Gut Feeling Time

[BelichickFan]

I'm been on the "First Round LB or Bust" train for weeks now.

But my new gut feeling is this :

LOLB - Vrabel.
ILB - Bruschi
ILB - by comittee
ROLB Colvin

Bruschi goes back to his old ILB spot vs. playing Ted Johnson's spot last year. That leaves us with 3 of the 4 LB from 2004 as is except that Vrabel and Colvin are full time starters vs. Vrabel, McGinest and Colvin being 3 guys for 2 spots. As Colvin seems to be back to his old self, this isn't a problem.

So what's the "by comittee" ? Well some of you who are smarter than me can answer that question more fully but it would begin on first and second downs with a TJ replacement, whether that's Claridge or potential draftees Abdul Hodge, Kai Parham, Tim Dobbins, pick your TJ type ILB.

What would we do on 2nd or 3rd and long ? Not sure. Maybe someone has a suggestion. Beisel - how was his coverage ? He is certainly small enough that if he can't cover he can't do anything for us. Or how about this - 3-3 DL, LB and 5 safeties with Harrison (or Sanders) up in almost a LB position. That would protect us from having them run down our throats but get good coverage with 2-3 CB, Hawkins, Tebucky, Harrison, etc on the field.

What do we do in the first round then ? I know "Belichick won't take a WR in the first round" but we take Jackson or Holmes if we can get in a spot to do so.

Voila. We have Branch, #1 pick and Caldwell instead of Branch, Givens, Davis. LB has basically been filled too, cheaply, kind of like it was before TJ retired.

 

[Flying Fungi]

I see DE with the 21 pick, or a trade down...

 

[Feep_FLA]

Carpenter, Lawson or Sims at 21 or trade down to take Greenway late......
Errrrrrrr, Maybe trade out of the 1st round, pick up a low second round and take Richard Marshall.... Hell, I don't know what they'll do....

 

[jczxohn1]

Carpenter, Lawson or Sims at 21 or trade down to take Greenway late......
Errrrrrrr, Maybe trade out of the 1st round, pick up a low second round and take Richard Marshall.... Hell, I don't know what they'll do....

QUOTE=jczxohn1]From MLBrandow at OTC Draft.com
21. New England Patriots - DeMeco Ryans, OLB Alabama
Scouts Inc. Team Needs: DC, LB, SS, RB, QB // AskTheCommish.com Salary Cap Status: Even
The Patriots naturally need playmaking Linebackers to make their defense run (remember when Tedy Bruschi came back from injury?). Ryans is a general on the field and a leader in the locker room. Supposing Bruschi won't be around forever, Ryans could be groomed to replace him in a few years. If this isn't isn't a Bill Belichick player, then I suppose he'll take someone else--honestly, we might as well just leave a New England-sized hole in our mocks, because this is the most impossible franchise to read. How many of you saw Corey Dillon to the Pats? How many saw Logan Mankins in the first round? These guys are nuts. I'm just going to concede defeat and quit speculating. Still, Ryans would be a solid addition to a linebacking corps that could always use more playmakers.
Other Options: Sinorice Moss, Trade Down, Tye Hill, Bobby Carpenter[/QUOTE]

You aren't the only one

 

[BelichickFan]

21. New England Patriots - DeMeco Ryans, OLB Alabama

I'm not predicting Ryans although despite being "small" he's only 10 pounds away from 250. Bruschi is 6'1", 247 (listed anyway) and Ryans is 6'1 1/4", 236 so he could probably get close to where Bruschi is.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I'm been on the "First Round LB or Bust" train for weeks now.

But my new gut feeling is this :

LOLB - Vrabel.
ILB - Bruschi
ILB - by comittee
ROLB Colvin

Bruschi goes back to his old ILB spot vs. playing Ted Johnson's spot last year. That leaves us with 3 of the 4 LB from 2004 as is except that Vrabel and Colvin are full time starters vs. Vrabel, McGinest and Colvin being 3 guys for 2 spots. As Colvin seems to be back to his old self, this isn't a problem.

So what's the "by comittee" ? Well some of you who are smarter than me can answer that question more fully but it would begin on first and second downs with a TJ replacement, whether that's Claridge or potential draftees Abdul Hodge, Kai Parham, Tim Dobbins, pick your TJ type ILB.

