Conversion projects - WR to CB

[VJCPatriot]

We have seen plenty of defensive player to offensive player conversions. We often try to project a DE or LB to TE in our system. But how about the other way around?

Note how the average height of starting WRs has steadily increased over the years in the NFL. Yet it seems yearly that the toughest thing to find is a corner who is big enough and yet has the physical skills and quickness to keep up with the new generation of WRs in the NFL.

What's the solution then? If there's a position of scarcity, why not CONVERT? The premier example of the WR to CB conversion is Richard Sherman himself. Sherman was taken with a 5th round draft pick by the Seahawks and the rest is history.

Much like Brady, I'm sure that Sherman plays with a chip on his shoulder due to his late draft status. But thinking along those lines, why don't we hunt for the next Richard Sherman? Why not draft a WR with an eye to see if they can be converted to the much more valuable CB position? And if they don't work out at CB, heck we still have a need at WR, so it wouldn't be a loss anyways.

Some guys I'm eyeing for possible conversion:

WR prospect 6-6 220 lb Brandon Coleman from Rutgers. At 6-6 Coleman towers over most cornerbacks, and if his role were reversed he would tower over even most elite receivers. If he could play the defensive side of the ball, we'd have ourselves the next Brandon Browner??
Mel Kiper Jr. projects Rutgers WR Brandon Coleman as an early Day 3 NFL Draft pick | NJ.com

A more elite athletic prospect would be the explosive 6-2 220 lb Donte Moncrief. He put up eye-popping numbers at the combine. 4.40 40, 39.5" VJ and 11' broad jump. As a 2-way player Moncrief could possibly play at an elite level.
Donte Moncrief, WR, Ole Miss, NFL Draft - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

And here's a guy who has been mentioned but not really focused on as a former WR turned to CB. Stanley Jean Baptiste. At 6'3 215 lbs, SJB has all the physical traits you are looking for in a big CB. Of course he needs more polish and needs to work on taking better angles in run pursuit. But it's expected to see some rawness from a conversion project. But the payoff once he puts it all together may be well worth the wait.

2014 NFL Draft Profile: Nebraska CB Stanley Jean-Baptiste | Big Time Football

So is there anybody else you would have in mind for a conversion project to CB? I know that we already have Revis and Browner, so this isn't exactly a high priority need presently.

But if you start developing that guy now, you insure yourself a year or two down the road, that say if Revis leaves to another team for more money, that your secondary has a stud waiting in the wings.

 

[mayoclinic]

Conversion projects are always interesting, and some can be wildly successful, but you need to be careful in deciding which one(s) to take on at a pro level, especially if the player has no prior experience at the new position. Some WRs have played DB in high school. Some, like Richard Sherman and Stanley Jean-Baptiste, convert in college and have several years of accelerated adjustment to the position. Things that need to be considered include:

- The willingness of the player to convert.
- The mentality of the player. Does he have a defender's mind set.
- Does the player have the patience and study habits to learn a new position.
- Physical skill set and suitability. Brandon Coleman, for example, is 6'6", which is too tall for a CB, and has a poor 3-cone and short shuttle. He's not likely to be a successful conversion. You want guys with good long speed and short area quickness plus good maneuverability.
- What is the length to impact likely to be? Richard Sherman took several years, and his adjustment in college was one reason he slipped to the 5th round. If you take on a player who is a brand new conversion, then are you basically taking 2-3 years to develop him, and are you willing to risk doing that? What are the odds of success?
- How much does the player cost in draft capital? Donte Moncrief is a likely day 2 prospect at WR who could impact immediately. Even if he is willing, does it make sense to spend that high a draft pick on a player and then spend 2+ years converting him to a new position?

I don't mean to discourage the general idea, but I think you have to be very selective. I'm higher on some of the potential TE conversions, like QB Logan Thomas (perfect measurables, plus prior experience at TE, and was originally recruited to Virginia Tech as a TE) or DE Larry Webster (again, perfect measurables, plus a strong basketball background which often translates well to the TE position).

As far as WR to TE conversions, I would look to late round/UDFA guys who are unlikely to impact immediately at WR and who have perfect size and measurables to project to DB, especially those with prior experience. Manx mentioned two possible guys today:

1. Micah Hatfield, WR, Oregon St. 6' 0 1/2" 185#. 4.41 40, 6.38 3C, 38" VJ. Was all state as both a WR and CB in high school.
2. Quron Pratt, WR, Rutgers. 5' 11 1/8" 195#. 4.46 40, 6.80 3C, 4.08 SS, 34.5" VJ. Played defensive back in high school and was originally recruited there by Rutgers, then switched to WR.

