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patfanken

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....in the other fellows yard...."

That was a ditty that was the theme song of Big Brother Bob Emery, who used to have a kids TV show in Boston back in the 50's when I was growing up. Somehow, as I watched the early games that song came to mind. I think this weekend was a great lesson for all of us.

I wonder if all the "chicken littles" feel a bit better about those "unsatisfying" wins against KC, Skins, Colts, and Eagles after watching those teams beat supposedly "better teams". Maybe....just maybe, people will start to realize that EVERY team in this league have very good football players, and winning ANY game is an major accomplishment, even though "some" fans and mediots demand not only victories, but style points as well. :rolleyes:

I can hardly wait for all those who anointed the Packers as the uber team, to break their ankles coming off that bandwagon with columns announcing that KC has given the rest of the league the "blueprint" to stopping the Packer offense :rolleyes:

The point I am making is that the adage "on any given Sunday" is a reality in the NFL and those of us who have gotten overly spoiled and demanding of our team "take a chill pill" and appreciate what he are experiencing here. And understand that while our obviously flawed team can be beaten by any of the teams that make the playoffs, they also can just as easily beat any....and I repeat....ANY of those teams as well.

Just sayin' Now on to specifics on this game. Lots of very goods and some very bads.

1. As I kid I snuck into BU field to watch the original 1960 Patriots, before I ever played organized football, and what I saw in the first quarter of the Denver game was the WORST run defense I have ever seen in the entire 52 seasons I have watched this team. Is that bad enough for you.

However, as those of you who participated in the game day thread can attest, I wasn't that worried. Very concerned, but not worried. 2 things I learned in my decade plus of coaching. One, the more a team sees running plays, the better they adjust and start to do better. Two, Very early on I could clearly see the technical flaws that were causing a great deal of the problems

Interestingly enough both were very simple and I have taught them myself on the HS level.
First I saw Tracy White on several occasions and Dane Fletcher on at least one occasion take on their blockers with the WRONG shoulder. When you are playing gap control, you need to take on the blocker with your INSIDE shoulder, keeping our outside arm free. White consistently took on blocks with his outside shoulder, and what that does is open the hole another half gap. And that was why the Denver RBs seem to have such huge holes to run through in that first quarter.

The second was because the ILBs, especially in odd alignments, when they are lined up over the Gs, were NOT reading the basic keys that 3-4 ILBs have been reading since Bud Wilkerson developed the "Okie" defense nack in the early 50's

When a G blocks down or out, the ILB is supposed to FILL that hole and meet the block ON the LOS or, even better, behind the LOS. On several occasions I saw Pats ILBs waiting 5 yds beyond the LOS for the blockers to get to them, instead of attacking the line. By waiting they just open up the hole to the exent that all they can do is arm tackle, if that. Compound that with taking on the blocks with the wrong shoulder and it was clear to me why the holes were so big and the Broncos wracked up close to 200yd are rushing in the first quarter

It was also clear to me that the Pats coaching staff is good enough to see it as well. In the 2nd half I saw a couple of time where Fletcher and Mayo both stepped up into the hole. Not as aggressively as I would have liked, but much...much better than in that first quarter. White never really did it correctly and it shouldn't be surprising since at best he's a coverage LB, whom BB had playing simply because he had some speed to chase Tebow around.

Thus that is why you could see that after the 2nd quarter, for the most part, all those 10-20 yard runs we gave up started to become 3-6 yd runs later in the game, AND when the Pats got 2+ scores ahead, they could almost forget about the option. So by the end of the game the 255 the Bronco's gained doesn't seem so bad when you consider they got over 180 of them in the first quarter.

2. A far more important stat than the 255 yds the Bronco's got rushing or the 200 yds that Tebow got throwing the ball, was the fact the after the Denver FG that gave them a 16-7 lead, the Pats outscored the Bronco's 34-7. Sorry guys but that is an ass kicking in anyone's league.

3. Kudos to the OL. With 2 exceptions the OL gave Brady ALL the time he needed to shred the Bronco's D. The only 2 time Brady really got hit was when blitzes caused confusion and men got in scott free. With the Dummerville sack being the only real mistake. I think the error was in the call of the blocking scheme.

It looked to me like Solder was supposed to take the man on the LOS lined up right over him, and Waters, who was uncovered, was supposed to take the outside guy. Whomever made the call, made a bad one, because Waters had NO chance to get to Dummerville before he pancaked Brady. Whoever made the call was responsible.

