Dr. Z chimes in

[NEPat]

Tony Romo actually led his team to victory under the same circumstances. I'm not sure how rarefied this class of "throw lots of INTs and still win" really is.

Hey, I said I think it's weird how much praise Peyton is getting for this. My post was more about those criticizing Dr. Z for being anti-Pats.

 

[adventurelarry]

What really gets me is where he says

"They fell behind, 23-0. I thought the result would be like one of those New England Patriot adding machine things, except that Norv Turner doesn't run up scores. "

Perhaps if Norv had 'run up the score' they would not have had to really on a missed field goal for the win........

Run it up, you lose in the public's eye, do not run it up you lose the game.

--Larry

 

[wdkantro2]

It really seems like a double standard to me. If Manning is supposedly one of the best ever, why would anyone accept/praise any performance short of outstanding? Let alone one where he throws 6 INTs...

 

[Lampshade]

Manning is a fantastic QB, one of the best of all-time, but I expect even he's laughing at the absurdity of the praise he's received since sunday.

 

[patchick]

How about this: I give Manning a free pass for that game.

You're allowed an occasional clunker in the course of a HOF career. IMO he's earned the right for us to say "OK, off day, it happens, it doesn't change my opinion of you. We all know you're no Rex Grossman. Carry on."

What I don't get is all the fawning over him for playing god-awfully! You can't praise a performance like that. You'd think from Dr. Z's article that Manning led a stirring comeback with a series of gritty TD drives late in the game. In fact, the Colts's offense didn't score a single point in the last 14 minutes despite the defense delivering 3-and-outs. On the key final drive, Manning had 3 1st downs in SD territory and coudn't punch it in. I'll give him a pass on the stinker, but I'm not going to call it a rose!

 

[oldskool138]

Tony Romo actually led his team to victory under the same circumstances. I'm not sure how rarefied this class of "throw lots of INTs and still win" really is.

See: Roethlisberger, Ben

 

[RodThePat]

I agree.

We've all seen how well Brady plays on a dome with a cast of superstar receivers. I don't know if he could replicate that kind of performance in rough weather, on pressure filled conditions.

Oh wait...

 

[Patsfanin Philly]

>>>>They fell behind, 23-0. I thought the result would be like one of those New England Patriot adding machine things, except that Norv Turner doesn't run up scores. <<<<<<
Wonder if that didn't read " doesn't score"
And his offense never reached the end zone, just returns by Sproles......
That is pathetic considering the weapons..Gates, LdT......

At first I thought he was dissing Peyton, saying it's easy to be great with weapons at the disposal but let's see how you do without weapons (6ints) but it was faint praise...
Maybe he ought to study the Patriots. (2001-2006).O Line, receivers and running game ( pre Corey) to see how someone can overcome deficiencies and succeed without throwing 6 ints.....

 

[Eugene Chung]

I loved how Dr. Z uses Montana, Elway, and Tarkenton performances to define greatness. Comparing Manning to the QBs in the three referenced games is a joke. In those games, Montana, Elway, and Tarkenton all faced a ton of pressure, still put up points, and won the game. Manning didn't do that.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

I've been a big fan of Dr. Z over the years. In the last 12 months or so I have begun to think that he's lost a little off his fast ball, as the saying goes. I always thought of him as the epitome of rational thinking in his assessment of the NFL, even when I disagreed with him. More recently, he seems to allow a range of inconsistent emotion enter into his opinions, as I think is the case here. Remember, it was only the week before that Brady led his team back when many had given up hope.

 

[Stokes]

Something that struck me as odd was his idea that Peyton is effective when under a heavy pass rush. I don't see that as the case at all, in fact I'd say historically that if you can get to him early with the pass rush he becomes much less effective. He does not want to stand in the pocket when there is pressure, that was always the way to beat Peyton Manning! Maybe he's confusing performing under constant pressure with teams blitzing but the solid Indy O-line picking it up, allowing Manning time to hit wide open single covered receivers.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Holy ****, Dr. Z's finally gone and lost his mind. He was on the brink for awhile, but that ant introduction was just off the deep end.

 

[PatriotsReign]

I just threw up a little in my mouth........

I know...you still got a little meatball hangin' on the corner of your mouth

 

[PatriotsReign]

I just LOVED when Deon Sanders said we need to re-visit this Brady/Manning comparison. Let's just see how Peyton performs the next couple of weeks. That way we can compare him to Brady last year.

 

[SoxPatsFaninIndy]

I know...you still got a little meatball hangin' on the corner of your mouth

Not funny..........

 

[Grizzafted]

Yeah... Manning under pressure. What guts, what toughness. Like in 2003 AFC Championship, 2004 AFC Divisional game, 2005 AFC Divisional game... where he reacted so toughly and calmly to pressure.

But, you know, he only had the top offense in the league in each of those years to work with.

Dr. Z is a joke.

 

[BradyFTW!]

They fell behind, 23-0. I thought the result would be like one of those New England Patriot adding machine things, except that Norv Turner doesn't run up scores.

Yeah, see, Norv Turner is classy enough to sit on a 23-0 lead, knowing that Adam Vinatieri will always shank the game-winning 29 yard FG. If that's classy, then I'm glad BB isn't.

Someone tell me if I'm wrong, but the gist of this article seems to be that it's possible to have a good game when your team loses BECAUSE you threw 6 INTs. Talk about his late game heroics all you want, but they still lost and, if he hadn't sucked so badly, there wouldn't have been any need for a comeback, as they would have been crushing a pathetic Chargers offense 40-7 or so.

 

[MassPats38]

I've been a big fan of Dr. Z over the years. In the last 12 months or so I have begun to think that he's lost a little off his fast ball, as the saying goes. I always thought of him as the epitome of rational thinking in his assessment of the NFL, even when I disagreed with him. More recently, he seems to allow a range of inconsistent emotion enter into his opinions, as I think is the case here. Remember, it was only the week before that Brady led his team back when many had given up hope.

I have enjoyed Dr. Z's articles as well, given the fact he usually supports what he says with history. As was the case for me with Peter King, the Spygate position threw me given the fact they both would seem to know documented practices in the NFL and therefore the de minimus value of videotaping. Neither would answe an e-mails I sent requesting they explain their position. Dr. Z made a two or three sentence comment about the Spygate issues, so I fault him far less than Peter King.

 

[TomBrady'sGoat]

I agree with the sentiment that I have no problem with people giving Manning a mulligan for the game. All great players have stinkers. The crazy thing is the adulation he's getting for a horrible game that they in fact lost. His 6 INTs were a major contributing factor to his team losing a game they should never have lost.

Also, the defense was what kept them in the game. The defense gave up 10 points while scoring 7. And all you're hearing is how Manning was gutsy to not let sucking prevent him from going back out there.

Something that struck me as odd was his idea that Peyton is effective when under a heavy pass rush. I don't see that as the case at all, in fact I'd say historically that if you can get to him early with the pass rush he becomes much less effective. He does not want to stand in the pocket when there is pressure, that was always the way to beat Peyton Manning! Maybe he's confusing performing under constant pressure with teams blitzing but the solid Indy O-line picking it up, allowing Manning time to hit wide open single covered receivers.

I'm with you. One of his trademarks is "happy feet" for Christ's sake. While never hearing about this we get idiots on ESPN telling us that you can rattle Brady with pressure. People will believe what they want to believe.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

At the end of the day all of the apologist mediots are rationalizing because absent that they are the ants who lost their beetle.