Felger on Asante Samuel

[Pujo]

If Samuel were to hold out, the Patriots would free up around 458,235 in cap space for each week Samuel missed. The Pats would have to do the phony LTBE move on another player's contract in order to be able to move some, if not all, freed up cap space to the 2008 season. The Patriots could decide to use the cap space on injury replacements or extensions.

If he was going to sit out, would he sign the one-year franchise contract? If he doesn't sign, no cap hit, right?

 

[salty]

It used to annoy me that so many people mis-spelled his name "Assante," but now it seems appropriate.

 

[spacecrime]

Prove to me how so.

He did. You don't sign a player for depth at a position for 1.3 mil with incentives that can go to 2.7 mil.

Money like that is for backup players you expect to put on the field, not players signed for depth.

 

[GoWhalers]

Why all the hate on Asante?

I don't understand how people fail to see that the franchise tag, from the player's perspective, is not a good thing.

No guaranteed money. No long term committment. I'm not even sure what happens if there's an injury settlement situation.

Yes, I understand the franchise tag give Samuel a LOT of money for one year, but these players are legitimately thinking about their long-term careers. What if your boss offered you a 2000% raise for next year, but there was a chance that you may never work again? How good a deal is that for the long-term? Pretty risky, no? It could work out great, or you could end up losing money in the long term. Who wants to gamble their future more than they have to?

The frustration, name calling, "Belichick is a liar", etc. all stems from the fact that the player has no options here. If the team franchises him, he can either play one year and put his future at risk, or sit out and make no money. Those are his only two options. I would find that pretty frustrating too.

Full disclosure: I like Asante as a player, and trust the Patriots front office to make the best decision for the team, whether it includes Asante or not. But I do understand where Asante is coming from.

 

[miDeuce]

Why all the hate on Asante?

I don't understand how people fail to see that the franchise tag, from the player's perspective, is not a good thing.

I don't think the all the hate is because of Asante not signing the franchise deal, it's more because he's making a stink about the whole contract situation and giving everyone the general impression that all he cares about is 'getting paid' as his tattoo clearly states. I think if he just kept his mouth shut everyone might be a little more sympathetic to his cause. I don't think anyone would argue that the franchise tag is a favorable thing for a player, but it's part of the CBA and it's well within the rights of the team to use it.

 

[Pats726]

Why all the hate on Asante?

I don't understand how people fail to see that the franchise tag, from the player's perspective, is not a good thing.

No guaranteed money. No long term committment. I'm not even sure what happens if there's an injury settlement situation.

Yes, I understand the franchise tag give Samuel a LOT of money for one year, but these players are legitimately thinking about their long-term careers. What if your boss offered you a 2000% raise for next year, but there was a chance that you may never work again? How good a deal is that for the long-term? Pretty risky, no? It could work out great, or you could end up losing money in the long term. Who wants to gamble their future more than they have to?

The frustration, name calling, "Belichick is a liar", etc. all stems from the fact that the player has no options here. If the team franchises him, he can either play one year and put his future at risk, or sit out and make no money. Those are his only two options. I would find that pretty frustrating too.

Full disclosure: I like Asante as a player, and trust the Patriots front office to make the best decision for the team, whether it includes Asante or not. But I do understand where Asante is coming from.

NOT a good thing?? Hold on here...YES..to players that want that long term commitment who HAVE PLAYED at the top of the game...I AGREE that is not a good thing for them..and I have a bit MORE sympathy for them...but for AS??? A BAD thing?? He's getting paid this year with the TOP players and that is bad FOR HIM?? I can see that to a LOT of top players that MAY be the case..but for him..ONE good season and top dollar?? You would get frustrated getting paid nearly 8 million?? I will say ONE word...GREEDY!! Putting his future at risk..how is this different then a player on his last year of a contract?? Is a player like that being put "at risk??" And please no comparisons..with the masses of people who are earning less than 100K....NO comparison at all.
I love it when one tries to equate what these millionaires have and how they want more..and try to equate that with someone who is even moderate in income. It doesn't work..doesn't fit. Geee...maybe he'd like 10 Hummers instead of one..Gee..I feel for that one...Yes the Patriots will do what is best..and at this point..AS maybe putting himself in a corner. Not signing it..sitting out..and guess what..if the Pats dump him..he is a FA..and if teams have less money..they maybe will NOT want to pay mega bucks for him..in fact, it will be a buyer's market..and he might not even get what that Franchise money was...so let the baby sit out and whine.

