Dynasty Era Culture & Media schtick the one area I think Belichick firing would win.

[VrabelJr]

BTW, I don't fault you for any of it but the fact that you had to create a subforum for the greatest Patriot of all time kind of backs up my point that there was hatred for the guy after he left.

You're missing Ian's point. The sub forum wasn't created because of hatred of Tom Brady. It was because a Tom vs Bill narrative spun up and was drowning out the main Patriots forum.

 

[borg]

I don't doubt it (and I obviously saw a lot of it), but as I said, my intention behind creating it were more for that than any other reason. With Brady retired, I'll probably close it down at some point and just allow all of that to go on in here.

What are you waiting for?

 

[Ian]

You're missing Ian's point. The sub forum wasn't created because of hatred of Tom Brady. It was because a Tom vs Bill narrative spun up and was drowning out the main Patriots forum.

Lol, you might have missed it also. I added that forum so people could add threads about other facets of the Buccaneers and follow their progress without having it intertwined with the posts on the main board.

Edited - I don’t want to go down that road.

 

[Ian]

What are you waiting for?

I’m dealing with other things right now…one thing at a time

 

[Ian]

You're missing Ian's point. The sub forum wasn't created because of hatred of Tom Brady. It was because a Tom vs Bill narrative spun up and was drowning out the main Patriots forum.

Lol, although I do get where you got that from…that remains one of my least favorite discussions and it’s a rabbit hole I definitely don’t want to go down

 

[amfootball]

You're missing Ian's point. The sub forum wasn't created because of hatred of Tom Brady. It was because a Tom vs Bill narrative spun up and was drowning out the main Patriots forum.

The main point of the discussion was whether Brady would have been hated had he stayed here in NE and started to perform poorly. The poster believed he would not be hated and I was pointing out that folks here hated the guy for leaving as a FA. If you look back at any of those threads, you will see a lot of hatred from a few folks ...

 

[PancakeBlockPaul]

WTFH is wrong with LARPing?

 

[Steve102]

The main point of the discussion was whether Brady would have been hated had he stayed here in NE and started to perform poorly. The poster believed he would not be hated and I was pointing out that folks here hated the guy for leaving as a FA. If you look back at any of those threads, you will see a lot of hatred from a few folks ...

More to it than that.

Would Brady have been shown the door in the manner than the anti-Bill crowd want to show Bill the door now. I say that Brady could have suddenly morphed into Hugh Millen and everyone would have, rightfully, still loved him for all he did, albeit while being disappointed that he did indeed fall off the cliff. I say that Bill is not shown any of the slack that Brady would have been (yes, hypothetically) if the situations were reversed.

 

[amfootball]

More to it than that.

Would Brady have been shown the door in the manner than the anti-Bill crowd want to show Bill the door now. I say that Brady could have suddenly morphed into Hugh Millen and everyone would have, rightfully, still loved him for all he did, albeit while being disappointed that he did indeed fall off the cliff. I say that Bill is not shown any of the slack that Brady would have been (yes, hypothetically) if the situations were reversed.

Yes. Brady would have if his play resembled what Bill has done since his departure. I mean we are in year 4 of the rebuild. I think Bill has been shown plenty of deference including literally throwing away a season with Newton at QB. I think the frustration has finally boiled over because the future of the team is a mess right now. I think most of us were hoping by year 4 that the needle would be pointing up and it is pointing down ...

 

[Steve102]

Yes. Brady would have if his play resembled what Bill has done since his departure. I mean we are in year 4 of the rebuild. I think Bill has been shown plenty of deference including literally throwing away a season with Newton at QB. I think the frustration has finally boiled over because the future of the team is a mess right now. I think most of us were hoping by year 4 that the needle would be pointing up and it is pointing down ...

I don't think fans would have ever turned on Brady.

The rest of your statement I agree with, the difference is it's week 4 going into 5. Like I said earlier, we get to November and they are 2-6, all bets are off. It's certainly trending in the wrong direction, that I will 100% agree.

