The Media still HATES us even though we suck. Want Belichick gone bad.

[PATS16N0]

I am not minimizing anything. You and the rest of the Brady cult cannot handle anyone not accepting the false narrative that the second Brady set foot on the football field, he was the greatest player to ever play the game.

He was lol. Nobody is going to give him GOAT status without the resume but the guy that built the resume is the same guy who now has it. You’re the one buying into a “game manager” fantasy that isn’t even slightly grounded in reality.

 

[PATS16N0]

LOL! Never did that.

You would argue that the radio signals were so afraid Brady's greatness and as soon as they moved towards the field and saw Brady they made an about face and went back to the Steelers' sidelines.

Well, wouldn’t they?

 

[Rob0729]

He was lol. Nobody is going to give him GOAT status without the resume but the guy that built the resume is the same guy who now has it. You’re the one buying into a “game manager” fantasy that isn’t even slightly grounded in reality.

He was a game manager in 2001. That is true. I am not saying that he was beyond that. He was a first starter thrown into the starting role because of injury. Belichick was never going to take the reigns off him that year. Whether or not he could have been more than that is debatable.

 

[PATS16N0]

Rob thinks Brady was a JAG in his early career when he won three Superbowls, and he wanted to get rid of him for Jimmy G before his final 4 Superbowls, but in the window between those two things he thinks Tom became the greatest.

I’m sure Tom would be flattered.

 

[Rob0729]

Well, wouldn’t they?

The sad thing is I cannot tell if you are joking or serious because it wouldn't be surprising if you were serious.

 

[PATS16N0]

If Rob was starting a team in 2001 he would take Manning. If he was starting it in 2011 he would take Andrew Luck. He thinks Brady is the “GOAT” though. “Most accomplished” probably sounds more accurate to his ears, actually.

 

[venecol]

I am not minimizing anything. You and the rest of the Brady cult cannot handle anyone not accepting the false narrative that the second Brady set foot on the football field, he was the greatest player to ever play the game.

But you do minimize Brady, saying he wasn't clutch, got lucky, it was the defense, etc. his first few years.

You've done exactly the opposite with Mac, saying he's not performing because of the OL, receivers, coaches, etc.

2001-03 Brady: 10 4QC / 15 GWD
2001 - 3 4QC / 3 GWD Playoffs: 1 4QC / 2 GWD
2002 - 2 4QC / 3 GWD
2003 - 3 4QC / 5 GWD Playoffs: 1 4QC / 2 GWD

2021-23 Mac: 1 4QC / 1 GWD
2021 - 1 4QC / 1 GWD Playoffs: 0 4QC / 0 GWD
2022 - 0 4QC / 0 GWD
2023 - 0 4QC / 0 GWD

I challenge you to find any other QB in the last 23 years with that many 4QC / GWDs in their first 3 years as starters. Dude was the definition of clutch: Tom the Comeback Kid.

 

[Rob0729]

But you do minimize Brady, saying he wasn't clutch, got lucky, it was the defense, etc. his first few years.

You've done exactly the opposite with Mac, saying he's not performing because of the OL, receivers, coaches, etc.

2001-03 Brady: 10 4QC / 15 GWD
2001 - 3 4QC / 3 GWD Playoffs: 1 4QC / 2 GWD
2002 - 2 4QC / 3 GWD
2003 - 3 4QC / 5 GWD Playoffs: 1 4QC / 2 GWD

2021-23 Mac: 1 4QC / 1 GWD
2021 - 1 4QC / 1 GWD Playoffs: 0 4QC / 0 GWD
2022 - 0 4QC / 0 GWD
2023 - 0 4QC / 0 GWD

I challenge you to find any other QB in the last 23 years with that many 4QC / GWDs in their first 3 years as starters. Dude was the definition of clutch: Tom the Comeback Kid.

First, what does Mac Jones have to do with any of this? I never said Mac was clutch. Clearly he hasn't been. Nowhere in this thread have I even brought up Mac Jones. The only reason I brought up Brady was to talk about the perception of him coming into the league.

Second, game winning drives stats are overrated. You have to look at each game and look at the circumstances.

For example, he had the game winning drive his first season in the second Jets game. He scored it with over four minutes left in a 17-16 game and defense ended the game intercepting Testeverde.

Brady got the game winning drive against Buffalo to win 12-9 in overtime in that season. But Brady got the ball back in regulation to win the game with 2 minutes left. Brady dropped back to pass seven times, he completed three passes for 30 yards, had three incompletions and was sacked. He wasn't clutch in regulation, but made up for it in overtime.

Third, I never ever said that Brady wasn't clutch. I addressed a statement that Brady was the most clutch QB in the NFL his first year as a starter. Brady has always been clutch. But to claim he was the most clutch QB in the NFL his first season as a starter

 

[Rob0729]

If Rob was starting a team in 2001 he would take Manning. If he was starting it in 2011 he would take Andrew Luck. He thinks Brady is the “GOAT” though. “Most accomplished” probably sounds more accurate to his ears, actually.

