Colvins release

[JackBauer]

Frankly, my theory is that the loss to the Giants has caused them to lose their minds and make hasty and uncharacteristically bad decisions. I look forward to the next 2 weeks proving that theory wrong.

Are you serious, or is this snark? I really hope it's the latter.

 

[TruthSeeker]

The surprise would have been if the Patriots had kept Colvin at that cost with his injury concerns.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

There are a lot of factors at play - not the least of which is his injury and whether he'll be ready for the season.

Bringing back a perfectly healthy Colvin in his last, albeit expensive, season under contract wouldn't have been a surprise - especially given the need for LBs this offseason.

Letting him go indicates two things:

1. Colvin's injury might not have him fully healthy for the start of the season and

2. The Patriots have a plan to address LB needs that might or might not include Colvin if he signs elsewhere.

In either case I have confidence that BB will address the LB position in the offseason.

It might also be indicative of something else - that the plan to play AD inside was not paying the dividends they anticipated, and therefore they were forced to choose between the two outside. AD's dead cap alone would win that battle hands down. We may never know but if Rosie gets signed to a starting OLB deal somewhere else and is ready to play come September...I just hope we have system functional ILB's coming so we're not getting run over like the Beisel Brown experiment.

But there is little incentive in attempting to discuss the matter rationally since the board always polarizes at these times between the this is nothing and was to be expected crowd and the OMG the team is unraveling crowd, who when they aren't arguing amongst themselves start pointing fingers at anyone who just wonders why in fact something may have happened and how it may impact teambuilding for the current season.

 

[Rob0729]

He overpaid for Ty Law, just to name one. Sometimes, you overpay, no matter who you are. As for the rest of your post, get back to me when you realize that the man hasn't even been on the market for 24 hours.

Law was in his prime and healthy and arguably a top 3-5 player at his position at the time. Colvin is at the tail end of his prime, coming off an injury that ended his season and could still not be healed by season starts, and not in the top 5 at his position. Remember the Pats could have kept Law the following year at the same price as the year before and cut him because of an injury.

Until we know what Colvin's injury is, how do we know if the Pats made the wrong decision? What if it is a lisc franc injury? That type of injury could be bad enough that he never fully recovers. Nobody complained when we cut Law for that same reason.

 

[JackBauer]

He overpaid for Ty Law, just to name one. Sometimes, you overpay, no matter who you are. As for the rest of your post, get back to me when you realize that the man hasn't even been on the market for 24 hours.

Of course, a shutdown CB is worth a lot more (and worth overpaying for, in some circumstances) than a good OLB who is recovering from a serious injury.

 

[fgssand]

It might also be indicative of something else - that the plan to play AD inside was not paying the dividends they anticipated, and therefore they were forced to choose between the two outside. AD's dead cap alone would win that battle hands down. We may never know but if Rosie gets signed to a starting OLB deal somewhere else and is ready to play come September...I just hope we have system functional ILB's coming so we're not getting run over like the Beisel Brown experiment.

But there is little incentive in attempting to discuss the matter rationally since the board always polarizes at these times between the this is nothing and was to be expected crowd and the OMG the team is unraveling crowd, who when they aren't arguing amongst themselves start pointing fingers at anyone who just wonders why in fact something may have happened and how it may impact teambuilding for the current season.

Colvins release tells me a lot...let's see how right I am:

So...here are 10 things I think we are up to:

1) AD is best suited to play outside and will be an absolute BEAST when teamed up with Vrable..again outside.

2) Colvin will never be the player we had hoped..the hip reduce his effectiveness significantly, he was never nearly as fast and agile upon his return and now the foot further limits him.

3) Bruschi is coming back......that enables #1 to happen.

4) Seau will return as well.

5) #3 & #4 will serve as teachers and split the role of ILB masters and super subs.

6) We draft LB's high - at least two of them (maybe even at #1 depending on who is there).

7) We are willing to spend some cash on FA's LB's.

8) Woods & Alexander are ready - at least one of them ( I think Woods).

9) Slight changes to overall scheme - younger and better cover guys at LB.

10) WE all really have no clue and simply need to trust BB/SP

 

[JackBauer]

Colvins release tells me a lot...let's see how right I am:

So...here are 10 things I think we are up to:

1) AD is best suited to play outside and will be an absolute BEAST when teamed up with Vrable..again outside.

2) Colvin will never be the player we had hoped..the hip reduce his effectiveness significantly, he was never nearly as fast and agile upon his return and now the foot further limits him.

3) Bruschi is coming back......that enables #1 to happen.

4) Seau will return as well.

5) #3 & #4 will serve as teachers and split the role of ILB masters and super subs.

6) We draft LB's high - at least two of them (maybe even at #1 depending on who is there).