What would we do on 2nd or 3rd and long ? Not sure. Maybe someone has a suggestion. Beisel - how was his coverage ? He is certainly small enough that if he can't cover he can't do anything for us. Or how about this - 3-3 DL, LB and 5 safeties with Harrison (or Sanders) up in almost a LB position. That would protect us from having them run down our throats but get good coverage with 2-3 CB, Hawkins, Tebucky, Harrison, etc on the field.

What do we do in the first round then ? I know "Belichick won't take a WR in the first round" but we take Jackson or Holmes if we can get in a spot to do so.

Voila. We have Branch, #1 pick and Caldwell instead of Branch, Givens, Davis. LB has basically been filled too, cheaply, kind of like it was before TJ retired.

I suggest avoiding Thai food for the next couple weeks, at least ask them to make it mild.

 

[BelichickFan]

I suggest avoiding Thai food for the next couple weeks, at least ask them to make it mild.

Come on, Box, you must have an idea how we can replace the Phifer role of passing downs for an ILB when he used to rotate with TJ.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Come on, Box, you must have an idea how we can replace the Phifer role of passing downs for an ILB when he used to rotate with TJ.

They did, Vrabel.

If TBC/Klecko/Claridge/Beisel/Wright/Draft pick(s) can't hold down OLB in Willie's slot, then Vrabel moves back out and they try to partner Bruschi with Beisel/Claridge/Alexander - taking them out in the nickel package.

 

[BelichickFan]

They did, Vrabel.

If TBC/Klecko/Claridge/Beisel/Wright/Draft pick(s) can't hold down OLB in Willie's slot, then Vrabel moves back out and they try to partner Bruschi with Beisel/Claridge/Alexander - taking them out in the nickel package.

How about this :

Draft Anthony Schlegal, or the like, on the second day. Or Tim Dobbins a early on the second day. I'll use Schlegal but substitute in your preferred draftee.

Run Downs :

(LOLB-ROLB) : Vrabel, Schlegal, Bruschi, Colvin.

Pass Downs :

(LOLB-ROLB) : Banta Cain, Vrabel, Bruschi, Colvin

That gives us the same LB package on run downs as we had in 2004 except we have a new version of TJ and Colvin in for McGinnest. On pass downs we have have Vrabel inside instead of Phifer (comparing to 2004) and Banta Cain in the pass rush spot.

The beauty of this is it costs us only a second day pick. In theory we could accomlish the above without using a single pick if Claridge can go in the spot of Schlegal but I have no idea how the Patriots feel about him right now. This would enable us to use our top two picks on the BPA and draft some youth at LB as value dictates.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

How about this :

Draft Anthony Schlegal, or the like, on the second day. Or Tim Dobbins a early on the second day. I'll use Schlegal but substitute in your preferred draftee.

Run Downs :

(LOLB-ROLB) : Vrabel, Schlegal, Bruschi, Colvin.

Pass Downs :

(LOLB-ROLB) : Banta Cain, Vrabel, Bruschi, Colvin

That gives us the same LB package on run downs as we had in 2004 except we have a new version of TJ and Colvin in for McGinnest. On pass downs we have have Vrabel inside instead of Phifer (comparing to 2004) and Banta Cain in the pass rush spot.

The beauty of this is it costs us only a second day pick. In theory we could accomlish the above without using a single pick if Claridge can go in the spot of Schlegal but I have no idea how the Patriots feel about him right now. This would enable us to use our top two picks on the BPA and draft some youth at LB as value dictates.

Workable..

 

[Boston Tim]

While I love the 3-4 as much as any Pats fan, the team we have right now isn't capable of being consistently effective in that formation. We've got no 3-4 ILB to put next to Bruschi, no real depth at each LB position, and no true backup NT for Wilfork.

Right now, we've got a great 4-3 team. We just need a JAG DL.

LE: Warren, Hill
DT: Seymour, Wright, Thomas
DT: Wilfork, Wright, Thomas
RE: Green, Hill
ROLB: Colvin, Banta-Cain
LOLB: Vrabel, Alexander
MLB: Bruschi, Beisel, Izzo, Claridge

 

[BelichickFan]

We've got no 3-4 ILB to put next to Bruschi, no real depth at each LB position, and no true backup NT for Wilfork.