 

[PATS16N0]

But you aren't winning anything in today's NFL without elite receivers

Not to mention no run game even if you are 15th-20th. The whole system is rotten from the top down.

There's not a single thing they do well.

Stevenson averaging 2.1 ypc and our receivers have the worst separation rate in the NFL. It doesn't matter how good your defense is. You not going to win.

It’s the quarterback. Patriot fans have been watching it for years and most other fan bases get, at least, moments of it.

We’ve seen Andy Reid on other teams and if we saw any of his weapons on JAG teams they would just be stat guys and highlights for JAG teams. KC’s winning starts with Mahomes, just like NE’s started with Brady.

If you’re an all-time Cornerback in the NFL like Revis and you’re playing with Mark Sanchez you’re going to be a ESPN First Take discussion and a pro bowler and get top collar for your position. If you’re Revis and you’re playing with Brady you’re going to play for a Super Bowl ring.

You can literally see it everywhere in the league. The Bengals are playing for rings because they have Burrow. KC is playing for rings because they have Mahomes.

Nobody in this team gives AF about Mac Jones. A poster sold me on moving passed Belichick and I think a completely new identity would serve New England well.

Turn the page.
Mac Jones has terrible intangibles and Belichick ingrains too much into new teams of the old era. I think we would benefit a lot from a fire-brand next. A complete culture shock to the system. Complete new era.

 

[Rob0729]

I go back and forth on it, but I remember Bill spending plenty (at the time) for Jonnu Smith and Algohur. I don't think it's that Bill doesn't value elite receivers, it's just that none have been available in the last three or so years. The Hill trade was ridiculous compensation from a team that had multiple 1sts and the some say that Brown would have refused to come here with the Eagles in the mix. I'm hoping for Higgins to come available and us to use all that cap on him.

Belichick has no problem paying good money or even overspending for middle of the road talent. He would never pay for top talent except for on defense. He will pay top dollar to Judon or Gilmore, but I would never see him pay top dollar for a receiver, TE (outside of Gronk who was a generational talent and possibly the best TE ever), or even an o-lineman.

 

[mike_usagisan]

Belichick has no problem paying good money or even overspending for middle of the road talent. He would never pay for top talent except for on defense. He will pay top dollar to Judon or Gilmore, but I would never see him pay top dollar for a receiver, TE (outside of Gronk who was a generational talent and possibly the best TE ever), or even an o-lineman.

I agree, but I also think he might receive a talking to from ownership. I think the Krafts went to him this offseason and said you need to get rid of Patricia and hire a real OC, and we happen to like and have familiarity with BOB. And I think Bill said ok. I think they went to him a couple seasons ago and said, you need to get more consensus from the scouting department on the draft picks, and he said ok.

I think if the Krafts go to Bill and say we think you should strongly consider bringing in an elite WR if there's one available (hint, hint, Higgins), that Bill will listen. I think Bill's capable of collaborating with ownership, his scouting staff and the other coaches more than some people do. I also think he knows his seat is getting a lot hotter and working with ownership is not a bad career move.

 

[PATS16N0]

Belichick has no problem paying good money or even overspending for middle of the road talent. He would never pay for top talent except for on defense. He will pay top dollar to Judon or Gilmore, but I would never see him pay top dollar for a receiver, TE (outside of Gronk who was a generational talent and possibly the best TE ever), or even an o-lineman.

On top of that, Belichick’s shine has been coming off for years. The Butler benching, the Brady drama, the Gronk trade, the roster. We’re 9-10 years in to Belichick acting sus. I also think he lost us ‘07 and whichever year the Eagles II Super Bowl was. Wasted an all-world Brady SB performance.

Shula was before me, but it’s hard to imagine a HC better with consistently game planning specifically for an opponent, halftime adjustments, practicing critical situations, etc. But I think losing the Ego and a fresh start would help move this franchise forward.

New coach. New everything.

