If PSU gets the Death Penalty What Happens to O'Brien?

[ausbacker]

So why will the NCAA be penalizing only the football program? If football and the university are not exclusive, why isn't every sport getting punished? Why don't we also let the NCAA cut the budget of every academic department in which a Penn State football player has taken a class since the scandal started?

Punishing administrators involved in the cover up implicates the university at a wider level as well as specifically targeting the football program.

 

[robbomango]

The only sane thing to do in Mcqueary's situation was to beat Sandusky to a bloody pulp with a football helmet and drag the rotten sack of flesh to the police station.

Sorry, totally OT, it still irritates me

 

[Deus Irae]

Sometimes the system doesn't produce the sanctions which are commensurate with the crime. In extreme cases such as this one, the "lynch mob" may be the only recourse which seems justified.

This isn't about anything commensurate with a crime. If that were the case, it would be a bunch of people saying "Let the criminal justice system handle this".

This is about a bunch of idiots screaming for blood.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Back to the OP's original line of inquiry...

Darren Rovell just tweeted that per BoB's contract he would have to come up with $4M in 30 days to buy his way out of his Penn State contract...under all but limited conditions due to his incapacity or death...

Supposedly he is meeting tonight with his QB who is mulling over what he will do... And Mort (who championed the hiring) is tweeting that BoB remains the best man for the job of guiding Penn State Football through whatever is coming.

 

[TyronePoole]

If his contract is really that strongly in favor of PSU and the punishments metered out are anywhere close to what's been discussed then this seems to me like a massive career blunder for him. Basically he went from a position in the NFL from which teams seem to pluck HCs like berries every few years to a college football program in massive decline with a mandated inability to become competitive.

how much $ has he already been paid by them?

 

[ausbacker]

This isn't about anything commensurate with a crime. If that were the case, it would be a bunch of people saying "Let the criminal justice system handle this".

This is about a bunch of idiots screaming for blood.

Perhaps people don't have faith in what they may see as an imperfect criminal justice system?

 

[Crazy Patriot Guy]

Perhaps people don't have faith in what they may see as an imperfect criminal justice system?

Fair enough, but that doesn't give the NCAA the right to hand out penalties, then later change the rules saying they had the authority to hand out those penalties.

 

[ausbacker]

Fair enough, but that doesn't give the NCAA the right to hand out penalties, then later change the rules saying they had the authority to hand out those penalties.

In theory I agree with you however, this case is a special circumstance. Do you not agree that the NCAA should be able to make special consideration for circumstances as such? If anything, I would hope the NCAA improves their official documentation, policies, procedure and scope (under consensus) to deal with cases lacking precedent.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

If his contract is really that strongly in favor of PSU and the punishments metered out are anywhere close to what's been discussed then this seems to me like a massive career blunder for him. Basically he went from a position in the NFL from which teams seem to pluck HCs like berries every few years to a college football program in massive decline with a mandated inability to become competitive.

how much $ has he already been paid by them?

Not much, he makes about a million a year plus about another half a million in school related endorsement deals and on doing a coaches show. It's a penalty designed to give college coaches who bail with regularity for NFL or bigger college gigs pause. BoB rolled the dice on this one. He never would have landed a high profile college gig like this under other circumstances (no one else wanted it because of the potential for toxic fallout). And maybe he knew that there wasn't a HC gig on the horizen this year and there was a good chance Josh was heading back this way whether he remained or not... Maybe he's OK with banking his money for 3 years to HC a college program that can't place any pressure on him to win under the circumstances and then seeing what else is out there. Either as a college HC or an NFL OC. He will probably have a cadre of supporters then pulling for him like Mort to help pave the way for his return to competitive football based on his integrity in seeing through an impossible job. And unless the shock value of the NCAA action finally shakes the foundation of that culture, maybe folks in Happy Valley come to revere him to the point he becomes their next icon...

If nothing else this should become a lesson for all those who rant and wail about life not being fair. No one ever guaranteed it would be.

 

[Crazy Patriot Guy]

In theory I agree with you however, this case is a special circumstance. Do you not agree that the NCAA should be able to make special consideration for circumstances as such? If anything, I would hope the NCAA improves their official documentation, policies, procedure and scope (under consensus) to deal with cases lacking precedent.

I'd like to think the NCAA would need to first have rules in place before acting on them. If it meant Penn State would go unpunished by the NCAA, so be it.

As it is, I still don't think this is a NCAA issue. The whole purpose of the NCAA is to create an even, fair playing field throughout athletics. What advantage did the coverup give Penn State? It did not increase their odds of winning or landing a recruit over the odds before the scandal happened. So again, where does the NCAA fit in this?

 

[ausbacker]

I'd like to think the NCAA would need to first have rules in place before acting on them. If it meant Penn State would go unpunished by the NCAA, so be it.

As it is, I still don't think this is a NCAA issue. The whole purpose of the NCAA is to create an even, fair playing field throughout athletics. What advantage did the coverup give Penn State? It did not increase their odds of winning or landing a recruit over the odds before the scandal happened. So again, where does the NCAA fit in this?

The NCAA is part of society which fits under US jurisdiction? I can't fathom the idea that the NCAA should do nothing. Perhaps the NCAA needs to establish an independent body to deal with notions as such?

As for the rules and procedures I tend to agree with you but in this case, special dispensation to act should be granted in my opinion. Personally, I don't trust justice systems. They're imperfect and we accept them because we have to.

