Does anyone on this board have one LEGITIMATE reason to attack Dungy????

[patsox23]

2) OMG he doesnt support Gay marriage?? he's a BIGOT

Come on, you all can do better than that

He is a homophobe. For me that's enough to dislike him. But overall, I think he's basically a really decent guy. But the Born Again thing has, typically, made him a bit of a creep.

 

[Deus Irae]

People listed a litany of reasons to not like Dungy. You just chose to latch onto the Christian thing. He could have stood on the podium and said, "I'm the first member of the NRA to win a Superbowl! This is a great day for the nation, rifles, and associations!" and it would have been just as irritating. Don't project your own religious insecurities onto those of us who don't find others wearing their religion (or lack thereof) on their sleeves in an attempt to put themselves above others to be all that endearing.

It's like vegans: they might be the most annoying people alive, simply because they feel you simply must know that they're vegan. Don't even get me started on people who wear their religious icons as clothing accessories.

I find anyone who crows about anything to just be a gigantic pain in my ass.

And yet here you are doing exactly what you're complaining about instead of letting what' turned into a non-football thread die....

 

[Fixit]

And yet here you are doing exactly what you're complaining about instead of letting what' turned into a non-football thread die....

And here you are, doing...?

ATTENTION EVERYONE: WHENEVER A DISCUSSION TURNS FROM FOOTBALL, PLEASE CEASE AND DESIST IMMEDIATELY. PAY NO ATTENTION TO ALL OF THE OTHER FORUMS INTO WHICH OFF-TOPIC THREADS EVENTUALLY GET MOVED. THEY ARE ONLY THERE FOR SHOW. GO FAVORITE NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE TEAM!

 

[Deus Irae]

As usual, people can't seem to grasp that holding a different political opinion than the minority, and believing that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to marry is not 'homophobia'. Despite what the homosexual lobby would have you believe, it is not inherently homophobic to disagree with them on any issue.

Furthermore, as usual, people can't keep politics on the political thread. The biggest game of the regular season, and all the idiots can do is cry about gay marriage...

 

[Fixit]

As usual, people can't seem to grasp that holding a different political opinion than the minority, and believing that homosexuals shouldn't be allowed to marry is not 'homophobia'. Despite what the homosexual lobby would have you believe, it is not inherently homophobic to disagree with them on any issue.

Furthermore, as usual, people can't keep politics on the political thread. The biggest game of the regular season, and all the idiots can do is cry about gay marriage...

That's some deep stuff. I'm glad I bore witness to it.

 

[UGAPatsfan]

Substitute "black" for "gay." Is it a bigoted statement then? Just because it's a Christian ideal doesn't mean that intelligent outsiders can't see it for what it is, and that's a thoroughly intolerant and bigoted stance.

You yourself use the words sin and sinner, so get off of your high horse about your gay "friends."

While we're on the topic, has any worthwhile argument ever included the phrase, "Because that is what the bible tells me?"

My IQ is 143, and I have a masters degree. Assuming that someone lacks intelligence because they disagree is a mistake. And in answer to your question about blacks...if I did share that belief (which I do not) I would not be a bigot, I would be a racist, and prejudiced. My entire point is that you two do not seem to undertstand what the definition of the word "bigot" is. The bible is merely meant to be a guide...admitted, but basic anatomy also indicates that men and women were meant to be one, not man and man. As I said...I do not hate gay people at all, I feel sorry for them and what they go through every day, but marriage is a sacred institution between and man and a woman period. And I have only recently become a Christian, I had 30 years before that thinking the same way you do...honestly the gay thing was the hardest part for me to reconcile. Until I objectively looked at what non-traditional family structures have done to this country. But I look as harshly on people who get divorced as I do gay marriage, so take it for one man's opinion. And actually two of the three gay friends that I have don't believe in gay marriage either...try explaining that away.

 

[gomezcat]

As this has landed in the forum that I moderate, I'll keep this one running a little, but will lock it if it gets personal.