7) We are willing to spend some cash on FA's LB's.

8) Woods & Alexander are ready - at least one of them ( I think Woods).

9) Slight changes to overall scheme - younger and better cover guys at LB.

10) WE all really have no clue and simply need to trust BB/SP

I don't find it particularly likely that both Bruschi AND Seau will return.

 

[hwc]

What if it is a lisc franc injury? That type of injury could be bad enough that he never fully recovers.

For all intents and purposes, any foot injury that puts a player on IR raises big red flags, whether it is a specific lis franc injury or the same kind of ligament injury to another spot on the foot.

The foot injuries these NFL players are suffering may be the biggest question marks of any injury out there. At least with a torn ACL, you know what you are up against in terms of a prognosis.

The docs just don't know with these foot injuries until six months down the road when the player tries it out and can either cut effectively or not. Many of these foot injuries are chronic. There's just nothing holding the foot together once the ligaments are compromised.

Forget Colvin. The team that is sitting in a precarious position with a foot injury is the Colts and Dwight Freeney. With the signing bonus they just paid him, that foot better heal....

 

[Jimke]

Colvins release tells me a lot...let's see how right I am:

So...here are 10 things I think we are up to:

1) AD is best suited to play outside and will be an absolute BEAST when teamed up with Vrable..again outside.

2) Colvin will never be the player we had hoped..the hip reduce his effectiveness significantly, he was never nearly as fast and agile upon his return and now the foot further limits him.

3) Bruschi is coming back......that enables #1 to happen.

4) Seau will return as well.

5) #3 & #4 will serve as teachers and split the role of ILB masters and super subs.

6) We draft LB's high - at least two of them (maybe even at #1 depending on who is there).

7) We are willing to spend some cash on FA's LB's.

8) Woods & Alexander are ready - at least one of them ( I think Woods).

9) Slight changes to overall scheme - younger and better cover guys at LB.

10) WE all really have no clue and simply need to trust BB/SP

#10 is the answer.

 

[Deus Irae]

Hobson had 100 tackles, 6 sacks, and an INT in the Jets defense Mangini's first year. Not too shabby. The Jets let go of Pete Kendall over $1 million which totally destroyed their o-line. They may end up doing the same thing with Coles. The Jets haven't exactly made a lot of great decisions over there especially about paying their players.

As for Pace, it may be because he was a DE under Dennis Green's system and when Whisenhunt came in this past year, they moved him to OLB. It seems like he was misused by the Green regime.

The Pats let go of Colvin. Shouldn't that be as solid as a red flag as Pace and Hobson. At least the Pats have a much longer track record of knowing what they are doing than the Mangini/Tanenbaum Jets. I certainly trust Belichick and Pioli with their personal decisions over Man-not so-genius and Tanebaum.

1.) Last year was not Mangini's first year. Last year, Hobson had 62 tackles and 2 sacks, which was a major step down from his career year in Mangini's first season, where he got 6 sacks to go along with those 100 tackles.

2.) No matter what the reason, it's undeniable that Pace's contract season was completely out of character with his past history. Now, any team looking to pay him is going to have to gamble on it having been for reasons other than financial motivation.

3.) As for the Patriots letting go of Colvin, how does the Chad Brown/Monty Biesel duo justify your faith in BB? Every team makes mistakes, after all.

I can give Belioli the benefit of the doubt and still have fun positing a theory about their recent moves. Let's call it 'multitasking'.

 

[signbabybrady]

For all intents and purposes, any foot injury that puts a player on IR raises big red flags, whether it is a specific lis franc injury or the same kind of ligament injury to another spot on the foot.

The foot injuries these NFL players are suffering may be the biggest question marks of any injury out there. At least with a torn ACL, you know what you are up against in terms of a prognosis.

The docs just don't know with these foot injuries until six months down the road when the player tries it out and can either cut effectively or not. Many of these foot injuries are chronic. There's just nothing holding the foot together once the ligaments are compromised.

Forget Colvin. The team that is sitting in a precarious position with a foot injury is the Colts and Dwight Freeney. With the signing bonus they just paid him, that foot better heal....

People are searching for answers....Did you hear anywhere that it was a ligament injury to his foot. Or are you just throwing that out there?

From what I heard it was a break/fracture. A normal fracture is not anything that should linger.

I realize my source may not have been honest because what else is he going to say. But I saw Colvin's father at the Super Bowl and he told me it was a fracture. He said he was already out of the cast and that it shouldn't be a problem.

Assuming he was being truthful than you need another reason as to why we cut him. Money would seem like the logical answer.

 

[VOODOOZF]

Rotoworld is saying that the Pats cut Colvin because he failed a physical.

