way. Mangini will always have a back-up job as a stuntman for Kevin James on the King of Queens.

http://www.newsbog.com/tv-shows/king-of-queens-cancelled

Mangini's out of luck.

 

[Kontradiction]

http://www.newsbog.com/tv-shows/king-of-queens-cancelled

Mangini's out of luck.

Well then there is always panhandling. I'm sure people will feel sorry for the fattest bum in the world.

 

[cubedoggy]

I'm sure he could get a job at E$PN, seeing as he knows so much about filming and taping and such.

 

[Scottso]

Alot of you guys defend Spygate by saying the Pats didn't violate any rules, or BB misinterpreted the rules. Then you turn around and call Mangini a rat. What does calling someone a rat imply? It implies that he gave information on someone that was doing something wrong. So calling him a rat is an admission that the Pats were doing something wrong. And I don't believe that Pats fans are dumb enough to hate him cause he stole Pats materials. Every coach that gets another job takes notes with them. Do you think our offensive coordinator came up with a completely new playbook, No. He's running plenty of plays that they used to run in San Diego.

 

[Kontradiction]

Alot of you guys defend Spygate by saying the Pats didn't violate any rules, or BB misinterpreted the rules. Then you turn around and call Mangini a rat. What does calling someone a rat imply? It implies that he gave information on someone that was doing something wrong. So calling him a rat is an admission that the Pats were doing something wrong. And I don't believe that Pats fans are dumb enough to hate him cause he stole Pats materials. Every coach that gets another job takes notes with them. Do you think our offensive coordinator came up with a completely new playbook, No. He's running plenty of plays that they used to run in San Diego.

What moron said the Pats didn't violate any rules? Sure they did. They taped defensive signals when they should have drawn pictures of them while notating down and distance.

 

[Deus Irae]

Alot of you guys defend Spygate by saying the Pats didn't violate any rules, or BB misinterpreted the rules. Then you turn around and call Mangini a rat. What does calling someone a rat imply? It implies that he gave information on someone that was doing something wrong. So calling him a rat is an admission that the Pats were doing something wrong. And I don't believe that Pats fans are dumb enough to hate him cause he stole Pats materials. Every coach that gets another job takes notes with them. Do you think our offensive coordinator came up with a completely new playbook, No. He's running plenty of plays that they used to run in San Diego.

Use your head. If my mother gives me permission to eat an ice cream, but you go running off to her screaming "Deus took an ice cream!", you're still a rat. The legitimacy of the action you 'rat' about has no bearing on what sort of tattler you are.

 

[ScottieC]

Alot of you guys defend Spygate by saying the Pats didn't violate any rules, or BB misinterpreted the rules. Then you turn around and call Mangini a rat. What does calling someone a rat imply? It implies that he gave information on someone that was doing something wrong. So calling him a rat is an admission that the Pats were doing something wrong. And I don't believe that Pats fans are dumb enough to hate him cause he stole Pats materials. Every coach that gets another job takes notes with them. Do you think our offensive coordinator came up with a completely new playbook, No. He's running plenty of plays that they used to run in San Diego.

No one here, or at least not very many, are going to argue that the team did nothing wrong.

However, that has nothing to do with what Mangini did - So I don't understand your arguement.

Mangini probably did not know the crap storm that he was going to uncap by calling out Bill, and I would imagine that if you asked him and he was being honest - He probably would have done it a little different.

But he did'nt and we are where we are - As they say, It is what it is.

Patriot fans issue with Spygate is more related to the Tomasse story than to what happened in the first Qtr. of the first game of the season.

If that story had never run or Walsh had not been running his mouth "off the record" about tapes he had, then this whole thing would be far behind us all.

 

[NEPatriot]

Favre is Mangini's last desperate hope in this season. If thing doesn't work out well, Favre will retire and Mangini flips burgers at Jack in the Ars. One stone kills 2 birds.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Alot of you guys defend Spygate by saying the Pats didn't violate any rules, or BB misinterpreted the rules. Then you turn around and call Mangini a rat. What does calling someone a rat imply? It implies that he gave information on someone that was doing something wrong. So calling him a rat is an admission that the Pats were doing something wrong. And I don't believe that Pats fans are dumb enough to hate him cause he stole Pats materials. Every coach that gets another job takes notes with them. Do you think our offensive coordinator came up with a completely new playbook, No. He's running plenty of plays that they used to run in San Diego.

I see you're relatively new to the Board, but there were few out here who held that "the Pats didn't violate any rules" and many of us even greeted with skepticism BB's claim that he "misinterpreted the rules," but gave him a big pass on that bit of possible disingenuity because he might just be the greatest HC ever.