But taken into the context of the entire game, Brady was relatively contact free.

4. Even though one should be satisfied with 145 yds rushing, I'm still not really happy with the OL push in the running game. The Pats used a heavy formation with a right side of Wathers, Cannon, and Solder as the TE. I would like to see more movement when this combination is in play. There were times when the Pats add BOTH Gronk and Hernandez just outside this and while we made some yds with this formation, it just seemed too hard.

5. Does anyone else seem to think that BJGE has started to become too patient and isn't hitting the holes as hard as he has in the past. On the other hand, Ridley looked awfully good as well as Woodhead. Both averaged close to 6ypc. Ridley picking up 18 yds on 3 carries vs a defense expecting the run was particularly impressive as was Danny's TD run.

6. An Ocho TD and an Underwood catch for a key first down. Will wonders ever cease.

7. I would like to see Brady be more willing to throw the ball more to his RBs, even if they are simple dump offs. Patience is a virtue. plus our RBs can catch the ball.. More screens would make me happy as well.

8. I hate to think that after all his years playing with losing teams, Andre Carter after finally coming to a winner and resurrecting his career, will not be able to play in a Superbowl run he so richly deserves. And that's not mentioning how important he is to the defense.

9. Anderson and Ninkovitch had superb games. Both rushed the passer well, both made big plays, and both improved against the run as the game went on. The Pats had 4 sacks and these 2 guys had 3 of them, and almost had a few more.

10. I thought Tebow played better than I expected. He threw a few balls that were very accurate and didn't miss a lot of open receivers. He is a powerful runner. Much stronger than you'd expect. So many times now he has shaken tackles after the first hit. If he can survive the contact and continues to develop his passing skills, he can be a very effective QB in this league because of his unique skills and having the advantage of running a unique offense that each opponent will face only once a year. Now Denver has to surround him with players that complement his talents.

11. I now think John Fox is a f*cking assh#le. He was such a whiny b!tch that I think he must have been a Jet fan in a past life. After whining about every call that went against the Broncos (all of which were shown to be overt and easy calls) his little sarcastic cheer when the Pats were called with a critical penalty made me want to slap him.

Then when he called all those TO so he to try to rack up some more garbage yards in the last minute of the game, I wanted to punch him in the mouth. I would have gone crazy if a Pats player had gotten hurt in those 4 useless plays. I would have fired his ass, if he'd gotten one of his own players hurt. What a punk.

I have a few more thoughts, but this is a good start. The others I'm sure will be brought up by others and we'll discuss them. With SD up 17-7 it looks more and more that we will get that Bye. So I guess I'll just post this and go over to a Jets board and feel their pain and let you make some comments. Ain't I a stinker. ;)
 
yeah...I saw the LB's being leveraged out on the wrong side of the O linemens shoulders in the first quarter...I was sitting with my older brother and said "Bill better get this straightened out fast...there's a flaw in the D gameplan.."..well, BB did get it straightened out and if you noticed he was constantly getting the D unit together and instructing them on the sideline during the second quarter...in the third quarter I could see the game was over barring unforeseen turnovers...the last seven minutes of socalled "Tebow Time" was a clinic on rush and contain by the D front. One thing I think is very fortunate for this squad THIS season is the depth on the D line...keep your fingers crossed it stays that way
 
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Good comments by both of you guys.

I have to agree completely about Fox being a jerk calling those time outs.

There was no way that Denver was going to win. Period. End of story. The only thing those TO's did was to prolong the agony and risk further injury to all the players on the field.

It's one thing to call those TO's when you are down by one, or maybe two scores and there is a chance to score and then try an onside kick.

There was NO chance that his team was going to pull a rabbit out of their's or anyone else's hat so prolonging the game and thus the opportunity for injury is selfish and uncalled for.

Coaches and players have long memories. Fox sewed a lot of bad karma with his adolescent sideline antics and those end-of-game time outs. Those don't bode well for his or his team's future.
 
3. Kudos to the OL. With 2 exceptions the OL gave Brady ALL the time he needed to shred the Bronco's D. The only 2 time Brady really got hit was when blitzes caused confusion and men got in scott free. With the Dummerville sack being the only real mistake. I think the error was in the call of the blocking scheme.

It looked to me like Solder was supposed to take the man on the LOS lined up right over him, and Waters, who was uncovered, was supposed to take the outside guy. Whomever made the call, made a bad one, because Waters had NO chance to get to Dummerville before he pancaked Brady. Whoever made the call was responsible.

