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you answered yourself

How does taping on the sideline give them an advantage when they could tape from 5 feet behind the sidelines in the stands?

What greater advantage can you get from standing on the sidelines?

I can only think of one: you save the $75 ticket for the seat in the stands.

Otherwise, it gives you no advantage. They violated a rule emphasized by Goodell. That's all they did.

Without a doubt, they were filming to steal signs for future games. But that is not illegal.
 
if it wasn't gonna give us a competitive advantage at some point, then why was BB risking a penalty by doing it? he would have to be an idiot to risk a penalty for NO potential gain.

either he's an idiot, or it was going to give us some advantage at some point.

I'm going with competitive advantage, you can go with idiot. your choice.

If the NFL said they gained no competitive advantage, then it is fact, not opinion.

Are you a Patriots fan MWH?
 
if it wasn't gonna give us a competitive advantage at some point, then why was BB risking a penalty by doing it? he would have to be an idiot to risk a penalty for NO potential gain.

either he's an idiot, or it was going to give us some advantage at some point.

I'm going with competitive advantage, you can go with idiot. your choice.

It was a matter of convenience from the sidelines instead of the press box where it is legal, and in a culture of "everyone does it" that can blur the morality lines that the media has since clearly drawn.

The best analogy I can think of is downloading MP3s. I don't know how old you are but I'm 24 and in High School literally everyone I knew downloading songs illegally. Was it wrong/stealing? technically yes, but no one was taking a moral stand until it became a huge controversy. All of a sudden the RIAA started going after individuals, suing the mother of some 12 year old $125k or something like that to make an example of her and scare other people. It worked, and while illegal downloads are still around, they have been marginalized by the fear that what happened to people that were made an example of could happen to you. It's the same story with BB.

If you readThe Education of a Coach you'll see that BB is obsessed with breaking down film, and would pursue scouting and breaking down film to an extent that the vast majority of other coaches would find useless. Since you can tape defensive signals legally from the press box, and can visibly observe them on the field, I honestly believe that he felt the spirit of the rule was to prevent use of the tapes in-game, which many feel is impossible anyway, and that if it was against the rules, it wasn't such an enormous violation as the press has made it out to be because no one really cared anyway until Mangini used it to screw him. Then the media went crazy with it and those that had been beaten badly by the Pats in the past or felt slighted by them piled on, as did the fans who are proned to use anything against a team they hate. Goodell was forced to go overboard with the punishment because the media was driving the story so hard and whipping all the fans into a frenzy.

This is what I honestly believe happened here. If I was a fan of another team would I believe this? probably not, because a) I would have no reason to believe it and b) The idea of the team that has kicked our asses every year being cheaters is too juicy to let go of.

I strongly suggest that everyone read The Education of a Coach as it gives great insight into BB as an former college athlete who had a problem with an assistant coach in college teaching the chop block and a coach who has been wary and standoffish with the media since Tennessee media politics forced his father's ouster as an assistant at Vanderbilt despite their success on the field. The gulf between the image the media has painted of BB and the portrait this book creates is so great that it truly scares me just how powerful the media is in shaping public opinion.
 
How did they break an NFL rule to gain advantage at some other point?

The NFL has no rule against videotaping a coach's signals to gain advantage at some other point. The NFL is not against that in the least.

They are only against taping on the sidelines.

And if you think that the NFL's punishment implies something bigger than the simple fact that Bill Belichick arrogantly defied Goodell's little memo, and Goodell subsequently got his panties in a bunch, you're mistaken.

Beautiful point!
 
How does taping on the sideline give them an advantage when they could tape from 5 feet behind the sidelines in the stands?

the Pats obviously know of one, otherwise they wouldn't have risked a penalty to do it. otherwise it would have made zero sense to do and I don't think BB is a foolish idiot.
 
the Pats obviously know of one, otherwise they wouldn't have risked a penalty to do it. otherwise it would have made zero sense to do and I don't think BB is a foolish idiot.

Not an idiot, but stubborn as a MF'r!!
 
If the NFL said they gained no competitive advantage, then it is fact, not opinion.


ok, but here is what he said:

"This episode represents a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid longstanding rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field"

Are you a Patriots fan MWH?

yes. I realize that criticizing BB normally isn't allowed around here.
 
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the Pats obviously know of one, otherwise they wouldn't have risked a penalty to do it. otherwise it would have made zero sense to do and I don't think BB is a foolish idiot.