Also, I disagree with your definition of "rat." I think that most people think of a rat as someone who shows disloyalty to an individual or group whose company and benefits they have enjoyed. One can be a "rat" by betraying trusts or secrets that are perfectly legitimate and that don't even come close to complicity in anything illicit. The difference between an OC who is "running plenty of plays" that he ran elsewhere and an OC who closes the door and dishes on things he learned about his former players' habits by virtue of having their confidence is significant. The former is simply applying his intellectual capital and expertise in a new environment; the latter is a "rat," even if the behavior is accepted. By that definition, there is no doubt that Mangini is a "rat," because he used unique knowledge of the Patriots activities, licit, illicit or whatever, to do harm to his rival and further his own agenda. In my opinion, he made a mistake in doing so because I doubt he will ever earn the trust of another HC again and, if I were the Jets management, I wouldn't trust him as far as I can throw him.

I think the animus out here against Mangini stems from a number of things beyond the obvious one under discussion: in particular, as Defensive Coordinator of the Patriots, there can be little reasonable doubt that he was complicit in the stealing of Defensive signals and reviewed their results when he was here, whatever their usefulness may or may not have been, so he's open to the charge of being a hypocrite; another, we just don't like the Jets--they're a fierce divisional rival and it's hard to imagine that we would have anything good to say about their coach--find a Yankee's fan who has anything good to say about Francona or a Sox fan who likes Torre.

 

[K-Ro 25]

I see you're relatively new to the Board, but there were few out here who held that "the Pats didn't violate any rules" and many of us even greeted with skepticism BB's claim that he "misinterpreted the rules," but gave him a big pass on that bit of possible disingenuity because he might just be the greatest HC ever.

Also, I disagree with your definition of "rat." I think that most people think of a rat as someone who shows disloyalty to an individual or group whose company and benefits they have enjoyed. One can be a "rat" by betraying trusts or secrets that are perfectly legitimate and that don't even come close to complicity in anything illicit. The difference between an OC who is "running plenty of plays" that he ran elsewhere and an OC who closes the door and dishes on things he learned about his former players' habits by virtue of having their confidence is significant. The former is simply applying his intellectual capital and expertise in a new environment; the latter is a "rat," even if the behavior is accepted. By that definition, there is no doubt that Mangini is a "rat," because he used unique knowledge of the Patriots activities, licit, illicit or whatever, to do harm to his rival and further his own agenda. In my opinion, he made a mistake in doing so because I doubt he will ever earn the trust of another HC again and, if I were the Jets management, I wouldn't trust him as far as I can throw him.

I think the animus out here against Mangini stems from a number of things beyond the obvious one under discussion: in particular, as Defensive Coordinator of the Patriots, there can be little reasonable doubt that he was complicit in the stealing of Defensive signals and reviewed their results when he was here, whatever their usefulness may or may not have been, so he's open to the charge of being a hypocrite; another, we just don't like the Jets--they're a fierce divisional rival and it's hard to imagine that we would have anything good to say about their coach--find a Yankee's fan who has anything good to say about Francona or a Sox fan who likes Torre.

I hate to spoil the fun but I like Francona b/c the way he handled the all star game with great class in regards to yankees at YS and I know a lot of red sox fans who like Torre and Mariano. heck I like David Ortiz. I also like Troy Brown.

 

[ScottieC]

I hate to spoil the fun but I like Francona b/c the way he handled the all star game with great class in regards to yankees at YS and I know a lot of red sox fans who like Torre and Mariano. heck I like David Ortiz. I also like Troy Brown.

Namath is retired. You like half the team, so come on over and become a Pats fan. It's nice to win.... a lot.

 

[K-Ro 25]

Namath is retired. You like half the team, so come on over and become a Pats fan. It's nice to win.... a lot.

lol trust me there are far more people on your team I despise then like or respect, i.e. Harrison, Wilfork, Brady, Merriweather. But I do respect Troy Brown, Tedy Bruschi, Ty Law, Vinatieri. Some how im able to put aside team preferences towards classy well performing individuals

 

[blackglass3]

lol trust me there are far more people on your team I despise then like or respect, i.e. Harrison, Wilfork, Brady, Merriweather. But I do respect Troy Brown, Tedy Bruschi, Ty Law, Vinatieri. Some how im able to put aside team preferences towards classy well performing individuals

I can understand the Brady and Harrison hate, but what have Wilfork or (especially) Meriweather ever done to anyone?

 

[K-Ro 25]

I can understand the Brady and Harrison hate, but what have Wilfork or (especially) Meriweather ever done to anyone?

maybe I was too harsh, I dont hate Meriweather. Im a Canes fan and to me he is a thug. I hate pretty much the entire Canes teams from the last 3 years and how they have tarnished the legacy that decades of great talent built up. I dont hate Wilfork he just is a nasty mo fo I would love on my team, hate playing against. It was so painful on draft day watching that man slip into Belichicks lap on draft day. If anyone can ever find his hit on Leon Washington in the Orange Bowl before he declared, he implanted him into the turf.

edit: also add Kevin Faulk to the guys I have respect for

 

[Gunnails]

I see you're relatively new to the Board, but there were few out here who held that "the Pats didn't violate any rules" and many of us even greeted with skepticism BB's claim that he "misinterpreted the rules," but gave him a big pass on that bit of possible disingenuity because he might just be the greatest HC ever.