 

[Rob0729]

1.) Last year was not Mangini's first year. Last year, Hobson had 62 tackles and 2 sacks, which was a major step down from his career year in Mangini's first season, where he got 6 sacks to go along with those 100 tackles.

2.) No matter what the reason, it's undeniable that Pace's contract season was completely out of character with his past history. Now, any team looking to pay him is going to have to gamble on it having been for reasons other than financial motivation.

3.) As for the Patriots letting go of Colvin, how does the Chad Brown/Monty Biesel duo justify your faith in BB? Every team makes mistakes, after all.

I can give Belioli the benefit of the doubt and still have fun positing a theory about their recent moves. Let's call it 'multitasking'.

1. The entire Jet defense sucked last year. They got their first team sack around midseason. I blame the Jets' d-line for there pass rush.

2. Pace does come with a bit of a risk, but so does Colvin with a major foot injury which even he seems to admit is not close to being 100%.

3. At least the Chad Brown part of that combo was out of Belichick's and Pioli's control. Unless they planned for Bruschi to have a stroke, the Pats kinda were backed against a wall on what they could do at the ILB position in 2005. My guess is that if they were prepared to go into the offseason knowing that Brusci was going to be incompasitated for at least the first six games, they might have had a different plan than going into the season with Brown and Beisel as their ILBs.

Brown was a desperation move based on the unexpected loss of Bruschi and the uncertainty on whether they needed to replace him short term or long term. They chose to go for a stop-gap solution with Brown rather than a long term solution elsewhere.

Overall, the Pats have been very good in their choices at LB. Vrabel and Phifer were considered questionable or low upside moves and they were spectacular pick ups. Bryan Cox was not a huge contributor, but set the tone for the defense for the 2001 season with his agressive play against the Colts. Colvin was a very good pick up even if he had injury problems. Seau was a steal for what he cost and contributed.

I guess you don't need to have blind faith in Belichick and Pioli, but I do think you have to think they have more information on Colvin and his injuries than any of us know. Belichick has always been a huge fan of Colvin. I don't think he made the decision lightly. I personally think there are probably real concerns on what type of player Colvin can be after this injury and his hip. \

 

[Fencer]

I think the now-FA Colvin is an obvious target for the Pats.

In fact, that's so obvious I won't bore you all by recounting the reasons.

 

[Ring 6]

I give Belioli credit for being smarter than your theory would make them out to be in my eyes, so I don't buy that theory. With Seau and Bruschi having a combined age in the neighborhood of 534 years, focusing on OLB replacement rather than ILB is counterproductive, and very non-BB like. Given how poor the free agent market is this season, this release makes no sense at all to me, because Colvin is now one of the best 2-3 linebackers on the market, and the best one with experience in the 3-4. Frankly, my theory is that the loss to the Giants has caused them to lose their minds and make hasty and uncharacteristically bad decisions. I look forward to the next 2 weeks proving that theory wrong.

Maybe you need to revisit what you consider smart.
Thomas is an OLB who was given a huge contract but required to play out of position in the first year. Colvin was set to make a ton of money and we already have starters who are at least just as good at his position, and neither of them have had 2 season ending injuries in the last 5 years.
I do not think 'smart' is paying a ton of money to have players out of position, and/or on the IR.
As I said, this decision was 90% made a year ago when they signed Thomas because they did not sign him to convert him to a career ILB.

Perhaps you should at least wait until free agency begins before you decide BB and Pioli have lost their minds. But, apparently you can authoratively judge their decisions, confidently thinking you know more than them, and do it 1.3% of the way through the decision making process.

 

[Ring 6]

It might also be indicative of something else - that the plan to play AD inside was not paying the dividends they anticipated, and therefore they were forced to choose between the two outside. AD's dead cap alone would win that battle hands down. We may never know but if Rosie gets signed to a starting OLB deal somewhere else and is ready to play come September...I just hope we have system functional ILB's coming so we're not getting run over like the Beisel Brown experiment.

But there is little incentive in attempting to discuss the matter rationally since the board always polarizes at these times between the this is nothing and was to be expected crowd and the OMG the team is unraveling crowd, who when they aren't arguing amongst themselves start pointing fingers at anyone who just wonders why in fact something may have happened and how it may impact teambuilding for the current season.

How about the plan was to play AD outside, but the current roster dictated he spend a year inside? How is that so hard to grasp for everyone?
BB is set at OLB, but signs a big Free Agent OLB. Would you expect he DIDNT factor in the cap and contract status of the OLBs? Would you think he would pass on a guy he really wants on his team because he has to move him inside for one year? Is it so hard to believe that the major opening for Thomas was in 2008, and we fit him in where he could fit in 2007? OR that with Colvins injury history we may have expected that we would need Thomas eventually at OLB, and again, fit him in out of position, because he's just a good football player who could do it?

