Mankins penalty and a few other thoughts

[Tunescribe]

He's definitely tough as nails, and he is still a very good player.

Personally, I wonder if he's worth his current pricetag, and also if he's still the same player that he once was.

He might be hurt, who knows. Two years ago he played the whole season with a torn ACL. That is unheard of.

 

[Sticky Caulk]

I am not very good at evaluating OL play, but I think Mankins takes a lot of crap for his mistakes because the other guys make so many, when he is mostly solid. Look at the other two on the interior if you want to roast offensive linemen. Wendell and Connolly have both been underwhelming.

 

[Triumph]

Mankins is not a yapper or a showboater. He's a straight-shooter who talks only when asked. He's a damn good player, too -- tough as nails.

This team needs more guys like Mankins.

He is like Bryan Cox or Rodney Harrison. They play to the whistle (past sometimes ) and are vocal.

 

[Marinlik]

I think our interior guys have been the biggest sign of weakness for the offensive line as a whole this year, and that even includes Mankins at times--although not nearly as often as Wendell or Connelly obviously.

I like Mankins and he can be really good, but sometimes it seems like he's fallen off a bit. I suppose maybe his injury had something to do with that. I'm not sure that he's worth his pricetag anymore.

Either way, I don't see how we don't double up on interior linemen in the draft next spring. I think it's a no-brainer. As far as Wendell and Connelly, we'll find out soon enough what Belichick thinks about them staying on the team. I'm guessing it's one or the other, and the only way Connelly stays is if he restructures or is extended for a lesser cap hit.

I think that Mankins had a down year last year after playing with an injury the year before that. But when I look at the all-22 tape for the games this year Mankins opens up a lot of wholes for our runners. When he pulls he locks up the defender so he can't make the play. When he double teams he can open up holes and does a good job at getting to the second level. He is without a doubt our best interior O-line.

I think that we should draft a center pretty high in next years draft. As you said it would probably be good to double dip and get a guard too(RG). It would be nice to have a center that you can depend on. A stud.

 

[TonyTucker]

I think our interior guys have been the biggest sign of weakness for the offensive line as a whole this year, and that even includes Mankins at times--although not nearly as often as Wendell or Connelly obviously.

I like Mankins and he can be really good, but sometimes it seems like he's fallen off a bit. I suppose maybe his injury had something to do with that. I'm not sure that he's worth his pricetag anymore.

Either way, I don't see how we don't double up on interior linemen in the draft next spring. I think it's a no-brainer. As far as Wendell and Connelly, we'll find out soon enough what Belichick thinks about them staying on the team. I'm guessing it's one or the other, and the only way Connelly stays is if he restructures or is extended for a lesser cap hit.

I don't know about doubling up, but their first priority should be interior offensive line in the next draft. The offense played very well in this game, but we've had enough of a sample size over the past few years. I mean, seriously, that's all the opposing team needs? A good defensive line, and the Patriots lose? If that's the case, then they need better offensive lineman.

I could be wrong, but I almost feel like they could get away with weaker tackles with the way Brady steps up in the pocket. Yet they've addressed those positions with high picks while skimping out on center and guard. 13, 14, 17, and 6 points is enough for me.

 

[Sciz]

Just checked NFL Rewind. Between the TV version and both all-22 views, we never see what Mankins was flagged for.

Gruden says before the penalty is announced that he thinks it is hands to the face and the offense backs up like they're expected a 10 yarder, so until a fine for Mankins is announced, I'm going to call BS on that actually being a personal foul.

 

[NewFeep]

I see an offseason rebuild on the D-line and drafting a top guard as priorities. I doubt Wilfork ever plays another down but I hope I am wrong. The Carolina game would have been a sweet, sweet win, they just came up short in the end.

 

[Get it shawtaay]

Mankins: "That Johnson guy, I thought he broke his leg or was paralyzed the way he was screaming out there. But sure enough he was back in the game later."

"That Mankins guy, sure talks a lot for being paid Jahri Evans money and playing like Willie Colon"

This team needs more guys like Mankins.