Also, I disagree with your definition of "rat." I think that most people think of a rat as someone who shows disloyalty to an individual or group whose company and benefits they have enjoyed. One can be a "rat" by betraying trusts or secrets that are perfectly legitimate and that don't even come close to complicity in anything illicit. The difference between an OC who is "running plenty of plays" that he ran elsewhere and an OC who closes the door and dishes on things he learned about his former players' habits by virtue of having their confidence is significant. The former is simply applying his intellectual capital and expertise in a new environment; the latter is a "rat," even if the behavior is accepted. By that definition, there is no doubt that Mangini is a "rat," because he used unique knowledge of the Patriots activities, licit, illicit or whatever, to do harm to his rival and further his own agenda. In my opinion, he made a mistake in doing so because I doubt he will ever earn the trust of another HC again and, if I were the Jets management, I wouldn't trust him as far as I can throw him.

I think the animus out here against Mangini stems from a number of things beyond the obvious one under discussion: in particular, as Defensive Coordinator of the Patriots, there can be little reasonable doubt that he was complicit in the stealing of Defensive signals and reviewed their results when he was here, whatever their usefulness may or may not have been, so he's open to the charge of being a hypocrite; another, we just don't like the Jets--they're a fierce divisional rival and it's hard to imagine that we would have anything good to say about their coach--find a Yankee's fan who has anything good to say about Francona or a Sox fan who likes Torre.

========================================================

Mangini had unique knowledge, pffft, give me a break.

So Herm Edwards waving to the camera and all, but the Jets had no idea this was happening till Mangini came on board.

Maybe not everyone knew what the Pats were doing, but the league did and so did the Jets prior to Mangini.

I admit I am a homer and sometimes can't see the forest for the trees, but I still don't buy that Mangini had to rat anyone out, I would say stopping the Pats from taping from an illegal location falls more under the duties of the GM Tannenbaum.

 

[JoeSixPat]

========================================================

Mangini had unique knowledge, pffft, give me a break.

So Herm Edwards waving to the camera and all, but the Jets had no idea this was happening till Mangini came on board.

Maybe not everyone knew what the Pats were doing, but the league did and so did the Jets prior to Mangini.

I admit I am a homer and sometimes can't see the forest for the trees, but I still don't buy that Mangini had to rat anyone out, I would say stopping the Pats from taping from an illegal location falls more under the duties of the GM Tannenbaum.

I think when the full history of this is finally told, we may find out that things spiraled out of control very quickly because of the poor manner in which Mangini and others in the Jets organization handled it.

Given the nature of the tapings themselves, I have no question that Belichick used them for post game analysis - that in turn, would help him identify playcalling tendencies - and not necessarilly signals themselves - in different situations of different coaches.

Everyone knows he's a film nerd and this seems in keeping with that. Yet the practice is also in keeping with the prohibition on using video for immediate game day benefit (hence the prohibition on immediate access to video ineherent in the rule.) In that sense - and knowing that half time uploading, editing, review and analysis is pretty much impossible - it seems to me Belichick honestly can claim he was adhereing to the letter AND spirit of the rule.

Mangini would have been in his rights in filing another complaint with the league - quietly and without bringing it to the media's attention. However the way in which the events transpired seemed to quickly get away from him, with very little effort made to keep things quiet and keep it an internal league matter.

I think Mangini was initially pleased to think that there might be a disrupting factor to Belichick and the Patriots, and wasn't exactly inclined to keep it a league matter - but then I think he realized his mistake and how it adversly impacted how he personally would be perceived - both as someone who engaged in the same practice with the Patriots, potentially beneifitted from it as a result, and then declined to keep the matter internal, helping to fan the flames of "spygate" and playing a part in a crisis of confidence in the NFL - therefore also jeopardizing the significant profits that owners and all involved with the NFL benefit from.

So even as I heap disdain on Mangini - I don't think all of the subsequent fallout was part of his overall design.

 

[belichickaholic]

Is Favre gonna have to stay in the freshmen dorms?

 

[K-Ro 25]

Is Favre gonna have to stay in the freshmen dorms?

I think you mean rookie dorms, and if we got him I hope they do. If Favre has proved anything in this situation is that he is a me, prima dona player. Way to bend the Packers over backwards

 

[IcyPatriot]

This thread is somewhat reminiscent of our once famous:

"There is no way Patten Makes this team" ...

 

[TrueBeliever]

Personally I would LOOOOOVE to see that ol' hillbilly Favre go to the Jesters. He's not near as good as he thinks he is, and he'd have one helluva rude awakening in Jersey. Whereas the Packer fans worship him no matter how lousy he plays or how many picks he throws, Jesters fans will be calling for his head on a platter after the second interception.

And then the real fun would start when Mangenius tried to bench the ol' hillbilly. You think he's whining to the media now? Wait until he becomes a back-up - he'll make T.O. look like a church mouse.