How Belichick lost his place in posterity

[Ian]

The problem I see with your example is that you're imagining the 2008 Cassell, that played with the 2007 SB roster.

Do you really believe Cassell would've made a difference playing with the 2022 roster under Patricia and Judge? Have you heard what Cassell said about the Patricia/Judge move?

I think he would have played well from 2020 on and would have handled the transition better because he would have been more mature than Mac and wouldn't have fallen off a cliff like Newton. Albeit, he would have also probably been vocal. Not that I would have blamed him because Bill didn't do a great job of cultivating an environment where lower tiered coaches wanted to stay and I'm sure that played a role in guys bailing to Las Vegas.

That year and the roster building did Bill in - I don't give him a pass for that. But the rest is just second-guessing, although I liked Cassel as a player and enjoy him as an analyst.

 

[vicspats]

100%. Short of murder or rape, there's zero reasons to bench your starting LCB for the ENTIRE SB!

Hell there's been great players that balled while drunk or doped up. So stupid.

Zero reasons? Not sure that’s a fact. As well as playing drunk? Not in todays game, Noway… too hard on the balance and strength. But booger candy? .. now we talkin..

 

[signbabybrady]

Zero reasons? Not sure that’s a fact. As well as playing drunk? Not in todays game, Noway… too hard on the balance and strength. But booger candy? .. now we talkin..

Now its booger candy. I don't like where this is going. Too much pats fan on pats fan crime forcing us to choose sides and throw one of these guys under a bus.

 

[Tunescribe]

What else? Why would anyone have any personal vendetta against Bill. None of us know him personally.

So yes, despite your sarcasm, the aim is to provide a balanced perspective and not be hero-worshipping Belichick and keep his failures in mind and in perspective.

What a load of disingenuous crap. "Lost his place in posterity" gave you away from the get-go. You butthurt goofballs have made gaslighting an art form with this infernally eternal Brady > Belichick obsession. Leaves one yearning for the good ol' days before you stumbled forth from the Tampa Bay Ghetto and commenced puking on all things BB. Making your campaign agenda so damn embarrassing is this naive belief you can toss up a bunch of stats and records to compensate for what little you REALLY understand about how things work in the NFL -- especially coaching -- in service to worshiping your hero. Perhaps someday you'll grow out of this nonsense and learn to appreciate the fact that neither could have accomplished individually what they did TOGETHER.

 

[venecol]

Perhaps someday you'll grow out of this nonsense and learn to appreciate the fact that neither could have accomplished individually what they did TOGETHER.

 

[Tunescribe]

View attachment 57414

Yes, of course, so predictable -- because Brady "did it all by himself." Once again, your lack of personal experience in athletics and team sports rears its ignorant head. But hope remains that with an open mind you MIGHT gain secondhand understanding of how things work in a team setting. Trusting the words of someone you idolize should be a good place to start.

From late 2021, well after Tampa Bay's Super Bowl win:

BOSTON (CBS) -- Almost at the same time that Bill Belichick was giving a lot of credit to Tom Brady for all of the success enjoyed in New England over the past 20 years, Brady was giving credit to Belichick for developing him into the quarterback that he's become.

Belichick gave his praise in a press conference; Brady's came from a clip from his forthcoming documentary project, "Man In The Arena: Tom Brady."

In the clip, Brady goes into detail about how and why Belichick is responsible for his development early in his career with the Patriots.

"I had Coach Belichick there to teach me," Brady said, over footage from his meeting in Belichick's office during the 2009 season. "Every Tuesday, we would meet and go through the entire defensive starting lineup, and their strengths and weaknesses, what we could attack, what he was watching, and how I could see the things that he saw, so I could gain confidence and anticipate."

In the clip, Brady looks back on the early days of his career.

"When I look back at that time, it was a really growth stage part of my career," he said. "It was a development of myself as a player, but also as a person off the field. And I was soaking up all the information."

Brady has in the past given a lot of credit to coaching, saying last year that it's a "pretty sh---y argument" that players deserve more credit than coaches, because "I can't do his job and he can't do mine."

As former Patriots safety Rodney Harrison put it in the clip, "[Brady] had structure for his career, and that's what Coach Belichick gives you."

Because of his experience with Belichick, Brady said he sometimes wonders about other young, talented quarterbacks who never have the opportunity to tap in to all of their potential.

"Even today, I look at some of these young players, and they're like, 'What do you think of this guy in his third year or fourth year?'" Brady said. "And in my mind I'm thinking, 'OK, he's talented. But who's gonna teach him how to evolve and grow? Who's gonna assist him in his learning of what football's all about, what his knowledge is?'"