 

[Fixit]

My IQ is 143, and I have a masters degree. Assuming that someone lacks intelligence because they disagree is a mistake. And in answer to your question about blacks...if I did share that belief (which I do not) I would not be a bigot, I would be a racist, and prejudiced. My entire point is that you two do not seem to undertstand what the definition of the word "bigot" is. The bible is merely meant to be a guide...admitted, but basic anatomy also indicates that men and women were meant to be one, not man and man. As I said...I do not hate gay people at all, I feel sorry for them and what they go through every day, but marriage is a sacred institution between and man and a woman period. And I have only recently become a Christian, I had 30 years before that thinking the same way you do...honestly the gay thing was the hardest part for me to reconcile. Until I objectively looked at what non-traditional family structures have done to this country. But I look as harshly on people who get divorced as I do gay marriage, so take it for one man's opinion. And actually two of the three gay friends that I have don't believe in gay marriage either...try explaining that away.

"a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance"

This isn't difficult, especially for someone with your massive IQ and master's degree in something. You would deny gays the same rights you have, simply because they're gay. You're intolerant of not what they choose to be but who they are, and who God made them. It's a bigoted stance. However, just for the sake of moving forward, I'll remove "bigot" from my vocabulary. You merely view gays as having no claim to certain rights that heterosexuals enjoy. Good enough?

Tell me, what did your objective research into non-traditional family structures in America turn up? Because I can show you some objective research into non-traditional family structures in European countries that might make you do a double-take. Also, by non-traditional, can I safely assume that you mean single-parent households, as well?

So, you want to keep same-sex marriage illegal. By your own admission, you look as harshly upon divorce as you do gay marriage, but you can't possibly think that divorce should be illegal.

I like this part: "I feel sorry for them and what they go through every day." Who's putting them through it, I wonder? Because it sure ain't me.

 

[Bo0MeR]

Please don't EVER compare the Gay rights movement to the civil rights movement

If you are Black, you are born black. You can't hide it, you can't "stay in the closet" you're entire life, everyone knows and you are judged form the moment someone see's you and you cannot hide from that. Same for any minority. While these two movements share a few similarities they are NOT the same. Gay people were never forced into segregated schools public places, the biggest gay issue right now is Gay Marriage........

And just cause someone doesn't support gay marriage doesn't make them homophobic, I have 2 gay friends, and one doesn't believe in gay marriage either, is he a homophobe??

 

[SteelerSteve]

Hey, Jesus had to suffer. What makes Dungy any different? He'll be canonized before you know it!

By the way, being opposed to the legal union of two consenting adults based upon their sexual orientation does, in fact, make him a bigot. The rest of your "points" exhibit a Gump-like depth of thought.

What so he has to embrace the idea of gay marriage? That does not make him a bigot. Thats what tolerance is, putting up with something you dont agree with. I dont get why you would think that disagreeing with gay marriage would make you a bigot. Just doesn't make sense

 

[Fixit]

Please don't EVER compare the Gay rights movement to the civil rights movement

If you are Black, you are born black. You can't hide it, you can't "stay in the closet" you're entire life, everyone knows and you are judged form the moment someone see's you and you cannot hide from that. Same for any minority. While these two movements share a few similarities they are NOT the same. Gay people were never forced into segregated schools public places, the biggest gay issue right now is Gay Marriage........

And just cause someone doesn't support gay marriage doesn't make them homophobic, I have 2 gay friends, and one doesn't believe in gay marriage either, is he a homophobe??

A) Gays are born gay. I don't see why they should have to hide it. Then again, people could easily hide their religion their whole life, too, so why don't they do that?
B) You're simplifying what gays have gone through. I'd say the fear that one will get the crap kicked out of them or killed because of their orientation is a pretty big issue, too. Fortunately, they haven't been anywhere near as oppressed as blacks have been in this country. Some of us would like to keep it that way. That's why I'm not a big fan of denying something as big as the right to marriage, because that just gives me a bad feeling about where it'll go next.
C) The argument that each of you has two gay friends who don't believe in gay marriage (this sounds suspiciously like the story that every anti-seat belt person tells about knowing someone who would have died if they had been wearing it, but I digress) is idiotic. I know plenty of heteros who are against marriage period. It means two things: jack and squat.
D) One of the hallmarks of homophobia is discrimination. Denying gays the right to marry is a discriminatory practice. It's homophobic, but that's a word that I don't really care to use, because it implies fear.

