Dynasty Era Culture & Media schtick the one area I think Belichick firing would win.

[Ivan]

I know, and know of many Patriot fans who hate Belichick, I don’t know one, Triumph excepted, who hates Brady.

 

[Rob0729]

First of all Belichick takes 1000x more **** in this forum than Brady ever has. Second the crying about Brady went on forever, and a Brady forum for him was absolutely needed.

The “ Brady hate” is pure fiction. I don’t think you can name 5 regulars here that have expressed hate for Brady. If you can go ahead and name them, and be sure to provide the examples of their Brady hate.

During the whole Brady/Belichick war, I constantly feuded with the Pro-Brady/Anti-Belichick crowd when they basically called Belichick a mediocre coach who lucked into Brady. But at this point, I am pretty much out on Belichick unless he turns the season around. I just don't think he is willing to adapt to today's NFL and he has lost his fast ball.

 

[Ivan]

During the whole Brady/Belichick war, I constantly feuded with the Pro-Brady/Anti-Belichick crowd when they basically called Belichick a mediocre coach who lucked into Brady. But at this point, I am pretty much out on Belichick unless he turns the season around. I just don't think he is willing to adapt to today's NFL and he has lost his fast ball.

That’s hard to argue with given the results, but I still think that rebuilding from a 20 year dynasty is a much bigger task than most give it credit for. And unfortunately I think it’s next to impossible to be a serious contender without a really good QB, and by all the evidence to date that isn’t Mac Jones. A this point I believe that if the season continues down this road Kraft won’t have to fire Belichick, he will do it himself. Leaving them I. Need of a great QB, great Coach, and great GM, at a minimum.

 

[archstanton543]

That’s hard to argue with given the results, but I still think that rebuilding from a 20 year dynasty is a much bigger task than most give it credit for. And unfortunately I think it’s next to impossible to be a serious contender without a really good QB, and by all the evidence to date that isn’t Mac Jones. A this point I believe that if the season continues down this road Kraft won’t have to fire Belichick, he will do it himself. Leaving them I. Need of a great QB, great Coach, and great GM, at a minimum.

It's really not a 20 year dynasty. It's more like two 5-6 year dynasties with the non-dynasty years being rebuilding/retooling years while still being competitive due to one Thomas Brady.

 

[PATS16N0]

During the whole Brady/Belichick war, I constantly feuded with the Pro-Brady/Anti-Belichick crowd when they basically called Belichick a mediocre coach who lucked into Brady. But at this point, I am pretty much out on Belichick unless he turns the season around. I just don't think he is willing to adapt to today's NFL and he has lost his fast ball.

I think the Spartan-style of football he runs that creates tough football teams isn’t possible with his roster and player-leadership, and I think losing the Brady-factor in team culture makes it flat out unappealing.

To his credit, this is a guy who was on his way to revolutionizing the TE position 11 years ago. How much Brady has his finger prints on that is anyone’s guess. I have doubts Belichick just fell off, but it’s possible. I have seen men all of a sudden get loopy after hitting a certain age.

I’m mainly thinking he should go purely because watching these guys do their low energy ‘Patriot Way’ impersonations just makes me think his way of doing things has ran its course and the team going forward needs to build on an entirely new identity so they’re not coming off like a Dynasty Era pre-season roster all the time.

 

[PATS16N0]

It's really not a 20 year dynasty. It's more like two 5-6 year dynasties with the non-dynasty years being rebuilding/retooling years while still being competitive due to one Thomas Brady.

The in between years, though, was when the Patriots were usually their scariest. The Super Bowl drought years were the years where the Pats rolled up like 80’s high school jock villains and just massacred everyone like a bunch of nerds.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Waited a couple of days to cool off before writing something I would regret.

Thinking about it, I’m all in on BB through 2024. Reflecting back to the early 90’s, that was terrible. A bunch of 5-11’s and a 2-14 somewhere in between. That’s true suckage.

Bill has picked in the top 10 only one time in his entire tenure with the Patriots which netted Seymour. Traded with the 9ers for the 7th and traded back to early teens to grab Mayo. Even without Brady he’s been able to keep the team out of the bottom 10. He doesn’t get enough credit all those drafts he was picking 28-32. Sometimes if you are lucky, 10 or 15 of players in the first round end up becoming good to great in this league and he was constantly picking at the bottom of the 1st and every other round and still getting good value.

I really don’t want to see a new coaching staff brought in just yet. It could be a catastrophe that we just don’t need that could set this team back years. Afterwards, there is no guarantee that the one after that will be any better as well.