But taken into the context of the entire game, Brady was relatively contact free.

4. Even though one should be satisfied with 145 yds rushing, I'm still not really happy with the OL push in the running game. The Pats used a heavy formation with a right side of Wathers, Cannon, and Solder as the TE. I would like to see more movement when this combination is in play. There were times when the Pats add BOTH Gronk and Hernandez just outside this and while we made some yds with this formation, it just seemed too hard.

5. Does anyone else seem to think that BJGE has started to become too patient and isn't hitting the holes as hard as he has in the past. On the other hand, Ridley looked awfully good as well as Woodhead. Both averaged close to 6ypc. Ridley picking up 18 yds on 3 carries vs a defense expecting the run was particularly impressive as was Danny's TD run.

6. An Ocho TD and an Underwood catch for a key first down. Will wonders ever cease.

7. I would like to see Brady be more willing to throw the ball more to his RBs, even if they are simple dump offs. Patience is a virtue. plus our RBs can catch the ball.. More screens would make me happy as well.

8. I hate to think that after all his years playing with losing teams, Andre Carter after finally coming to a winner and resurrecting his career, will not be able to play in a Superbowl run he so richly deserves. And that's not mentioning how important he is to the defense.

9. Anderson and Ninkovitch had superb games. Both rushed the passer well, both made big plays, and both improved against the run as the game went on. The Pats had 4 sacks and these 2 guys had 3 of them, and almost had a few more.

10. I thought Tebow played better than I expected. He threw a few balls that were very accurate and didn't miss a lot of open receivers. He is a powerful runner. Much stronger than you'd expect. So many times now he has shaken tackles after the first hit. If he can survive the contact and continues to develop his passing skills, he can be a very effective QB in this league because of his unique skills and having the advantage of running a unique offense that each opponent will face only once a year. Now Denver has to surround him with players that complement his talents.

11. I now think John Fox is a f*cking assh#le. He was such a whiny b!tch that I think he must have been a Jet fan in a past life. After whining about every call that went against the Broncos (all of which were shown to be overt and easy calls) his little sarcastic cheer when the Pats were called with a critical penalty made me want to slap him.

Agreed on #3. If the OL can match that performance throughout the playoffs, the Patriots definitely won't lose due to a lack of scoring.

On #4, I would disagree simply because when it was Riddley, the run game looked potent. With BJGE, it looked poor. I'm beginning to worry about BJGE's effectiveness too (as you noted in #5). I don't know how BB doesn't try to give more reps to Riddley over the next two weeks. Let's see if he can get into a rhythm.

on #7, the TE's are getting it done, is there room/a need for more passing to the RB's?

On #9, I though Ninko made several tough mistakes in the first quarter.

on #10, Tebow played the first quarter like he had played the fourth quarters in other games (better actually). But I think he is not ready to run a dink and dunk pass game (what the Patriots have been giving up regularly) against a better team.

On #11, ABSOLUTELY agree regarding your comments about Coach Fox. He easily overtook Harbaugh of Baltimore as the most astonishing whiner in the NFL (hard to believe but I think it was significantly worse than Harbaugh). That was very embarrassing behavior for a head coach.
 
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....in the other fellows yard...."

That was a ditty that was the theme song of Big Brother Bob Emery, who used to have a kids TV show in Boston back in the 50's when I was growing up.

Thank you for reminding me that I am not the oldest (fill in the blank) on this forum; I'll have to ask my older brother about that show.
 
Ken, I have to agree with TheBostonStraggler about #9. I don't know what you were watching there, but Ninkovich was historically bad, especially in that first half at not sealing the edge and not wrapping up his tackles when he actually did come in contact wth RB's or Tebow. He was like an accelerating bumper in a pinball machine.

All your other points, as usual, were compelling and informative - -thanks as always!
 
Ken, I have to agree with TheBostonStraggler about #9. I don't know what you were watching there, but Ninkovich was historically bad, especially in that first half at not sealing the edge and not wrapping up his tackles when he actually did come in contact wth RB's or Tebow. He was like an accelerating bumper in a pinball machine.

All your other points, as usual, were compelling and informative - -thanks as always!

