Jimmy Johnson on WFAN

[Deus Irae]

Oh yeah, and if the Colts were taping, tell me that you would have just wanted the league to send out another memo and not take any action. C'monn, can you say it without laughing?

It would be great if some of the Patriots fans who bought into the nonsense would stop preaching and start actually thinking. This wasn't the equivalent of sneaking into to a basketball game with no ticket. Even assuming the worst, this was nothing more than moving from one seat to another in order to get a better view when there were open seats available.

This was a non-story blown way out of proportion because of the actions of the same assclown who's now regulating where cheerleaders can warm up. I find it vexing that people can't realize how over-the-top this guy has gone.

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Chris, with all due respect, in a million years this would never happen. They cannot possibly rescind the punishment. I'd love it if you were right, but this seems like a fantasy to me.

But the punishment has to fit the crime. The crime initially (i.e. September 10th) was that BB somehow violated the integrity of the game...that stealing signals was horrible. In the days leading up to the punishment, the ignorant masses and haters were informed that stealing signals itself is an old practice (personally, I'm convinced it was this knowledge that forced Godell to hold off on a suspension). However, then the outrage turned to the filming of signals and how (a) the Pats were the only team to supposedly do this and (b) it gave them a hugely unfair advantage. It was in this atmosphere when the punishment was handed down. Now it's starting to come out (thank you Jimmy Johnson) that filming signals is nothing new. As this information continues to come out and put BB's actions in proper context (instead of the massive over-reaction by the media, haters and even some Pats fans), Godell's punishment will come down to:

Violating a league memo about no cameras on sidelines = loss of a first round pick and a big fine.

In that context, Godell will indeed look like he over-reacted.

The fine will stick and a draft pick will as well since some will argue that cash-rich teams will gladly violate such rules. I think the draft pick will be reduced, though.

Regards,
Chris

 

[Pujo]

It would be great if some of the Patriots fans who bought into the nonsense would stop preaching and start actually thinking. This wasn't the equivalent of sneaking into to a basketball game with no ticket. Even assuming the worst, this was nothing more than moving from one seat to another in order to get a better view when there were open seats available.

This was a non-story blown way out of proportion because of the actions of the same assclown who's now regulating where cheerleaders can warm up. I find it vexing that people can't realize how over-the-top this guy has gone.

All I'm asking is what punishment do you feel would be appropriate for the Colts if they were caught using videotape to steal signals?

 

[Deus Irae]

All I'm asking is what punishment do you feel would be appropriate for the Colts if they were caught using videotape to steal signals?

A small fine would have been more than sufficient, with the admonition that any further incidents would provoke heavier punishment. That "heavier punishment" could then have been laid out in a memo. Again, all that happened was that taping was done in a forbidden location. Taping itself is NOT forbidden, despite the claims of some.

From the text of the release:

NFL policy states that “no video recording devices of any kind are permitted to be in use in the coaches’ booth, on the field, or in the locker room during the game” and that all video shooting locations for club coaching purposes “must be enclosed on all sides with a roof overhead.”

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Article.php?Page=1635


Stealing signs is not against the rules. Taping is NOT against the rules. All that was violative of the memo/rule is the location being taped from. That's it, nothing more.

 

[Pujo]

Stealing signs is not against the rules. Taping is NOT against the rules. All that was violative of the memo/rule is the location being taped from. That's it, nothing more.

And the reason those locations were banned was because the NFL's owners thought that it gave teams an unfair advantage. It's not something general like sign stealing, the Patriots broke a specific rule that specifically said what they shouldn't do.

 

[Deus Irae]

And the reason those locations were banned was because the NFL's owners thought that it gave teams an unfair advantage.

Could you kindly show me the proof behind that assertion? I've never seen it.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's not something general like sign stealing, the Patriots broke a specific rule that specifically said what they shouldn't do.

Under that argument, they should be taking away draft picks from teams who have players with their shirts not in precisely the proper alignment. Probably nothing is more specific in the No Fun League than the rules governing the uniform, after all.

 

[Pujo]

Could you kindly show me the proof behind that assertion? I've never seen it.

It's a rule, that implies there's a competitive reason for it. Else there would be no rule.

 

[Pujo]

Under that argument, they should be taking away draft picks from teams who have players with their shirts not in precisely the proper alignment. Probably nothing is more specific in the No Fun League than the rules governing the uniform, after all.

I suppose if it fits within the bylaws, the commissioner could dock a team draft picks for uniform violations, but then he wouldn't be commissioner for very long. Obviously the ownership agrees with him, and that's who he works for.

 

[Deus Irae]

It's a rule, that implies there's a competitive reason for it. Else there would be no rule.