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

He did. You don't sign a player for depth at a position for 1.3 mil with incentives that can go to 2.7 mil.

Money like that is for backup players you expect to put on the field, not players signed for depth.

Sorry, but isn't the definition of depth "backup players you expect to put on the field" ?

To make sense of your argument, perhaps you should define what you think depth is.

 

[JoeSixPat]

If Samuel were to hold out, the Patriots would free up around 458,235 in cap space for each week Samuel missed. The Pats would have to do the phony LTBE move on another player's contract in order to be able to move some, if not all, freed up cap space to the 2008 season. The Patriots could decide to use the cap space on injury replacements or extensions.

That makes sense to me but in the thread where Tomase was lambasted by someone (was it ProFootballTalk.com) regarding the "penalties" Samuel would incur if he holds out in the regular season the report stated (as was my understanding) that Samuel has until week 10 in mid November to sign the tender - and that he would receive the entire franchise amount once he did (which was NOT my understanding).

Having a franchise player play 6 regular season games and getting the entire salary makes no sense to me but indeed that's what seemed to be suggested. Common sense says you and I are right about this.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

750k or something is rhe vet min

So why does he deserve the vet min?

He was fielding offers from other teams for backup roles as well. Vet wouldnt go anywhere.

 

[spacecrime]

Why all the hate on Asante?

I don't understand how people fail to see that the franchise tag, from the player's perspective, is not a good thing.

No guaranteed money.

Not true. The moment he signs the franchise tag he gets $7.8 million dollars. Not in a future guarantee, but right then. A check. His to keep. It may not be $15 mil, but $7.8 mil is still a lot of money.

Plus, he plays a year, and then can get a Clements-type deal with another $15-20 mil when he signs that.

He wants Nate Clements money. Fine. But remember, last year Nate Clements was tagged. He played for a year under the franchise tag and got last year's millions and more this year.

Anyway, there is no hate shown here. Disapproving of Samuel's attitude is not showing hate.

I've disapproved of my son's attitude and behavior while loving him the whole time.

Disapproval is based on values. Hate is based on ... okay, I don't know what hate is based on, but it has nothing to do with approving or disapproving of Samuel's attitude and decisions.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

He did. You don't sign a player for depth at a position for 1.3 mil with incentives that can go to 2.7 mil.

Money like that is for backup players you expect to put on the field, not players signed for depth.

So whats the big deal? 1.3 million is his salary. A very cheap salary mind you.

Whats wrong with another 1.4 mil of incentives if hes a backup? Chances are he'll never meet those requirments.

So once again, whats the big deal?

 

[spacecrime]

That makes sense to me but in the thread where Tomase was lambasted by someone (was it ProFootballTalk.com) regarding the "penalties" Samuel would incur if he holds out in the regular season the report stated (as was my understanding) that Samuel has until week 10 in mid November to sign the tender - and that he would receive the entire franchise amount once he did

I don't recall reading that here.

 

[spacecrime]

So whats the big deal? 1.3 million is his salary. A very cheap salary mind you.

Whats wrong with another 1.4 mil of incentives if hes a backup? Chances are he'll never meet those requirments.

So once again, whats the big deal?

Nothing. I think the money is good for a backup player. It isn't cheap. $1.35 mil is more that than most NFL players make. Cheap is vet min, $810,000. That's why I said (and others said) that he is more than just a camp fodder signing to add depth. At those dollars, he ought to be on the field, not providing "depth."

His salary is not cheap. But it is a good price for a quality nickleback.