In fairness I thought he played much better in the second half (meaning he played as he should in the second half). While I might not term it historically bad and an accelerating bumper on a pinball machine (that is funny though), I agree he was allowing himself to be conspicuously non competitive in the beginning. Unfortunately the rushing defense as a collective was non competitive. Kudos to BB and staff for making the adjustments to significantly slow down the run.

You have to give it up for Tebow in that regard. The Patriots were cheating on the run as much as I have seen them do in a long time........ yet what Tebow brings to the table still allowed Denver great success in the run. Every play that ended up a pass had like 3 or 4 Patriots running with their backs to Tebow trying to quickly get into some sort of a pass defensive position. It was almost funny seeing that.....
 
I wonder...is there any sort of Tebow Hangover Effect in the game following a Denver tilt?...
 
Good Post as usual. But I'm glad you brought up the following

11. I now think John Fox is a f*cking assh#le. He was such a whiny b!tch that I think he must have been a Jet fan in a past life. After whining about every call that went against the Broncos (all of which were shown to be overt and easy calls) his little sarcastic cheer when the Pats were called with a critical penalty made me want to slap him.

Then when he called all those TO so he to try to rack up some more garbage yards in the last minute of the game, I wanted to punch him in the mouth. I would have gone crazy if a Pats player had gotten hurt in those 4 useless plays. I would have fired his ass, if he'd gotten one of his own players hurt. What a punk.
Most coaches seem to argue with calls, but the cameras caught him exactly as you spelled it out. Wasn't it a Hernandez penalty where he was imitating Hernandez's TD celebration? a HC has to be above such things and he should have fun reviewing the tape and getting a little "revisionist" perspective.

Maybe he's still hurting from Carolina's SB loss to the Pats :D
 
Agreed on #3. If the OL can match that performance throughout the playoffs, the Patriots definitely won't lose due to a lack of scoring.

On #4, I would disagree simply because when it was Riddley, the run game looked potent. With BJGE, it looked poor. I'm beginning to worry about BJGE's effectiveness too (as you noted in #5). I don't know how BB doesn't try to give more reps to Riddley over the next two weeks. Let's see if he can get into a rhythm.

on #7, the TE's are getting it done, is there room/a need for more passing to the RB's?

On #9, I though Ninko made several tough mistakes in the first quarter.

on #10, Tebow played the first quarter like he had played the fourth quarters in other games (better actually). But I think he is not ready to run a dink and dunk pass game (what the Patriots have been giving up regularly) against a better team.

On #11, ABSOLUTELY agree regarding your comments about Coach Fox. He easily overtook Harbaugh of Baltimore as the most astonishing whiner in the NFL (hard to believe but I think it was significantly worse than Harbaugh). That was very embarrassing behavior for a head coach.
The run game was fine today. Green-Ellis wasn't his efficient normal self thanks to some poor blocking and penalties negating big pick ups. I was quite pleased with how the Patriots incorporated Ridley, Woodhead and Green-Ellis into the game plan.

This is no different to the comments on Green-Ellis earlier this season before he went Full Metal Jacket on the Jets. People forget things as quickly as they remember.
 
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The run game was fine today. Green-Ellis wasn't his efficient normal self thanks to some poor blocking and penalties negating big pick ups. I was quite pleased with how the Patriots incorporated Ridley, Woodhead and Green-Ellis into the game plan.

This is no different to the comments on Green-Ellis earlier this season before he went Full Metal Jacket on the Jets. People forget things as quickly as they remember.

Fair enough though on the blocking point, was BJGE and Riddley receiving different blocking on all their plays?? However, I see your point regarding this game being reminiscent of that game where BJGE was going no where and Riddley was tearing it up. Many, including me, thought we have to get Riddley more reps versus the Jets. Then the Jets came and BJGE was lights out. However, Riddley looked like a slasher again vs the Broncs and, you'll have to admit, BJGE has not been tearing it up (not this week, last week, etc) With Riddley twice now showing that quick-elusive-slicing ability, let's see if this is something that can work week to week? He's a rookie and he needs some reps to show what he can do in the playoffs.
I'm a BJGE fan. The guy is a Patriot player. But with the defense as shaky as it is, adding a quick slashing/knifing RB to our compliment of plays/weapons would be very nice for our offense.
 
Very nice Ken.


Enjoyable as always
 
Great post as usual.. did not know that we are contemporaries, old baztards unite.

Fletcher,UDFA and White, another UDFA journeyman special teamer are both playing more than they should be due to injuries.. my expectations are realistic for both.. overall they were more of an asset than a liability.