I'm not impressed by anyone who thinks that they should enjoy rights that others shouldn't merely by accident of birth.

 

[Fixit]

What so he has to embrace the idea of gay marriage? That does not make him a bigot. Thats what tolerance is, putting up with something you dont agree with. I dont get why you would think that disagreeing with gay marriage would make you a bigot. Just doesn't make sense

He doesn't just disagree with it. He wants it outlawed. Big difference. He has no intention of "putting up" with anything.

And yes, denying rights to a group based on who they are is bigotry. Again, substitute "black" for "gay." Better yet, substitute "Christian" for "gay."

Do I need to hold a press conference, or something?

 

[Fixit]

So, anyway, y'all just keep on doing your thing. I shouldn't have to argue why it's wrong to discriminate, so I'll just stop trying.

 

[UGAPatsfan]

"a person obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance"

This isn't difficult, especially for someone with your massive IQ and master's degree in something. You would deny gays the same rights you have, simply because they're gay. You're intolerant of not what they choose to be but who they are, and who God made them. It's a bigoted stance. However, just for the sake of moving forward, I'll remove "bigot" from my vocabulary. You merely view gays as having no claim to certain rights that heterosexuals enjoy. Good enough?

Tell me, what did your objective research into non-traditional family structures in America turn up? Because I can show you some objective research into non-traditional family structures in European countries that might make you do a double-take. Also, by non-traditional, can I safely assume that you mean single-parent households, as well?

So, you want to keep same-sex marriage illegal. By your own admission, you look as harshly upon divorce as you do gay marriage, but you can't possibly think that divorce should be illegal.

I like this part: "I feel sorry for them and what they go through every day." Who's putting them through it, I wonder? Because it sure ain't me.

At what point did I say that I believe it should be illegal? I said that I do not support it period because of what it would lead to. And fyi, my undergrad degree is in psychology, and my Graduate degree is in international banking. So A .) I have done more research about family structure, and dynamics than most (and you are trying to make a factual statement that homosexuality is genetic when there is no proof whatsoever of that.
For every research article you might have that indicates a "nature argument"...I'll show you one that indicates a "nurture argument", and B.) I put zero credibility to anything that any European country does...why? Because the very point I am trying to make is that I don't want the USA to start looking like Europe.

And as for trying to use the old "substitute black for gay" trick...I think you are smarter than that...black is not a choice someone makes every day....gay is. Same with drug addiction being a "disease"...what an insult to people who actually have cancer or something that they can't control. If I said "in order to cure your disease, all you have to do is not pick up a needle" do you think a cancer victim would say "sign me up please"? I think so. Gay people make a choice every day to engage in homosexual behavior...just because one has impulses doesn't mean they can't be controlled. Case in point: I feel an impulse to drink every day...but I don't. I don't piss and moan about "god made me this way so oh well, and I don't say "I was born liking booze so I'll just drink all the time". I use impulse control. Check out this website:http://www.perspectivesjournal.org/2005/08/essay-changing.html

Give it an honest read I think you will at least understand my side.

 

[Bo0MeR]

So, anyway, y'all just keep on doing your thing. I shouldn't have to argue why it's wrong to discriminate, so I'll just stop trying.

You have a few points, but you don't know Dungy's stance 100%, and neither do I. He could be against gay marriages but support civil unions, he may be against gay marriage but supports gay couples having the same privledges of married couples (as far as one's will, belongings goes) One can be against gay marriage and still support those things, you may not believe that gay couples should be united under the religious custom of marriage but maybe be defined under something else. It's not always so black and white.