He is like Bryan Cox or Rodney Harrison. They play to the whistle (past sometimes ) and are vocal.

Yeah this team needs more overpaid players. That will fix things.

 

[Jackson 2]

The OL and DL were what killed us last night, not the refs.
Our O line is not playing well as a unit and the stupid penalties they are taking are indicative of undisciplined football where they are late on blocks, missing assignments altogether and getting frustrated by it.
Newton had all day behind his line and aside form the couple of times he was sacked (what looked like coverage sacks to me) the Pats D line got nowhere near him.

We lost in the trenches last night.

Our O line kicked the shyt out of them on the running plays and Brady was sacked twice. Our D line completely shut down their running backs. Newton's scrambles accounted for 62 of their 103 yards rushing and Newton was sacked 3 times. Dumb penalties and a fumble cost us the game, along with an inability to stop them on 3rd down. I respectfully disagree that "we lost in the trenches."

 

[condon84]

You can usually count on Mankins to give you a nice 15 yard penalty in chippy game like this. Dude isn't the brightest bulb in the box.

He's also good for a holding penalty on key drives in big games too.

 

[Kontradiction]

I think our interior guys have been the biggest sign of weakness for the offensive line as a whole this year, and that even includes Mankins at times--although not nearly as often as Wendell or Connelly obviously.

I like Mankins and he can be really good, but sometimes it seems like he's fallen off a bit. I suppose maybe his injury had something to do with that. I'm not sure that he's worth his pricetag anymore.

Either way, I don't see how we don't double up on interior linemen in the draft next spring. I think it's a no-brainer. As far as Wendell and Connelly, we'll find out soon enough what Belichick thinks about them staying on the team. I'm guessing it's one or the other, and the only way Connelly stays is if he restructures or is extended for a lesser cap hit.

If the team is sure that Mankins isn't worth his price tag anymore, they had better do a better job of replacing him than they have with Koppen and Waters, or Brady is going to be taken out on a stretcher by Week 3 of next season.

 

[signbabybrady]

Am I the only one who feels the Talib play was based on bad circumstance. Sure Talib still needs to keep his cool and these two didnt cool down all night after the initial ruckus.

But when I saw the play he was flagged on I thought it was unintended. Without knowing what was said it looked to me like Talib made a tackle and Smith popped up so quick that Talib was not sure if he was down so he held onto Smith's legs for dear life. Smith knowing he was down took exception to this and a ruckus broke out with Talib getting the flag for apparently starting it by not letting Smith go.

 

[Kontradiction]

Am I the only one who feels the Talib play was based on bad circumstance. Sure Talib still needs to keep his cool and these two didnt cool down all night after the initial ruckus.

But when I saw the play he was flagged on I thought it was unintended. Without knowing what was said it looked to me like Talib made a tackle and Smith popped up so quick that Talib was not sure if he was down so he held onto Smith's legs for dear life. Smith knowing he was down took exception to this and a ruckus broke out with Talib getting the flag for apparently starting it by not letting Smith go.

You're reaching here. Talib was being a punk on that play. He would have had to have been numb all over his body to not be aware that Smith was down.

 

[signbabybrady]

You're reaching here. Talib was being a punk on that play. He would have had to have been numb all over his body to not be aware that Smith was down.

This was my initial reaction so its not like I was overthinking but I suppose I give our own guys the benifit of the doubt wihtout even thinking twice.

Just seems to me like holding onto someones leg isnt really a punk move a quick punch or ankle twist would probably go more unnoticed and would actually accomplish something. Where as holding onto a leg seems to do nothing to the opponent after the play but if did indeed think the play was still live than it makes perfect sense. But again I dont know what was said and I suppose some trash talk from Smith might have made him grab him.

 

[captain stone]

Mankin$ is an over-paid meat-head who looks good only because his linemates in the middle
are Wendy & Connolly. Unfortunately, we have nobody on the roster capable of replacing him,
unless one is OK with the stream of UDFA drek that has oozed in & out of Foxborough.

 

[Kontradiction]

This was my initial reaction so its not like I was overthinking but I suppose I give our own guys the benifit of the doubt wihtout even thinking twice.