Speculate. Do you have an imagination?

I think it's a lot more likely that Belichick read the rulesw for what they are: stupid and hypocritical that you would allow stealing from one point but not for another. I also think Belichick was none too pleased when he heard the NFL's Steve Alic say, "That's football!" after the Dolphins stole signals last year.

BB is no nonsense. His whole attitude was, "What the eff is the difference?"

You tell me why the NFL says you can steal them from there, but not from here. Go ahead.
 
I read the Education of a Coach. good read. (though I liked Patriot Reign better).

but this isnt about BB and the media. it's about BB breaking a very clear rule and being punished for it. very black and white.
 
I read the Education of a Coach. good read. (though I liked Patriot Reign better).

but this isnt about BB and the media. it's about BB breaking a very clear rule and being punished for it. very black and white.

No it's not black and white. That was my whole point. Nothing in life ever is.
 
Speculate. Do you have an imagination?

You tell me why the NFL says you can steal them from there, but not from here. Go ahead.

maybe they can get the best angle from right there on the sideline. it's also possible they can pick up sound better from there.

as you say, I'm just speculating. but clearly there is a reason, otherwise BB wouldn't have done it.
 
I cannot believe that the crybabies are still talking about this. As a Broncos fan I am sure that most fans around the country wish they had a squad and front office like the Pats.

And Paul Spicer and all these other guys still mentioning spygate is akin to Andy Rooney discussing the Apple Iphone...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqAanABwslo

and Tomlinsnot and CrymeaRivers will get molested this weekend, with or without Harrison.
 
maybe they can get the best angle from right there on the sideline. it's also possible they can pick up sound better from there.

as you say, I'm just speculating. but clearly there is a reason, otherwise BB wouldn't have done it.

There is also a reason why I do 55 in a 45 zone. But because I break a speeding rule/law doesn't mean I'm an axe murderer.
 
maybe they can get the best angle from right there on the sideline. it's also possible they can pick up sound better from there.

as you say, I'm just speculating. but clearly there is a reason, otherwise BB wouldn't have done it.

Or it's more convenient. If you really read the Education of a Coach I can't believe you don't see BB's infatuation with breaking down fil to an extent that other coaches wouldn't bother doing.
 
ok, but here is what he said:

"This episode represents a calculated and deliberate attempt to avoid longstanding rules designed to encourage fair play and promote honest competition on the playing field"

Well, then Goodell is a liar. Show me the rule.

Where is this rule?

He says there are longstanding rules promoting fair play, but he didn't cite them. Not at all.

In fact, during the interview prior to the Chargers game, Costas asked him point blank: "What is the NFL going to do to police the use of hi-tech gadgets, recording binoculars for instance, to prevent teams from stealing signals from a cloaked position?"

Goodell: "This wasn't a hi-tech gadget, and it was done out in the open."

If you think Goodell is operating as some sort of judge here in a court of law, you're wrong. He's operating as a CEO of a corporation, and in this case, he's clearly only worried about public relations and appearances. He said as much himself in the Costas interview. There is no law about fair play. He only cited a law that doesn't exist because he's worried about the NFL's rep. If this rule exists, show it to me. I'll admit I'm wrong. But since I've never seen it cited, I don't think I am. And if there were such a rule then why would the NFL defend other teams that were caught stealing (Jets, Dolphins?)?
 
maybe they can get the best angle from right there on the sideline. it's also possible they can pick up sound better from there.

as you say, I'm just speculating. but clearly there is a reason, otherwise BB wouldn't have done it.

BB did it to spite the league for its hypocritical rule that was all about public relations.
 
Well, then Goodell is a liar. Show me the rule.

Where is this rule?

"“Video taping of any type, including but not limited to taping of an opponent’s offensive or defensive signals, is prohibited on the sidelines, in the coaches’ booth, in the locker room, or at any other locations accessible to club staff members during the game.”"
 
Or it's more convenient. If you really read the Education of a Coach I can't believe you don't see BB's infatuation with breaking down fil to an extent that other coaches wouldn't bother doing.

just b/c you're infatuated with doing something doesn't mean it's ok to do from a place the NFL clearly disallows.

I mean I love tits, but I can't just squeeze girls on the street.
 
just b/c you're infatuated with doing something doesn't mean it's ok to do from a place the NFL clearly disallows.

I mean I love tits, but I can't just squeeze girls on the street.

I love that there is no degree of immoral with you. Sppeding and murder, it's all the same right?
 
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