We’ve seen it with franchises like the Browns, Lions,Jaguars and so many others. Dozens of wasted darts at QB’s, plenty of high round draft picks that really didn’t do a thing to make the franchise relevant.

I agree this team is two players away from a huge Jump start and about 5 or 6 from a contender. They have a ton of cap space and are looking at another high draft pick, possibly top 10 for a change. Pretty much QB, WR, TE, LT and a Center.

I’m rolling with the old man for another season. I know that seems to be unpopular around here nowadays, but he’s got my loyalty. Maybe he didn’t have it on Sunday when I was pissed but they deserved it, atleast for that day.

Bottom line, Pats need a QB, just like every other bad team without one does. I can think of a lot of games where the offense wasn’t clicking and somehow the Patriots were still able to pull it out. I’d like to think BB’s coaching had something to do with some of those wins.

 

[archstanton543]

I really don’t want to see a new coaching staff brought in just yet. It could be a catastrophe that we just don’t need that could set this team back years.

What's the foundation they're building on now? If you blow it up, yes, it will be worse but that also nets you higher draft picks and a new coach with a new plan. Both of those might not work right away but...welcome to the rest of the NFL.

 

[captain stone]

This team doesn’t even bother helping their QB while he’s getting tossed around but they’re doing the Bruschi “aww yeah” in the locker room after a rare win.

And against Punky & the Jete too... ****ing PAThetic.

Do me a favor Matty and save the Aww Yeah for when you ****ing stiffs beat a Real football team... And neither the Aints at home nor the Faidahs count.

 

[203Pat]

During the whole Brady/Belichick war, I constantly feuded with the Pro-Brady/Anti-Belichick crowd when they basically called Belichick a mediocre coach who lucked into Brady. But at this point, I am pretty much out on Belichick unless he turns the season around. I just don't think he is willing to adapt to today's NFL and he has lost his fast ball.

My thing with that debate was that I always thought it was mostly Brady. I hated the move to choose Bill over Brady at the time and still hate it now. The Patriot Way and all that crap was always the Brady Way. Brady set the tone for everything. The stories about Brady paying practice squaders in practices to pick off his passes, how he demanded receivers be precise on every single route, how he would freeze out (good and bad) guys who weren't on the same page. Even with the locker room economics that are always a way bigger deal to the players and team chemistry and I think any of us fans will ever know were kept in line for 20 years because of Brady. I remember the story Revis talked about when he was a free agent after his season in Tampa how his agents told the Patriots "X team offered $16 million" and Bill said no. Revis's group asked why and Bill said "Because Brady makes $14 million" and that was the end of that conversation and Revis signed here for less. We saw the same thing happen down in Tampa. Players flocked to an organization that was a complete laughing stock and they had to expand the seating in Raymond James to accommodate the rednecks down there hopping on the bandwagon. We are now just 1 of 32 even with the great Bill Belichick. In 2021 during his spending spree the free agents all did their "I get to play for Bill" song and dance but they also almost all said they were offered the most money here. No discounts for Bill. Bill has said it himself. The players play and they deserve the credit. I doubt he means that but it's true either way. It was always Brady or at least for the large majority of the run it was.

 

[1960Pats]

Sorry, but certainly with respect to his GM responsibilities, he is no longer "that man," if he ever was. As for losing the coach, while I would like to see him stay on in that role for a while longer, I no longer regard him as "irreplacable" in that job either. The league has changed and in worrisome respects, Bill has not. In other equally worrisome ways, he has, for the worse.

Why can't everyone see that? The proof is in the pudding.

I have no problem with the team losing. After two decades of total dominance I can go many more years (God willing) without seeing them win but what's happening right now is beyond losing. They have never IN THEIR HISTORY looked this bad and there's only one person responsible.

 

[Thelonious]

Why can't everyone see that? The proof is in the pudding.

I have no problem with the team losing. After two decades of total dominance I can go many more years (God willing) without seeing them win but what's happening right now is beyond losing. They have never IN THEIR HISTORY looked this bad and there's only one person responsible.

Yep. I take absolutely no delight in this. Bill and I are of an age, as they say, and I understand what he is going through. I retired at 74, which was just about right. I was still doing my job as well as ever, but notions of cutting corners were beginning to enter my thoughts, so I retired. I vakued and enjoyed my profession, and I wanted to end it honorably. When we retire, we (men in particular) are sort of surrendering a major portion of our identity. It's a daunting time.

