Dez Bryant vs Devin McCourty

[supafly]

Can someone make a list of WRs in the league who would "get it" in the Pats system and who wouldn't?

Bill Belichick doesn't even know, which is also one of the bigger reasons why he refuses to waste a gamble on a 1st round pick. Some are going to come in and pick it up, while other great WRs (Galloway, Johnson, Holt) aren't going to grasp it whatsoever, or at least sufficiently enough to make the roster and contribute.

It's likely the second most complicated position on the team behind that of QB. The WR demands to know every possible option in the route tree, how to read and react to defensive positioning both prior to and during the snap, has to be on the same exact page as Brady and the other receivers, and also has to know everyone's responsibility on every single play.

Like I said, Bryant may have been a great gamble in the second round, but Belichick often chooses to go with more of a sure thing when it comes to first round picks. There are tons of 6'5" receivers who try out for teams everyday, but the main question is whether or not they are going to be able to pick up and execute the system. Apparently, Belichick didn't feel that Bryant was worth the gamble, and at the time he had a ton of reasons to believe that.

 

[JackBauer]

lol @ the haters in this thread

Dez may have had issues, but he's one of the best WR's in the NFL. Dmac is a serviceable starter, but he's not on anybody's top 10 list for NFL safeties.

How you squared the beginning of your post with the end will be a question for the ages.

 

[Sciz]

Now please name me 5 Free Safeties that are better than McCourty. I'll start:

Earl Thomas
Dashon Goldson

That's it.

A couple fringe guys that may or may not be better:

- Ed Reed at this point in his career
- Jairus Byrd
- Eric Weddle (doubtful)
- Harrison Smith (young up and comer)
- Eric Reid (in his rookie year, we'll have to wait and see)

Ed Reed is nowhere near McCourty at this point in his career. Dashon Goldson is only better than McCourty if you're more interested in big (and often illegal) hits rather than success in deep coverage. Weddle has been probably the most consistent FS over the past few years. I think there's a heck of an argument to be made that there are a clear top four of Thomas, Byrd, Weddle, and McCourty if you're looking for a deep, centerfield type FS.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Can't believe there are still McCourty detractors out there.guy is in his fourth year and still improving. Top 5 easy. Top 3 by seasons end.

 

[Deus Irae]

Now please name me 5 Free Safeties that are better than McCourty. I'll start:

Earl Thomas
Dashon Goldson

That's it.

A couple fringe guys that may or may not be better:

- Ed Reed at this point in his career
- Jairus Byrd
- Eric Weddle (doubtful)
- Harrison Smith (young up and comer)
- Eric Reid (in his rookie year, we'll have to wait and see)

You're trying to equate the entire NFL WR group with a group comprised of just FS?


Sort of stacking the deck before dealing....

 

[goheels22002]

Considering offense has not been an issue since we became like the colts since 2007, not sure how much better he wouldve made us.

This is not to detract from McCourty, but I would have loved to have a capable Dez Bryant in last January's AFCC against the Ratbirds.

 

[ausbacker]

This is not to detract from McCourty, but I would have loved to have a capable Dez Bryant in last January's AFCC against the Ratbirds.

I would have preferred a fit Rob Gronkowski against the Giants and the Ravens with McCourty on D. People say they understand how important Gronk is to this team yet rarely demonstrate that understanding.

A healthy Gronk will make a bigger difference than Dez Bryant. Gronk healthy + McCourty > Dez Bryant.

 

[condon84]

Not counting Welker in order to avoid the "slot receiver" argument, I can still easily come up with 10 WRs who could, at least arguably, knock Bryant out of the top 10:

C. Johnson
L. Fitzgerald
J. Jones
A.J. Green
A. Johnson
D. Thomas
D. Jackson
B. Marshall
R. White
R. Wayne

I don't disagree that Bryant's the better player right now, but he's not a "no-question about it" elite guy.

THe bolded has to be a joke right?

You can even argue that he's better than D. Thomas, A. Johnson, and B Marshall.

What I see are people going out of their way to underrate Dez's ability as a WR and overrate McCourty's ability as a safety to justify the Pats picking McCourty.

 

[DeutschlandPats]

If you say Mcourty, man you must have good acid!! HAHA!! :rocker:

Dez Bryant! Not even close, sorry brothers.

 

[patsinthesnow]

There is a reason we've given up a total of one bomb in four games, that's Devin. The one bomb we did let up was just a great play by Julio against Devin.

 

[patsfan-1982]

the pats were never going to Draft Bryant IMO it was McCourty vs Kyle Wilson or trade down again

 

[supafly]

the pats were never going to Draft Bryant IMO it was McCourty vs Kyle Wilson or trade down again

I have a feeling that you're right, especially considering that they passed on him at least twice.