 

[Ivan]

The issue was is there was literally one thread on the main forum for Brady/Bucs. Just one and people would come to it just to stir crap for those of us that still wanted to follow the GOAT. Many of them came over to the subforum and did the same thing. That is why I say there were folks here who hated Brady after he left and he left as a FA.

BTW, I don't fault you for any of it but the fact that you had to create a subforum for the greatest Patriot of all time kind of backs up my point that there was hatred for the guy after he left.

This is ********. There were posters bringing Brady up in thread after thread, even long after he left. Ian was right to create a space for those who wanted to follow him with the Bucs, as it had nothing to do with the post Brady Patriots.

 

[PATS16N0]

This is ********. There were posters bringing Brady up in thread after thread, even long after he left. Ian was right to create a space for those who wanted to follow him with the Bucs, as it had nothing to do with the post Brady Patriots.

It had lots to do with the post-Brady Patriots. It’s crazy how people on this forum treat Brady worse than Belichick lol

 

[Rob0729]

I agree, but I also think he might receive a talking to from ownership. I think the Krafts went to him this offseason and said you need to get rid of Patricia and hire a real OC, and we happen to like and have familiarity with BOB. And I think Bill said ok. I think they went to him a couple seasons ago and said, you need to get more consensus from the scouting department on the draft picks, and he said ok.

I think if the Krafts go to Bill and say we think you should strongly consider bringing in an elite WR if there's one available (hint, hint, Higgins), that Bill will listen. I think Bill's capable of collaborating with ownership, his scouting staff and the other coaches more than some people do. I also think he knows his seat is getting a lot hotter and working with ownership is not a bad career move.

I still don't think Belichick is ever going to change. I think he learned nothing from last year. I am guessing that if Kraft didn't tell him he needed a new and real OC, Patricia would be the OC this year. I think he would have convinced himself that after a year of on the job experience, Patricia would be a good OC this year.

And I don't think he will change how he spends his money. I still don't know if he is accepting that he needs to put a lot of talent on offense. He might think a few tweaks here and there and his offense will be exactly where he wants it.

And I don't think that Kraft will ever tell him how to build his roster. Telling him he cannot have a defensive coach as the OC after a disaster season is one thing, telling Belichick he has to spend $20 plus million a year on Tee Higgins is another.

 

[Ivan]

It had lots to do with the post-Brady Patriots. It’s crazy how people on this forum treat Brady worse than Belichick lol

First of all Belichick takes 1000x more **** in this forum than Brady ever has. Second the crying about Brady went on forever, and a Brady forum for him was absolutely needed.

The “ Brady hate” is pure fiction. I don’t think you can name 5 regulars here that have expressed hate for Brady. If you can go ahead and name them, and be sure to provide the examples of their Brady hate.

 

[PATS16N0]

First of all Belichick takes 1000x more **** in this forum than Brady ever has. Second the crying about Brady went on forever, and a Brady forum for him was absolutely needed.

The “ Brady hate” is pure fiction. I don’t think you can name 5 regulars here that have expressed hate for Brady. If you can go ahead and name them, and be sure to provide the examples of their Brady hate.

Honestly, the emphasis that his venture to Tampa was meaningless to Patriot fans seems like a passive aggressive hatorade.

Brady’s 7th ring enshrined and cemented our first six. There’s zero scandal attached to them now. You never hear any credible sports-journalist even bring Media-gates up in a way that’s derogatory. Ex-Steelers just did and got near-universally roasted, and for that you can thank Tom’s win in Tampa.

 

[Ivan]

Honestly, the emphasis that his venture to Tampa was meaningless to Patriot fans seems like a passive aggressive hatorade.

Brady’s 7th ring enshrined and cemented our first six. There’s zero scandal attached to them now. You never hear any credible sports-journalist even bring Media-gates up in a way that’s derogatory. Ex-Steelers just did and got near-universally roasted, and for that you can thank Tom’s win in Tampa.

What does that have to do with what we are discussing?