Really? What's the competitive competitive edge gained by, for example, a quarterback using #295 as a number?

 

[Deus Irae]

I suppose if it fits within the bylaws, the commissioner could dock a team draft picks for uniform violations, but then he wouldn't be commissioner for very long. Obviously the ownership agrees with him, and that's who he works for.

Again, do you have proof of this "ownership agrees with him" theory when it comes to the penalty doled out to New England?

 

[Pujo]

Really? What's the competitive competitive edge gained by, for example, a quarterback using #295 as a number?

That rule exists so the game can run smoothly, by making it easier on officials to identify players. Yeah, I agree it doesn't do much for competition, but the video rule is not in the same category. Clearly it relates to some kind of advantage that one team would get over the other. Hey, why the reason for the steroids rule?

 

[Pujo]

Again, do you have proof of this "ownership agrees with him" theory when it comes to the penalty doled out to New England?

Well, nobody's calling for his head except a few fans who would probably forgive their team for murder. I guess we'll see when it's time to renew his contract if the ownership feels like he's a tyrant. Care to speculate on how that'll work out?

 

[Deus Irae]

That rule exists so the game can run smoothly, by making it easier on officials to identify players. Yeah, I agree it doesn't do much for competition, but the video rule is not in the same category. Clearly it relates to some kind of advantage that one team would get over the other. Hey, why the reason for the steroids rule?

The steroids rule is not the issue. You made a ridiculous assertion. Instead of compounding that by now equating the location of a camera with the utilization of steroids, just admit that your argument regarding the reasoning behind rules was not accurate:

It's a rule, that implies there's a competitive reason for it. Else there would be no rule.

This is what I mean by the Patriots fans who aren't thinking.

 

[Deus Irae]

Well, nobody's calling for his head except a few fans who would probably forgive their team for murder. I guess we'll see when it's time to renew his contract if the ownership feels like he's a tyrant. Care to speculate on how that'll work out?

I don't need to speculate. You're doing far too much of it already. His contract was recently extended, so your argument has fallen even prior to your making it.

 

[Pujo]

The steroids rule is not the issue. You made a ridiculous assertion. Instead of compounding that by now equating the location of a camera with the utilization of steroids, just admit that your argument regarding the reasoning behind rules was not accurate:





This is what I mean by the Patriots fans who aren't thinking.

Yup, you mean me. I overgeneralized "rules", but everything I said still stands for this rule. It wasn't made because they didn't want the deffensive coordinator being caught on film on a bad hair day, it was made so one team could not get a certain advantage over another. You can contest that if you want, but it's as clear as day.

 

[Pujo]

I don't need to speculate. You're doing far too much of it already. His contract was recently extended, so your argument has fallen even prior to your making it.

So he won't be up for another extention again? Anyway, I'll wait until I hear of the outrage from the owners, until then I'll assume none.

 

[JoeSixPat]

There are going to be a lot of people with egg on their faces as the cameragate brouha settles down. Jimmy Johnson's comments are not surprising one bit.

Godell was smart not to suspend BB, for you can't take back a suspension. He can take back his decision to penalize the Pats a first-round pick, though. It wouldn't surprise me if a statement comes out later this year that he's reconsidered the punishment and decided to take a 3rd or lesser round pick instead. Comments like Jimmy's will show that what BB did was not as outrageous (and unique) as initially thought (and magnified by the haters) and I don't think Jimmy will be the last to say such things.

Regards,
Chris

Johnson said these same things 2 weeks ago. Nearly every member of the media who acted so righteous opposed to "cheating" will not go near them as it makes them look like idiots.

Most team fans from other teams too can't bring themsleves to accept that Tony Dungy's assistant was the "best" at videotaping signals

So everyone will continue to delude themselves and continue on the "cheating" bandwagon regardless of the truth.

I've long ago stopped worrying about what anyone in the media, or what other ignorant or deluded fans think

Belichick knows what the truth is - Jimmy Johnson knows what the truth is - all the members of the Patriots know what the truth is - and we know what the truth is - the truth just doesn't happen to fit in with the way the media and other team fans WANT the truth to be

The only thing we can do is whip each and every team and shove this down their throats!

 

[shmessy]

All I'm asking is what punishment do you feel would be appropriate for the Colts if they were caught using videotape to steal signals?

Not as large a penalty as one for a team that jacks up the temperature to 85% in a Dome when the other team has 12 players with the flu.

 

[Pujo]

Not as large a penalty as one for a team that jacks up the temperature to 85% in a Dome when the other team has 12 players with the flu.

Would you doubt that the Pats do the same thing? More importantly, are you aware of an explicit rule against it?