Tom Brady Credits Bill Belichick For Fulfilling His Potential In Clip From New Documentary Series

Tom Brady goes into detail about how and why Bill Belichick is responsible for his development early in his career with the Patriots.

www.cbsnews.com

Tom Brady on Bill Belichick: I could never have been the player I was without you

The Patriots have officially parted ways with former head coach Bill Belichick after 24 seasons and six Super Bowl wins.

www.nbcsports.com

Tom Brady Pays Homage To Bill Belichick With Heartfelt Post After Patriots Split

The greatest quarterback of all time had plenty of praise for arguably the greatest coach of all time.

www.si.com

 

[Clonamery]

Yes, of course, so predictable. Once again, your personal lack of experience in athletics and team sports rears its ignorant head. But hope remains that with an open mind you MIGHT gain secondhand understanding of how things work. Trusting the words of someone you idolize should be a good place to start.

BOSTON (CBS) -- Almost at the same time that Bill Belichick was giving a lot of credit to Tom Brady for all of the success enjoyed in New England over the past 20 years, Brady was giving credit to Belichick for developing him into the quarterback that he's become.

Belichick gave his praise in a press conference; Brady's came from a clip from his forthcoming documentary project, "Man In The Arena: Tom Brady."

In the clip, Brady goes into detail about how and why Belichick is responsible for his development early in his career with the Patriots.

"I had Coach Belichick there to teach me," Brady said, over footage from his meeting in Belichick's office during the 2009 season. "Every Tuesday, we would meet and go through the entire defensive starting lineup, and their strengths and weaknesses, what we could attack, what he was watching, and how I could see the things that he saw, so I could gain confidence and anticipate."

In the clip, Brady looks back on the early days of his career.

"When I look back at that time, it was a really growth stage part of my career," he said. "It was a development of myself as a player, but also as a person off the field. And I was soaking up all the information."

Brady has in the past given a lot of credit to coaching, saying last year that it's a "pretty sh---y argument" that players deserve more credit than coaches, because " I can't do his job and he can't do mine."

As former Patriots safety Rodney Harrison put it in the clip, "[Brady] had structure for his career, and that's what Coach Belichick gives you."

Because of his experience with Belichick, Brady said he sometimes wonders about other young, talented quarterbacks who never have the opportunity to tap in to all of their potential.

"Even today, I look at some of these young players, and they're like, 'What do you think of this guy in his third year or fourth year?'" Brady said. "And in my mind I'm thinking, 'OK, he's talented. But who's gonna teach him how to evolve and grow? Who's gonna assist him in his learning of what football's all about, what his knowledge is?'"

Tom Brady Credits Bill Belichick For Fulfilling His Potential In Clip From New Documentary Series

Tom Brady goes into detail about how and why Bill Belichick is responsible for his development early in his career with the Patriots.

www.cbsnews.com

Tom Brady on Bill Belichick: I could never have been the player I was without you

The Patriots have officially parted ways with former head coach Bill Belichick after 24 seasons and six Super Bowl wins.

www.nbcsports.com

Tom Brady Pays Homage To Bill Belichick With Heartfelt Post After Patriots Split

The greatest quarterback of all time had plenty of praise for arguably the greatest coach of all time.

www.si.com

The Florida obtuseness is a real thing.

 

[Tunescribe]

The Florida obtuseness is a real thing.

It truly is embarrassing.

 

[Clonamery]

It truly is embarrassing.

The Florida Pride of Ignorance is consuming.

 

[vicspats]

Now its booger candy. I don't like where this is going. Too much pats fan on pats fan crime forcing us to choose sides and throw one of these guys under a bus.

Apologies. It was tongue in cheek. Wasn’t meant that Butler was high, just referring to the fact it’s easier to play football bumped up than piss drunk. Allegedly…

 

[Stu Pidassle]

Apologies. It was tongue in cheek. Wasn’t meant that Butler was high, just referring to the fact it’s easier to play football bumped up than piss drunk. Allegedly…

At this point it would be better for both parties to explain why MB did not play. It is human nature to go negative when facts are not available. Until more information becomes available, I think that either MB was mainlining in the locker room, or BB made a bet that he could win with Bademosi. FACTS! LOL

 

[vicspats]

At this point it would be better for both parties to explain why MB did not play. It is human nature to go negative when facts are not available. Until more information becomes available, I think that either MB was mainlining in the locker room, or BB made a bet that he could win with Bademosi. FACTS! LOL

Keep cranking that rumor mill…

 

[State]

Complete load of ********. Even Brady has acknowledged that he never would have had such a successful career without Belichick.

Yes. But we live in an age of PR. This is the image people esp on the outside have: it was more Brady than anything else. Esp in the later years.

And that will be hard to shake. It might just be the motivation for BB to go back into coaching. But any owner would be amiss if he allowed Bill to also be the GM.

Cuz GM Bill brought us the mess we have now on offense.