 

[1960Pats]

My thing with that debate was that I always thought it was mostly Brady. I hated the move to choose Bill over Brady at the time and still hate it now. The Patriot Way and all that crap was always the Brady Way. Brady set the tone for everything. The stories about Brady paying practice squaders in practices to pick off his passes, how he demanded receivers be precise on every single route, how he would freeze out (good and bad) guys who weren't on the same page. Even with the locker room economics that are always a way bigger deal to the players and team chemistry and I think any of us fans will ever know were kept in line for 20 years because of Brady. I remember the story Revis talked about when he was a free agent after his season in Tampa how his agents told the Patriots "X team offered $16 million" and Bill said no. Revis's group asked why and Bill said "Because Brady makes $14 million" and that was the end of that conversation and Revis signed here for less. We saw the same thing happen down in Tampa. Players flocked to an organization that was a complete laughing stock and they had to expand the seating in Raymond James to accommodate the rednecks down there hopping on the bandwagon. We are now just 1 of 32 even with the great Bill Belichick. In 2021 during his spending spree the free agents all did their "I get to play for Bill" song and dance but they also almost all said they were offered the most money here. No discounts for Bill. Bill has said it himself. The players play and they deserve the credit. I doubt he means that but it's true either way. It was always Brady or at least for the large majority of the run it was.

I really enjoy it when I read a post here that really hits the target. That was one of those.

 

[1960Pats]

Yep. I take absolutely no delight in this. Bill and I are of an age, as they say, and I understand what he is going through. I retired at 74, which was just about right. I was still doing my job as well as ever, but notions of cutting corners were beginning to enter my thoughts, so I retired. I vakued and enjoyed my profession, and I wanted to end it honorably. When we retire, we (men in particular) are sort of surrendering a major portion of our identity. It's a daunting time.

I couldn't wait to retire after 43 years of working but I understand your position. I have a cousin who's 74 and still working.

The thing with Bill is that there seems to be something going on. Maybe it has nothing to do with his age. It almost looks like he's tanking with the decisions he has made, but then again it could be the IBWT that's been drilled into our heads for many years.

 

[sb1]

The players play and they deserve the credit. I doubt he means that but it's true either way.

I'd like to think he did mean that. He's on record saying he's lucky to have had Brady play for him and wouldn't have been as successful without Brady and that players win games and coaches can't win anything without great players... so right from the man himself. Don't see why would anyone say Bill ought to get more credit than Tom.

And Tom also complimented BB in the same way. It was the perfect partnership.

 

[Thelonious]

I couldn't wait to retire after 43 years of working but I understand your position. I have a cousin who's 74 and still working.

The thing with Bill is that there seems to be something going on. Maybe it has nothing to do with his age. It almost looks like he's tanking with the decisions he has made, but then again it could be the IBWT that's been drilled into our heads for many years.

I agree. It's worrisome and strange. I've seen many younger people engage in self-subverting behavior over time (including yours truly!). It is even more disturbing in an older person, though.

 

[captain stone]

And against Punky & the Jete too... ****ing PAThetic.

Do me a favor Matty and save the Aww Yeah for when you ****ing stiffs beat a Real football team... And neither the Aints nor Faidahs at home count.

And they couldn't beat either of those two!

 

[SVN]

McCourty has a take on BB as a coach now

 

[SVN]

I couldn't wait to retire after 43 years of working but I understand your position. I have a cousin who's 74 and still working.

The thing with Bill is that there seems to be something going on. Maybe it has nothing to do with his age. It almost looks like he's tanking with the decisions he has made, but then again it could be the IBWT that's been drilled into our heads for many years.

He has made decisions which havent panned out . thats all . in the past it did.maybe due to brady. maybe due to all the great staff he had. now he he has no one and this team has no leadership so he cant get his message across.
We keep complaining about poor weapons etc. But route running, effort , fundamentals can be taught and learnt. This team doest even seem to do that.
His decisions to hire brown and klemm as coaches havent been good and those units have the biggest issues on the field now .

 

[Thelonious]

McCourty has a take on BB as a coach now

Until this year, I had happily (and probably unrefectively, I confess) assumed that Bill is a great coach. My overall view had been that while Bill MUST be fired as GM, I was open to his staying on as HC, if he found that agreeable. As this season has gone on, the poor, sloppy play of the team - penalties, miscues, poor situational awareness, boneheaded decisions re FG vs TD vs punt, etc. etc, - the sort of thing for which one typically and rightly blames the head coach, have been to a shocking degree evident in the team's piss poor play. While I am still open to having Bill back for another go at HC, I really would not be very disappointed if that were not to take place. In the context of his entire career, he is no doubt a great coach. Over the past few months at least, I have growing doubts that this is presently so.