 

[Bo0MeR]

At what point did I say that I believe it should be illegal? I said that I do not support it period because of what it would lead to. And fyi, my undergrad degree is in psychology, and my Graduate degree is in international banking. So A .) I have done more research about family structure, and dynamics than most (and you are trying to make a factual statement that homosexuality is genetic when there is no proof whatsoever of that.
For every research article you might have that indicates a "nature argument"...I'll show you one that indicates a "nurture argument", and B.) I put zero credibility to anything that any European country does...why? Because the very point I am trying to make is that I don't want the USA to start looking like Europe.

And as for trying to use the old "substitute black for gay" trick...I think you are smarter than that...black is not a choice someone makes every day....gay is. Same with drug addiction being a "disease"...what an insult to people who actually have cancer or something that they can't control. If I said "in order to cure your disease, all you have to do is not pick up a needle" do you think a cancer victim would say "sign me up please"? I think so. Gay people make a choice every day to engage in homosexual behavior...just because one has impulses doesn't mean they can't be controlled. Case in point: I feel an impulse to drink every day...but I don't. I don't piss and moan about "god made me this way so oh well, and I don't say "I was born liking booze so I'll just drink all the time". I use impulse control. Check out this website:http://www.perspectivesjournal.org/2005/08/essay-changing.html

Give it an honest read I think you will at least understand my side.

very well written post

 

[Fixit]

At what point did I say that I believe it should be illegal? I said that I do not support it period because of what it would lead to. And fyi, my undergrad degree is in psychology, and my Graduate degree is in international banking. So A .) I have done more research about family structure, and dynamics than most (and you are trying to make a factual statement that homosexuality is genetic when there is no proof whatsoever of that.
For every research article you might have that indicates a "nature argument"...I'll show you one that indicates a "nurture argument", and B.) I put zero credibility to anything that any European country does...why? Because the very point I am trying to make is that I don't want the USA to start looking like Europe.

And as for trying to use the old "substitute black for gay" trick...I think you are smarter than that...black is not a choice someone makes every day....gay is. Same with drug addiction being a "disease"...what an insult to people who actually have cancer or something that they can't control. If I said "in order to cure your disease, all you have to do is not pick up a needle" do you think a cancer victim would say "sign me up please"? I think so. Gay people make a choice every day to engage in homosexual behavior...just because one has impulses doesn't mean they can't be controlled. Case in point: I feel an impulse to drink every day...but I don't. I don't piss and moan about "god made me this way so oh well, and I don't say "I was born liking booze so I'll just drink all the time". I use impulse control. Check out this website:http://www.perspectivesjournal.org/2005/08/essay-changing.html

Give it an honest read I think you will at least understand my side.

Now I'm totally convinced. Reading that wasn't a complete waste of precious minutes of my life at all.

Have fun with it.

 

[Fixit]

You have a few points, but you don't know Dungy's stance 100%, and neither do I. He could be against gay marriages but support civil unions, he may be against gay marriage but supports gay couples having the same privledges of married couples (as far as one's will, belongings goes) One can be against gay marriage and still support those things, you may not believe that gay couples should be united under the religious custom of marriage but maybe be defined under something else. It's not always so black and white.

Do some research.

 

[Fixit]

I said that I do not support it period because of what it would lead to.

I have to ask, if only to satisfy my curiosity: what would it lead to?

 

[UGAPatsfan]

Now I'm totally convinced. Reading that wasn't a complete waste of precious minutes of my life at all.

Have fun with it.

LOL. Fair enough...we will agree to disagree which is what America is about, but for the future when you encounter these type of debates...people will take you more seriously if you don't try to compare a choice like homosexuality or child molesting (which psychology would have us believe is also genetic...just using your logic) with a true genetic feature like skin color, or height, or eye color.

That is a losing battle you are fighting as the facts are just not there fpr a sound argument.

And Boomer...great point in your previous post. I actually do support same-sex benefits, and civil unions. Just not gay marriage. How odd that the pro-gay people seem to be the ones who always want to paint people in black and white (no pun intended)