In 2001, the Pats might have won the Super Bowl with Manning. But they might have won the Super Bowl with several top QBs in the league that year. If you cannot accept that, you are just a Brady homer. Brady was good in 2001, but he wasn't the best QB in the league that year and other QBs might have led the Pats to a Super Bowl.

But stop putting words in my mouth. Brady is the greatest of all time. I wouldn't have traded him for anyone. But I am willing to accept that he wasn't the player that you think he was his entire career until at least 2004 and more likely 2007.

 

[sb1]

In 2001, the Pats might have won the Super Bowl with Manning. But they might have won the Super Bowl with several top QBs in the league that year. If you cannot accept that, you are just a Brady homer. Brady was good in 2001, but he wasn't the best QB in the league that year and other QBs might have led the Pats to a Super Bowl.

But stop putting words in my mouth. Brady is the greatest of all time. I wouldn't have traded him for anyone. But I am willing to accept that he wasn't the player that you think he was his entire career until at least 2004 and more likely 2007.

2001 Manning won 6 games and threw 23 picks with weapons like Wayne, Harrison, Edge and Pathon... doubtful he wins with us throwing to Kevin Faulk, Troy Brown, David Patten and Rod Rutledge... not to mention BB and Manning wouldn't have meshed as well as BB and Brady

 

[PATS16N0]

In 2001, the Pats might have won the Super Bowl with Manning. But they might have won the Super Bowl with several top QBs in the league that year. If you cannot accept that, you are just a Brady homer. Brady was good in 2001, but he wasn't the best QB in the league that year and other QBs might have led the Pats to a Super Bowl.

But stop putting words in my mouth. Brady is the greatest of all time. I wouldn't have traded him for anyone. But I am willing to accept that he wasn't the player that you think he was his entire career until at least 2004 and more likely 2007.

 

[Thelonious]

I had intended to discuss this post point by point, but I couldn't really find any, so this is the best I can do.

 

[PATS16N0]

Rob’s last name is Parker.

 

[Rob0729]

2001 Manning won 6 games and threw 23 picks with weapons like Wayne, Harrison, Edge and Pathon... doubtful he wins with us throwing to Kevin Faulk, Troy Brown, David Patten and Rod Rutledge... not to mention BB and Manning wouldn't have meshed as well as BB and Brady

Sorry. I don't remember who was good and who wasn't outside the Patriots players in 2001. So maybe not Manning. The Pats might have won with Kurt Warner. And maybe other QBs.

 

[PATS16N0]

Sorry. I don't remember who was good and who wasn't outside the Patriots players in 2001. So maybe not Manning. The Pats might have won with Kurt Warner. And maybe other QBs.

Rob doesn’t know who was good and who wasn’t in 2001. He just knows 2001 Super Bowl winner Tom Brady wasn’t.

 

[Rob0729]

Rob doesn’t know who was good and who wasn’t in 2001. He just knows 2001 Super Bowl winner Tom Brady wasn’t.

LOL! There you go putting words in my mouth. Brady was good in 2001. Sorry I didn’t remember when Manning got to be elite.

Tell us how Brady turned GatorAid into wine and walked on the Charles without a Duckboat during the Super Bowl celebration.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

In 2001, the Pats might have won the Super Bowl with Manning. But they might have won the Super Bowl with several top QBs in the league that year. If you cannot accept that, you are just a Brady homer. Brady was good in 2001, but he wasn't the best QB in the league that year and other QBs might have led the Pats to a Super Bowl.

But stop putting words in my mouth. Brady is the greatest of all time. I wouldn't have traded him for anyone. But I am willing to accept that he wasn't the player that you think he was his entire career until at least 2004 and more likely 2007.

Yes because we can all envision Manning beating the Raiders in a snowstorm and a last minute Super Bowl drive with the likes of Rod Rutledge, Christian Fauria, and David Patton. We all saw what happened in 2010 when he was limited to just one all pro receiver and melted down like an ice cream cone in hell.

 

[PATS16N0]

Yes because we can all envision Manning beating the Raiders in a snowstorm and a last minute Super Bowl drive with the likes of Rod Rutledge, Christian Fauria, and David Patton.

Made it a third of the way through this sentence before legit lulz.

 

[1960Pats]

The rule was removed because it is based on dumb luck and it was a bad rule. Brady clearly pulled the ball down and had no intention of throwing it, but because he was holding it with two hands in front of his body and hadn't pulled it back into his body the refs ruled he was still in the act of throwing the ball. That is dumb luck. It ok to admit it.

Maybe Brady was thinking about using the tuck rule to his favor if he had the chance. He was always playing chess while everyone else was playing checkers.

I really enjoy the karma involved with the Raiduhs (a team that proudly wore the motto of "if you ain't cheatin you ain't tryin" for their entire history) complaining about a legit rule and acting like they got cheated. And to have it happen vs the Pats 25 years after 1976, and have it be the kickstart to the Pats' doubling the Raiduhs SB win total, makes it just plain sweeter.

What followed the tuck call was even sweeter, even though anyone outside NE would try to erase the memory of it. Brady and the Pats went on an incredible run of pass completions in a blizzard and Vinatieri followed with an incredible kick of historic proportions to tie the game and the Pats won in overtime.

Thanks for the reminder of how truly special that time was for Pats fans.