 

[Pats1971]

Yes. But we live in an age of PR. This is the image people esp on the outside have: it was more Brady than anything else. Esp in the later years.

And that will be hard to shake. It might just be the motivation for BB to go back into coaching. But any owner would be amiss if he allowed Bill to also be the GM.

Cuz GM Bill brought us the mess we have now on offense.

Yeah, there is literally nothing else Brady would say because thats who he is. He also doesnt call himself the goat, and he gives credit to team mates in wins. It is obvious by absolute facts that Brady was why all that happened, its not even a question. You can literally trace the winning and losing to Brady starting and stoping. Brady covered up a lot of mistakes on the team and those turned to bright red and shiney when he left. For 20 years, we heard, Kraft, love him. Bill, great GM, drafts, wonderful, then all of the sudden, none of those things were True? No, everything was the same, but Brady was not here to win anyway.

 

[Triumph]

To Belichick's sycophants, any mention of facts, reality, or his (God forbid) mistakes, is a direct and personal frontal attack on Belichick driven by a hate filled agenda. Lol

I personally find it interesting to see how he compares with other great coaches, when they also didn’t have their HOF QBs. It's historical football stuff where you learn about other coaches, QBs, etc. Nope. No interest at all. Not in a football forum. Lol

We used to laugh at the Raiders fans blaming Walt Coleman on why they lost the snow bowl.

Today, the Thunder and Mayo fan club is fixated on Malcom Butlers benching as the reason why the Pats lost the Super Bowl.

 

[sean10mm]

If you look at the 3+ championship coaches you have guys who had long stretches with HOF QBs, and Joe Gibbs. And nobody is seriously calling Gibbs the GOAT coach.

 

[p8ryts]

If you look at the 3+ championship coaches you have guys who had long stretches with HOF QBs, and Joe Gibbs. And nobody is seriously calling Gibbs the GOAT coach.

To Gibbs credit, I believe he won with three different qbs. Joe Theisman, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien. They are not usually in the same conversation with Montana, Brady, Manning, Mahomes, etc. Super Bowl teams have good coaches, a solid team and a clutch QB. It takes commitment, persistence, fewer injuries and some lucky calls. Congratulations to them all.

 

[Tunescribe]

Yeah, there is literally nothing else Brady would say because thats who he is. He also doesnt call himself the goat, and he gives credit to team mates in wins. It is obvious by absolute facts that Brady was why all that happened, its not even a question. You can literally trace the winning and losing to Brady starting and stoping. Brady covered up a lot of mistakes on the team and those turned to bright red and shiney when he left. For 20 years, we heard, Kraft, love him. Bill, great GM, drafts, wonderful, then all of the sudden, none of those things were True? No, everything was the same, but Brady was not here to win anyway.

This perspective is terribly myopic, lacking important context. Many moving parts comprised the winning program Belichick constructed from front office to assistant coaches, scouting and quality control (via the likes of Ernie Adams). His innovative emphasis on versatile mid-level and end-of-roster talent kept Patriots teams competitive for years. Brady was an important component but didn't operate in a vacuum, groomed by skilled OCs and complemented by consistently excellent defenses/special teams units under BB's watch.

Toward the end, league rule changes overemphasizing offense and minimizing the impact of special teams blunted built-in advantages of Belichick's philosophical approach. Success-driven staff attrition, both in the front office and coaching ranks, generated a revolving-door brain drain harming program continuity. Belichick spread himself too thin trying to compensate and fell short in personnel management at all levels. This ultimately manifested in the win-loss columns, spelling his ouster. But it's to the credit of Brady and BB that together, they overcame sea changes in both how the league operated and their own program to achieve second-phase dynasty titles in 2014, 2016 and 2018.

 

[rogerthat]

To Gibbs credit, I believe he won with three different qbs. Joe Theisman, Doug Williams and Mark Rypien. They are not usually in the same conversation with Montana, Brady, Manning, Mahomes, etc. Super Bowl teams have good coaches, a solid team and a clutch QB. It takes commitment, persistence, fewer injuries and some lucky calls. Congratulations to them all.

Slightly off topic, but I think Mark Rypien is one of the most underrated QBs that I've ever seen. He was very good at his apex.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Today, the Thunder and Mayo fan club is fixated on Malcom Butlers benching as the reason why the Pats lost the Super Bowl.

The instant fan club is to troll Team Bill. The majority of this board and media wanted Kraft to clean house (including Mayo) when things were falling apart last season. In fact, most posters wanted an offensive guy like Ben Johnson. But as soon as Mayo was hired, the anti Bill posters have loved every move just to piss off team Bill. It’s as clear as day. I’ve been known on here as not being the biggest fan of Bill, but even that is going to far for me.

Regarding Butler’s replacement, Rowe was responsible for giving up 10 points on 2 consecutive drives before being yanked off Jeffrey.