 

[TyronePoole]

Not much, he makes about a million a year plus about another half a million in school related endorsement deals and on doing a coaches show. It's a penalty designed to give college coaches who bail with regularity for NFL or bigger college gigs pause. BoB rolled the dice on this one. He never would have landed a high profile college gig like this under other circumstances (no one else wanted it because of the potential for toxic fallout). And maybe he knew that there wasn't a HC gig on the horizen this year and there was a good chance Josh was heading back this way whether he remained or not... Maybe he's OK with banking his money for 3 years to HC a college program that can't place any pressure on him to win under the circumstances and then seeing what else is out there. Either as a college HC or an NFL OC. He will probably have a cadre of supporters then pulling for him like Mort to help pave the way for his return to competitive football based on his integrity in seeing through an impossible job. And unless the shock value of the NCAA action finally shakes the foundation of that culture, maybe folks in Happy Valley come to revere him to the point he becomes their next icon...

If nothing else this should become a lesson for all those who rant and wail about life not being fair. No one ever guaranteed it would be.

I agree if it's true that McD was coming back regardless, but I'm not so sure I believe that.

If McD wasn't coming back and he was going to be the OC, then it really was a roll of the dice that imo, seems to have failed. Sure he has his supporters, but if he has to spend 3-4 years now with a program that can't recruit and can't go to bowl games he might come back to an NFL where his allies are all but gone. At best it seems like all he did was put his NFL OC position on pause for a few years, unless somehow he goes on to become a big time NCAA coach or something. As you point out though, you can't rule out the possibility that the good money and low pressure situation is still appealing despite his career ambitions.

I guess for me this does hinge on what the final fallout is from this, both in penalties and other consequences in regards to the prestige of the program, so I'll wait until that to really see.

 

[Koma]

The only sane thing to do in Mcqueary's situation was to beat Sandusky to a bloody pulp with a football helmet and drag the rotten sack of flesh to the police station.

Sorry, totally OT, it still irritates me

I'd like to think that's what I would do in that situation, but after having months to think about it, I'm not sure. The prospect of actually having to fight a naked and aroused Sandusky might have made me hesitate. I would hope that I did more than McQueary.

Lou Merloni made a good point about this when the story first came out. McQueary said he made sure that the crime between Sandusky and the boy stopped. Merloni's question was (paraphrasing) "Then what? The kid was 10 years old. What's he going to do? Ride his bike home?" McQueary does "something" to stop the assault him the shower and then leaves the victim to go home with the guy who was just raping him.

And then he proceeds to keep working at PSU for the next decade, knowing nothing happened to Sandusky and he just keeps his mouth shut.

The ironic thing is that if McQueary walked in on Sandusky handing the keys for a sports car to a 5 star recruit, things would have been handled much differently, because that definitely would have been a NCAA violation and a threat to the football program.

 

[TyronePoole]

There's a lot of cases where the public second guesses someone put in a tough position but I really don't think this is one of them. McQueary was a coward who was clearly weighing his career in how he responded to what he saw. I would never feign to say silly things about what I would have done if I was on United flight 93 or in the movie theater in Aurora, but if I was in McQueary's shoes I 100% would have acted very differently.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Iowa president: Big Ten might also punish Penn State

 

[Deus Irae]

In theory I agree with you however, this case is a special circumstance. Do you not agree that the NCAA should be able to make special consideration for circumstances as such?

Absolutely not

 

[ausbacker]

Absolutely not

That's a thought provoking response.

 

[BradyManny]

I believe that constitutions, charters and their ilk should actually mean something, should be restricted only to what they cover, and should not be used as excuses for power grabs (which is all this would be). I'm old-fashioned that way.

Well, I can't lie, I don't know anything about the legal issues at stake here and what the NCAA can or cannot do - and I realize you have a much better grasp of that than me.

I'm just going based on my own common sense - and I don't have a problem with the NCAA heavily penalizing a member of its association for egregious violations of the ethical code and culture it aims for. The NCAA has a right to look out for the NCAA.

Just like I don't have a problem with Goodell punishing players for reflecting poorly on the NFL - but again, I don't truly know the relationship between NCAA and team, or how that relates to the Goodell example.

There's clearly going to be nothing about this in any charters for this specific situation. But, like I said above, we have at least one example of them policing culture - so there is SOME precedence.

 

[Deus Irae]

Well, I can't lie, I don't know anything about the legal issues at stake here and what the NCAA can or cannot do - and I realize you have a much better grasp of that than me.

I'm just going based on my own common sense - and I don't have a problem with the NCAA heavily penalizing a member of its association for egregious violations of the ethical code and culture it aims for. The NCAA has a right to look out for the NCAA.

Just like I don't have a problem with Goodell punishing players for reflecting poorly on the NFL - but again, I don't truly know the relationship between NCAA and team, or how that relates to the Goodell example.

There's clearly going to be nothing about this in any charters for this specific situation. But, like I said above, we have at least one example of them policing culture - so there is SOME precedence.

Don't get me started on the name thing. That was absurd, and the NCAA should have been dissolved the moment they even talked about implementing that. But at least that had a tenuous link to the actual sports, given that the names would be there for all to see at every game. Even that thin a tie is absent here.

 

[Deus Irae]

That's a thought provoking response.

:confused2:

Every bit as much as the question, I'd say.