They may have even had him off of their board altogether, or it may just have been the apprehension that Belichick seems to feel with first round WR picks.

Another theory is that they may have felt that CB was a bigger need at the time; although usually they attempt to go for BPA, or at the very least combine BPA with some semblance of what they deem as "need" for either the immediate and/or the future.

 

[supafly]

If you say Mcourty, man you must have good acid!! HAHA!! :rocker:

Dez Bryant! Not even close, sorry brothers.

I think that a strong case can be made for Bryant now, but at the time he had some character concerns and questions to his ability to understand a fairly complicated offense.

There have been multiple reports that while at Oklahoma State, the coaches had to run some very limited plays due to his inability to properly understand the proper routes. That alone may have been enough to deter Belichick from taking a chance with him in the first round.

Highsight is always 20/20, and many of us wish that Bryant had been drafted, but I think you need to try and look at the whole picture before coming to the conclusion that it was a mistake.

 

[Froob]

Bill Belichick doesn't even know, which is also one of the bigger reasons why he refuses to waste a gamble on a 1st round pick. Some are going to come in and pick it up, while other great WRs (Galloway, Johnson, Holt) aren't going to grasp it whatsoever, or at least sufficiently enough to make the roster and contribute.

It's likely the second most complicated position on the team behind that of QB. The WR demands to know every possible option in the route tree, how to read and react to defensive positioning both prior to and during the snap, has to be on the same exact page as Brady and the other receivers, and also has to know everyone's responsibility on every single play.

Like I said, Bryant may have been a great gamble in the second round, but Belichick often chooses to go with more of a sure thing when it comes to first round picks. There are tons of 6'5" receivers who try out for teams everyday, but the main question is whether or not they are going to be able to pick up and execute the system. Apparently, Belichick didn't feel that Bryant was worth the gamble, and at the time he had a ton of reasons to believe that.

Kinda makes me wonder sometimes if it's worth having such a complicated system. Obviously our offense has had a great amount of success throughout the years although they've had some struggles in the playoffs. Is the Peyton Manning offense as complicated as ours or do they not ask as much from the wide outs?

 

[Deus Irae]

THe bolded has to be a joke right?..

No.

Roddy White, for example, has 6 consecutive seasons with more than 80 catches and 1100 yards, and has caught 100 or more passes in a season twice.

 

[supafly]

Kinda makes me wonder sometimes if it's worth having such a complicated system. Obviously our offense has had a great amount of success throughout the years although they've had some struggles in the playoffs.

I think that the consistent scoring points to it being pretty successful. We also must remember that the playoffs are bringing out the best defenses that are left, so there is some credit to be given there too.

Is the Peyton Manning offense as complicated as ours or do they not ask as much from the wide outs?

Manning's offense is practically identical to the one he ran in Indy. Belichick stated last year that "it's identical. It looks the same to me."

It is NOT overly complex at all. It is based primarily on execution (although that could be said for just about any offense on some level), and simplicity.

How a return to the simplicity of Peyton Manning's Indy offense has ignited the Denver Broncos - Grantland

 

[BritPat]

It's still McCourty.

You can keep your shiny hood ornaments. They do nothing.

 

[goheels22002]

There is a reason we've given up a total of one bomb in four games, that's Devin. The one bomb we did let up was just a great play by Julio against Devin.

A lot of factors at play with the secondary this year, but it is night and day between this year and last year.

 

[Mack Herron]

I looked up perfect pass defense in the dictionary:

 

[Spiral]

I think statements like this are pretty naive. Don't forget that both Falcons safeties were Pro Bowlers last season, yet they gave up several deep throws to an undrafted free agent. There's no shame in Julio Jones making an absolutely brilliant catch on a perfect pass. The rules favour the offense in so many ways.

And I wonder if you've actually watched a lot of Dallas games all the way through, or just catch the highlights. Are you the Fantasy Footballer who watches the box scores and ESPN to see Dez Bryant having a huge statistical game against Kansas City with a few circus catches? Or did you watch the entire game and see him drop an absolutely perfect deep ball that would have gone for a score in a game the Cowboys lost by a point?

If people watch Bryant play a lot and still prefer him to McCourty, then fine. But if it's based just on "playmaking" on ESPN, almost every starting WR in the league is going to make more highlight plays than even Pro Bowl defensive backs.

You can go back to your Fantasy Football league now.

I have a lot of posts on this thread--you can check all of them if you like, but I never said I'd prefer Bryant over McCourty. Bryant is a very talented receiver who can make game-changing plays, but he'd be a bad fit in this scheme and probably in this locker room. My main point is that McCourty is playing safety because he can't turn and run with most wide receivers. He proved that to everybody in 2011 and at times last year. He is an upgrade to the other guys that were at FS before him, but he's pretty over-rated by a lot of Patriots fans, IMO.