 

[Deus Irae]

Maybe you need to revisit what you consider smart.
Thomas is an OLB who was given a huge contract but required to play out of position in the first year. Colvin was set to make a ton of money and we already have starters who are at least just as good at his position, and neither of them have had 2 season ending injuries in the last 5 years.
I do not think 'smart' is paying a ton of money to have players out of position, and/or on the IR.
As I said, this decision was 90% made a year ago when they signed Thomas because they did not sign him to convert him to a career ILB.

Perhaps you should at least wait until free agency begins before you decide BB and Pioli have lost their minds. But, apparently you can authoratively judge their decisions, confidently thinking you know more than them, and do it 1.3% of the way through the decision making process.

1.) I gave Belioli more credit than you did, because unlike you, I'm confident that the idea of ceremoniously dumping Colvin if he'd had a great season would not have been foremost in their minds.

2.) Since when is having depth at linebacker something this team has tried to avoid?

3.) I'm not judging their decisions, I'm positing a theory that I noted I looked forward to them disproving over the next 2 weeks. I also added:

I've always given Belioli the benefit of the doubt. It doesn't mean I can't have a pet theory to toy with for the next couple of weeks. Colvin's release makes no sense in a vacuum.

So, feel free to read entire posts and threads rather than making stupid comments claiming I've done things I clearly haven't. As an isolated move, dumping Colvin now is without merit. Now, once the team goes out and makes moves, I'll reevaluate my theory at that time. As I noted, it's just for fun. Spygate is boring.

 

[Ring 6]

1.) I gave Belioli more credit than you did, because unlike you, I'm confident that the idea of ceremoniously dumping Colvin if he'd had a great season would not have been foremost in their minds.

2.) Since when is having depth at linebacker something this team has tried to avoid?

3.) I'm not judging their decisions, I'm positing a theory that I noted I looked forward to them disproving over the next 2 weeks. I also added:



So, feel free to read entire posts and threads rather than making stupid comments claiming I've done things I clearly haven't. As an isolated move, dumping Colvin now is without merit. Now, once the team goes out and makes moves, I'll reevaluate my theory at that time. As I noted, it's just for fun. Spygate is boring.

How is your position that they lost their minds giving them more credit than mine that simple says they PLAN AHEAD??????
Are you really telling me that it would be smart management to sign Thomas without considering the contract and cap status of the other players at the position?
Do you really think Colvin was worth that cap hit with Vrabel and Thomas playing the same positon? Do you doubt we are better from here on with Thomas than with Colvin?

Depth is bad when it costs more than it is worth.

If you arent judging their decisions why would you say they have lost their minds and made uncharacteristically bad decisions?

Have the b@lls to stand behind what you say, rather than saying it in one post and then pretending you didn't in another.

 

[Deus Irae]

How is your position that they lost their minds giving them more credit than mine that simple says they PLAN AHEAD??????
Are you really telling me that it would be smart management to sign Thomas without considering the contract and cap status of the other players at the position?
Do you really think Colvin was worth that cap hit with Vrabel and Thomas playing the same positon? Do you doubt we are better from here on with Thomas than with Colvin?

Depth is bad when it costs more than it is worth.

If you arent judging their decisions why would you say they have lost their minds and made uncharacteristically bad decisions?

Have the b@lls to stand behind what you say, rather than saying it in one post and then pretending you didn't in another.

Oh, quit nagging me as if you're my mother. It's an angle I decided to take because I thought it would be interesting, and crediting Belioli with intelligence during the time of the Thomas signing isn't something that is mutually exclusive with the theory of "lost their minds after the SB loss". They had already dealt with the Stallworth option and, consequently, had enough money under the cap that this wasn't financially necessary at this time. If you don't like the theory, so be it. I'll try not to lose sleep over your disapproval. This team has better informational security than the Pentagon, so sometimes (say, during the offseason doldrums, for example) it's fun to wonder 'why' something is done.

As for the cost of depth, please don't make yourself look more foolish than necessary. There's something called an 'extension' that could have been looked into. Given the team involved, it's not surprising that we've not heard whether there were any such discussions.

Current LB's:

Thomas
Vrabel
Woods
Alexander

Yep, couple that fearsome foursome with the 900 outstanding free agent linebackers and there's simply no room for questioning the dumping of Colvin at this point in time.

 

[Pats726]

I am not surprised or shocked by it at all..and I don't know what others are thinking that ARE shocked. That cap hit was a large one and for someone coming off IR and with another serious injury, I think 5 mil is a bit too much. I agree, depth is nice, but NOT at that price..and if that money can be used better to strengthen the team in other ways?? What is the problem? The FO is doing what it does best.