We also have no 4-3 MLB. I love Bruschi as much as anyone but he doesn't have the speed to play MLB in a 4-3. There are times he struggles with his speed at ILB in a 3-4, put him in the middle by himself and things will get ugly.

 

[Boston Tim]

Bruschi was great as a 4-3 MLB in 2002. I think he still can be, but that is just my opinion and not in any way supported by fact.

 

[BelichickFan]

Bruschi was great as a 4-3 MLB in 2002. I think he still can be, but that is just my opinion and not in any way supported by fact.

Maybe he'll be faster this year with a full training camp but he looked slow last year (pure speed, not reactions and instincts). 2002 was 4 years ago, he's closing in on 33 years old now. I think his MLB days have long since passed.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

While I love the 3-4 as much as any Pats fan, the team we have right now isn't capable of being consistently effective in that formation. We've got no 3-4 ILB to put next to Bruschi, no real depth at each LB position, and no true backup NT for Wilfork.

Right now, we've got a great 4-3 team. We just need a JAG DL.

LE: Warren, Hill
DT: Seymour, Wright, Thomas
DT: Wilfork, Wright, Thomas
RE: Green, Hill
ROLB: Colvin, Banta-Cain
LOLB: Vrabel, Alexander
MLB: Bruschi, Beisel, Izzo, Claridge

Sorry, Warren, Hill, and Green are defensive tackles, not defensive ends. Vrabel and Banta-Cain are defensive ends, not 4-3 OLBs. Izzo and Alexander are the only MLBs; however, Beisel is fast enough for MLB .

Bruschi was slower last season, and heavier, he would be the best MLB choice for his instincts, but his coverage and ability to cover sideline to sideline is limited compared to the Bruschi of yesterday.

This is still a base 3-4 team, it is not manned for base 4-3, BB demonstrated that last season when a number on this board howled for a 4-3 to stop the run and protect Beisel/Brown.

 

[Pats726]

We have players suited for a 3-4 base..I do NOT think that will change now. There is no reason to do that..if anything, the 3-4 is stronger not weaker. They may indeed use more 4-3 situationally..but the base will not be that. I don't see those wholesale changes in the works to ,ake a conversion or know any reason why that should occur.

 

[dryheat44]

While I love the 3-4 as much as any Pats fan, the team we have right now isn't capable of being consistently effective in that formation. We've got no 3-4 ILB to put next to Bruschi, no real depth at each LB position, and no true backup NT for Wilfork.

Right now, we've got a great 4-3 team. We just need a JAG DL.

If we go 4-3 full time, that's Klecko. And he's more than a JAG in the 4-3, he's a solid contributor. Lovie Smith or Tony Dungy could make him a star.

Note: I'm still President of the Jettison Klecko Club.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I think that in another system besides ours, Klecko could be a very servicable pass rusher. The situation is very similar to Spires a few years ago. He had some decent success in Tampa Bay, a system that complimented his skill set better.
One of my fears if we cut Klecko would be Dungy picking him up and plugging him into that system and Klecko would probably prosper in it.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

I think that in another system besides ours, Klecko could be a very servicable pass rusher. The situation is very similar to Spires a few years ago. He had some decent success in Tampa Bay, a system that complimented his skill set better.
One of my fears if we cut Klecko would be Dungy picking him up and plugging him into that system and Klecko would probably prosper in it.

That's why I'm in the Replace Willie with Klecko and Irritate Dryheat44 fanclub.

 

[rookBoston]

Stop it with the 4-3 nonsense

As long as Belichick has anything to say about the players he has on the team, it will be a base 3-4 front. That will never change.

The fact that we align well in a 4-3 right now is because we're about 2 quality LBs short of a full house. Well, that's easily solved. This is one of the best draft classes at LB to come along in a decade or more, and we have 11 selections on draft day.

I stick by the first round draft strategy I posted weeks ago:

- Greenway or Carpenter at #21
- If they're both gone, trade back in the 1st and take either Whitner or Marshall in the late 1st

Vrabel - Greenway - Brushi - Colvin looks damn good to me. And if Carpenter lasts into the 2nd round, trade up from #52 and take him. Those two players secure the future of the LB unit.