Those kind of guys are long shots to make teams at WR, and are more likely to be open to any kind of switch which gives them a better shot at success.

 

[sircole]

Jerick Mckinnion, RB, Georgia Southern. 5' 9" 4.41 40, 6.83 3C, 40.5" was an all-around athlete that played cornerback at Georgia Southern:

One the nation's premier athletes, McKinnon's versatility was on full display his sophomore year. He, while rotating all over the field, passed for, ran for and caught a touchdown during the season. Playing defensive back, McKinnon intercepted two passes versus Maine in the FCS quarterfinals and added a kickoff return that afternoon for good measure. The Sprayberry-native was showing up on stat sheets like decimals and curved numbers. Georgia Southern, again, advanced the final four.

McKinnon?s Mantra - Southern Pigskin

 

[Observer]

The guys in college are already plying at a very high level. At that level it is hard enough to do one thing well let alone try your hand at something new. Once money also enters the picture, I think it is simply way too risky to take that kind of chance.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

2. Quron Pratt, WR, Rutgers. 5' 11 1/8" 195#. 4.46 40, 6.80 3C, 4.08 SS, 34.5" VJ. Played defensive back in high school and was originally recruited there by Rutgers, then switched to WR.

Those kind of guys are long shots to make teams at WR, and are more likely to be open to any kind of switch which gives them a better shot at success.

This seems almost . . . inevitable. :bricks:

 

[VJCPatriot]

Always good to hear what the posters on this forum have to say. very informative!

Is Hatfield's 3-cone a typo, because that would be unreal if 6.38 is his actual 3-cone time! I haven't seen a number that low since... well ever? Welker's 3-cone was 7.09, Edelman's 3-cone was 6.62, and McCourty's 3-cone was 6.70 just for comparison!

 

[mayoclinic]

Always good to hear what the posters on this forum have to say. very informative!

Is Hatfield's 3-cone a typo, because that would be unreal if 6.38 is his actual 3-cone time! I haven't seen a number that low since... well ever? Welker's 3-cone was 7.09, Edelman's 3-cone was 6.62, and McCourty's 3-cone was 6.70 just for comparison!

That was the number reported by Tony Pauline on Twitter. I don't know if it's "official", but it's not a typo.

For comparison, some 3-cone numbers:

- Darrelle Revis: 6.56.
- Jason Verrett: 6.69.
- Phillip Gaines: 6.62.
- Odell Beckham: 6.69.
- Brandin Cooks: 6.76.
- DeSean Jackson: 6.82.
- Devin McCourty: 6.70.

The best 3-cone officially recorded at the NFL Combine since 2006 was 6.42 from Oregon WR Jeff Maehl. BYU safety Daniel Sorenson had a 6.47 this year.

 

[manxman2601]

Always good to hear what the posters on this forum have to say. very informative!

Is Hatfield's 3-cone a typo, because that would be unreal if 6.38 is his actual 3-cone time! I haven't seen a number that low since... well ever? Welker's 3-cone was 7.09, Edelman's 3-cone was 6.62, and McCourty's 3-cone was 6.70 just for comparison!

The best 3 cone time at the combine was 6.42 by Jeff Maehl. I suspect that finding the best at a pro day will be difficult. Interestingly, and I'm as guilty as anyone in linking 3-cone times to the Patriots, not one of the top 10 was drafted by the Patriots.

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Edit: and in response to the question of switching WR to CB, how about Josh Boyce? Has speed and smooth hips and at 206lbs, has the size to hold up on defense. I'm not saying we should do it, just think he could make the transition.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Edit: and in response to the question of switching WR to CB, how about Josh Boyce? Has speed and smooth hips and at 206lbs, has the size to hold up on defense. I'm not saying we should do it, just think he could make the transition.

Interesting proposal. And lest we forget. Julian Edelman has played CB snaps in the past when we were dealing with a rash of injuries. His 3 cone time as noted was a cat-like 6.62. I also remember Troy Brown playing at CB in emergency circumstances.

If Boyce fails to catch on at WR with all the added depth we are stacking at the position, I wouldn't be surprised to see BB try him out at CB during training camp although our CB depth chart is also super stacked right now.

I'm just wondering if BB will take a flyer on a WR specifically to convert him to CB such as some of the above mentioned candidates: Hatfield, SJB, Pratt, etc. I am bracing myself for at least a couple of Rutger alums. LOL.

And a TE conversion project wouldn't shock me either considering that the position is a need and there might be a scarcity because of our current draft pick positioning.

 

[Luxusdk]

Logan Thomas are really the way i would go, could be "3" QB on the roster NeXT year as Edelman are right now.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

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Interesting to see Isaac Sopoaga up there tied at number 10 in the bench presses....