Believe that BJGE is still hurt with his toe issue, he is not hitting the hole as well as he should have, the affinity that BB has is his surehandedness... when you need a couple of yards and have to insure ball safety, he is the man.. compare to many teams we have played lately who exhibited poor ball control.

Was impressed with Ridley.

Thought Tebow is progressing in some areas, but regressing in the areas of judgement.. running from a sack that results in a 29 yard sack is extremely poor form, he seems to have more tools than anticipated, but a wishbone qb in this league will certainlly lead to a short shelf live and a host of injuries, no matter how big or how great a shape he is in.

In the past Elway has been conservative in his support for him, but recently he has had to change his mind, but have to wonder if Elway wants him to have this much success... not at all confident that Tebow will continue to be a premier quarterback for any team. We may have given a "blueprint" on how to contain him. Stay tuned..
 
Thanks Ken. Always appreciate your effort & informative insights.

One of the highlights for me was the Ocho TD. I was rooting for him like for an addopted son.

Extreemely pumped by the quick & efffective coaching adjustments.

Great game by Hernandes. We're so blessed to have such a great, young, tight end tandem. I'd like Hernandes use the STOP & juke less often. The NFL is soo quick.

My heart stopped seeing that hit on Brady. Too reminiscent of how he got his big break.

While I'm remoniscing, Tebow shaking off Ninkovich reminded me of Bledsoe not flinching as Banta Cain came in untouched and bounced off Bledsoe's chest.

Overall, great game by the O-line. In spite the weakness of the D, for me, the key to an extended run in the post-season is the O-line play. Keep Brady from being pummelled & we've got an excellent chance against anyone.

Any comments on Cannon? Great story just to be on the active roster. I got the impression he got good minutes & did well.
 
Any comments on Cannon? Great story just to be on the active roster. I got the impression he got good minutes & did well.

I was wondering the same thing. It seemed like he had a lot of snaps, but I didn't hear his name called at all; a good thing I suppose.
 
9. Anderson and Ninkovitch had superb games. Both rushed the passer well, both made big plays, and both improved against the run as the game went on. The Pats had 4 sacks and these 2 guys had 3 of them, and almost had a few more.

Anderson, yes. Ninkovich was a prime culprit in the first quarter defensive meltown. I'm a big Ninko fan (and he played better in the 2nd half), but every run that Denver broke outside in Q1 went right past Ninkovich. He had no clue on how to set an edge.

And yeah, he rushed the passer on a few plays - problem is, you actually need to tackle him once you get there. Ninko bounced off him. Watch Tebow's first touchdown, he shrugs off Ninkovich like he's not there.

I spent most of the 1st quarter cursing out Ninko at my house, so it was ironic that he fell on the first Denver fumble. And to his credit he seemed to play better after that. Hopefully these are correctable lapses as you talked about.
 
Overall, great game by the O-line. In spite the weakness of the D, for me, the key to an extended run in the post-season is the O-line play. Keep Brady from being pummelled & we've got an excellent chance against anyone.

To that end how good was Solder. Up against one of the best rushers in the game and except for one blow up was outstanding. Quietly having a superb rookie season
 
5. Does anyone else seem to think that BJGE has started to become too patient and isn't hitting the holes as hard as he has in the past. On the other hand, Ridley looked awfully good as well as Woodhead. Both averaged close to 6ypc. Ridley picking up 18 yds on 3 carries vs a defense expecting the run was particularly impressive as was Danny's TD run.

Enough with the outside tosses where he's six yards behind the LOS before he even gets going. He's not a get to the edge back. Pound him in there where his physicality means something.
 
two comments....

1) BJGE - his performance lately makes me wonder if the turf toe injury isn't still there and nagging him causing him to be overly cautious

2) Carter - I really feel bad for Carter if as it looks he is done for the season.
 
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....in the other fellows yard...."


1. As I kid I snuck into BU field to watch the original 1960 Patriots, before I ever played organized football, and what I saw in the first quarter of the Denver game was the WORST run defense I have ever seen in the entire 52 seasons I have watched this team. Is that bad enough for you.

;)

Ken - I have to disagree. I too was at that Bronco game, and also the games against the Bills when OJ Simpson would gain over 200 yards on us. That "D" sir was the absolute worst run "D" I have ever seen. OJ made it into the record books thanks to the Patriots "D"!!

It amazes me how stout this run "D" becomes in red zone, most of the time (not yesterday).
 
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