 

[spacecrime]

Sorry, but isn't the definition of depth "backup players you expect to put on the field" ?

To make sense of your argument, perhaps you should define what you think depth is.

You can define depth any way you want, of course. But is a backup player is a backup player, why do you need another word for it?

For me there are starters and there are backups. After you have your team comprising your starters and backups, you then look for more players to add, to add depth top positions that may sustain injuries, that have suspect starters or backups. Depth players are also not developmental players IMO.

I'm not saying this is the only definition, or your definition. You asked for my defiinition, and that is it.

Starters
Backups
Depth

A player signed for depth would not be exepected to play unless there were injuries.

 

[SeanBruschi54]

Nothing. I think the money is good for a backup player. It isn't cheap. $1.35 mil is more that than most NFL players make. Cheap is vet min, $810,000. That's why I said (and others said) that he is more than just a camp fodder signing to add depth. At those dollars, he ought to be on the field, not providing "depth."

His salary is not cheap. But it is a good price for a quality nickleback.

1.3 million is more than most make but at 1% of the cap i'm willing to let depth at a weak position make a little bit more to have better players in an emergency.

He'll see the field, probably in most cases as a nickel/dime back depending on the play.

 

[RayClay]

Felger said he heard from his sources that Samuel wanted to pull a Ty Law and lob personal attacks at the Patriots because he was so furious the Pats aren't willing to give him a Nate Clements type of deal. Samuel's agent had to talk him out of it and have him give a more controlled statement to the media. Samuel's agent realizes that if Samuel wants to play for the Pats, those personal attacks will get him nowhere.

If Samuel's agent can't continue to control him, it looks Samuel will either either shoot his way out of town or sit for most of the season.

Samuel is a decent player, but not worth the hassel. If we can get a first rounder, I say trade him away. Half a good season isn't enough to let him try to force us to give us an overinflated deal.

And before anyone makes that stupid arguement that he is the only guy we have who can cover Marvin Harrison, I recommend you go look at Harrison's post season performances since 2003 (No TDs and no games over 60 yards) and how Harrison has done going against Samuel in the last two regular season games (273 yards and 4 TDs).

Did the agent put tape over his mouth?

It's really gotten to the point where I see "Felger" and I just keep on scrolling.

How did that "shoot you way out of town" strategy work out for Ty, anyway?

His kids still eating three squares?

 

[RayClay]

I would take ANYTHING Felger says with a grain of salt. We know two things about Felger, he pimps any player's demand for money, and "his sources" are suspect.

 

[Return of the Nizz]

1.3 million is more than most make but at 1% of the cap i'm willing to let depth at a weak position make a little bit more to have better players in an emergency.

He'll see the field, probably in most cases as a nickel/dime back depending on the play.

The average salary is now in the range of 2 million, so he's making less than 'average', although given the way salaries are structured towards the stars he's probably below the median salary.

 

[Rob0729]

Did the agent put tape over his mouth?

It's really gotten to the point where I see "Felger" and I just keep on scrolling.

How did that "shoot you way out of town" strategy work out for Ty, anyway?

His kids still eating three squares?

The difference between Law and Samuel though is that Law knew no one was going to give him the money for one year that the Pats were giving him. Samuel knows someone will stupidly give him Nate Clements type of money which is nowhere near what the Pats are offering or what the franchise tag money is.

Felger does get some things right. He gets too much of a bum wrap. His writing has gone down since he became more of a broadcast journalist, but people hate him because he gives the contraryian view. He does write some good stuff and get good scoops from time to time.

 

[upstater1]

The difference between Law and Samuel though is that Law knew no one was going to give him the money for one year that the Pats were giving him. Samuel knows someone will stupidly give him Nate Clements type of money which is nowhere near what the Pats are offering or what the franchise tag money is.

Felger does get some things right. He gets too much of a bum wrap. His writing has gone down since he became more of a broadcast journalist, but people hate him because he gives the contraryian view. He does write some good stuff and get good scoops from time to time.

No one is going to give Samuel a Clements type contract. No one.