Why? If one of our guys does something wrong that turns into a 15 yard penalty flag, they shouldn't automatically be given the benefit of the doubt because they play for the Pats.

Just seems to me like holding onto someones leg isnt really a punk move a quick punch or ankle twist would probably go more unnoticed and would actually accomplish something. Where as holding onto a leg seems to do nothing to the opponent after the play but if did indeed think the play was still live than it makes perfect sense. But again I dont know what was said and I suppose some trash talk from Smith might have made him grab him.

I agree. Punk was the wrong word. A sour grapes move would have been the better word. And trash talk doesn't excuse giving the other team 15 yards either, as BB apparently agreed when he pulled Talib to the sideline.

 

[BradyFTW!]

The OL and DL were what killed us last night, not the refs.
Our O line is not playing well as a unit and the stupid penalties they are taking are indicative of undisciplined football where they are late on blocks, missing assignments altogether and getting frustrated by it.
Newton had all day behind his line and aside form the couple of times he was sacked (what looked like coverage sacks to me) the Pats D line got nowhere near him.

We lost in the trenches last night.

I don't think it was because the line couldn't get any push; it was because they were prioritizing maintaining their gaps over getting to the QB. When they did lose their gap discipline, they got to Newton, but he promptly evaded them and ran for a ton of yards.

Re: Mankins and the penalty, I've been thoroughly underwhelmed by him for a while. he hasn't played up to his cap hit in years, he comes up small in big games, and he commits stupid penalties. I'd be in favor of cutting him this offseason for cap savings, if not for the fact that it would mean all three interior positions were undermanned. He's probably going to stick simply because he's the only interior offensive lineman who can be considered above-league-average as a starter.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Am I the only one who feels the Talib play was based on bad circumstance. Sure Talib still needs to keep his cool and these two didnt cool down all night after the initial ruckus.

But when I saw the play he was flagged on I thought it was unintended. Without knowing what was said it looked to me like Talib made a tackle and Smith popped up so quick that Talib was not sure if he was down so he held onto Smith's legs for dear life. Smith knowing he was down took exception to this and a ruckus broke out with Talib getting the flag for apparently starting it by not letting Smith go.

I'm fine with both Talib and Mankins getting the PF flags that they got. They were both incredibly stupid plays that shouldn't have happened. I do find it a bit frustrating that the Panthers went the entire game without getting a similar flag when there were a half-dozen occasions where they easily could have, but officials favoring the home team is a real thing. We've seen the benefits of it in Foxboro, although never quite as strongly as the Panthers had it on Monday night. As long as officials are 'allowed' to miss calls and exercise human discretion over this stuff, there will always be noticeable advantages for the home team.

 

[signbabybrady]

Why? If one of our guys does something wrong that turns into a 15 yard penalty flag, they shouldn't automatically be given the benefit of the doubt because they play for the Pats.

Are you really asking why I would be biased toward my home team?

I am not saying the refs should give him the benifit of the doubt. But on a play like that where I can determine him holding his leg was either him thinking the play wasnt over or him being a punk/sour grapes I will lean toward giving my guy the benifit of the doubt. Had he just jumped right up and cold clocked Smith than no benifit could be given but that wasnt the case here also I am not OK with everything that followed and he gets no benifit of the doubt for grabbing Smith face mask.

You saw it as clearly him being cheap so there would be no reason for you to give him the benifit of the doubt.

I agree. Punk was the wrong word. A sour grapes move would have been the better word. And trash talk doesn't excuse giving the other team 15 yards either, as BB apparently agreed when he pulled Talib to the sideline.

I think BB pulled him just to calm him down and I dont think it was a disciplinary thing as he was back out there fairly quick.

 

[signbabybrady]

I'm fine with both Talib and Mankins getting the PF flags that they got.

I dont disagree with throwing the flag on Talib as he, whether intentionally being cheap or incidentally thinking the play was still not over, started the ruckus. Just not sure it was something Talib intentionally did and might have just been circumstantial. Seems like I am the only one who saw this as a possibilty though.