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CHFF: Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft


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The article is only offensive to those who are so politically correct that their getting offended about pretty much everything is to be expected.

Sorry, Deus. But it's offensive because the comparison of BB to a man responsible for well over 20 million deaths is factually untrue. As for it not being "PC", it's just poor taste..

As for facts, the are very little in this article and it's definitely not what I've come to expect from CHFF.

Finally, you post something about the article that's relevant to a sports board. Furthermore, I agree that the article is far too simplistic in its approach. Had you taken the article from that angle from the beginning, instead of whining about the analogy, you'd have had an actual point.

His point about the analogy was valid. Just because you disagree doesn't me he didn't have a point.

Also, considering that the Pats have used 8-12 roster spots for DBs since BB took over, drafting an avg. of 2 DBs per year actually falls right in line with the % of DBs on the 53 man roster. Something that the author overlooks. And also invalidates one of his main premises..
 
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in the 8 years 2000-07 it looks like belichick drafted 3 or 4 guys in the top 4 or 5 rounds who failed to become starters, and he picked up one guy who recently commanded $9m/year.

if this is abject failure I'd be curious to see how it compares to other teams.
 
Sorry, Deus. But it's offensive because the comparison of BB to a man responsible for well over 20 million deaths is factually untrue. As for it not being "PC", it's just poor taste..

As for facts, the are very little in this article and it's definitely not what I've come to expect from CHFF.



His point about the analogy was valid. Just because you disagree doesn't me he didn't have a point.

Also, considering that the Pats have used 8-12 roster spots for DBs since BB took over, drafting an avg. of 2 DBs per year actually falls right in line with the % of DBs on the 53 man roster. Something that the author overlooks. And also invalidates one of his main premises..

His point about the analogy was about being PC. Why the hell should the use of Hitler be out of bounds in a world of free speech? Also, CHFF has gone downhill over the course of recent years, so you should probably lower your expectations regarding that site.

Lastly, you can point to drafting %, but it's really a waste of time to do so. Teams don't draft on exact percentages, so it's a useless argument. For example, the team was drafting well under the percentage of linebackers. The reason: the linebackers were fine and the team preferred bringing in veterans to do the job. Now that linebacker is a position of need and quality veterans are no longer as readily available as they used to be, the team's drafting linebackers as if they're having a sale.
 
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So if it's all about DBs, how does he explain NE winning the Super Bowl with Randall Gay, Hank Poteat and Earthwind Moreland getting significant playing time?

Yeah, sure, the whole future of the franchise rests on Devin McCourty. Oh brother.

CHFF used to be a pretty good read but has increasingly become a smug, irritating know-it-all who'd rather stir the pot than discuss something meaningful. Welcome to the mainstream media ...
 
Can't lie, that drafting after Samuel is putrid

Out of 04, 05, 04, 07, 08, 09, 6 years the Patriots have draft one pro bowler, and lets be honest Merriweather was no first ballot pro bowler. They have Potential at best in Butler, Chung, Wilhite, Mcourty. But I think the article does miss one point.

In a 3-4, LB is critical is it not? The back 4 of our 3-4 was so neglected until 08 thats why we've been watching JAGS like Woods, Alexander, Beisel, Brown, etc. play for us. BB just wanted his veterans, it's obvious this was his stance until he suddenly grew a ******' brain and started getting younger and faster at LB until 08.

That's the one thing I just can't get over. This man coached Lawrence Taylor, Bruschi, Mcginest, Vrabel, Seau, Colvin, etc. and he didn't think it was worth drafting players to replace them? Insane. Every coach has had their bad drafts, BB had really one bad, absolutely not gained, wasted draft and that was in 06. Well hey we got Maroney but that's not saying much.

I think besides that every other draft BB has found at least a couple of guys to contribute. But he still ignored LB, and I'll never understand it.
 
Does any one disagree with what he says about these draft picks?

2004
Safety Guss Scott (third round) – Started his only two NFL games with the Patriots in 2005; was out of football by 2006.

Safety Dexter Reid (fourth round) – Started two games with the Patriots in 2004 before two uneventful years with the Colts in 2005 and 2006.

Cornerback Christian Morton (seventh round) – Never played in a Patriots uniform; spent four years as a backup with the Falcons, Redskins and Panthers.

2005
Cornerback Ellis Hobbs (third round) – Spent four largely uneventful years (8 INTs) with the Patriots. However, he did start 49 games and was a spectacular kick returner. Best remembered for being toasted by Plaxico Burress for the game-winning score in Super Bowl XLII and was traded to Philly for two fifth-round picks in 2009.

Safety James Sanders (fourth round) – A serviceable safety, who was been a fulltime starter for two years (2007, 2008) with five picks in his five NFL seasons.

2006
Cornerback Willie Andrews (seventh round) – In a very bad draft that went almost exclusively to offense, the Patriots waited until their last pick to grab a player in the defensive backfield; Andrews spent two years as a back-up and special teamer and was busted for marijuana possession with intent to distribute two days after New England's loss in Super Bowl XLII. He was busted six months later on firearms charges. He's now out of football.

2007
Safety Brandon Meriweather (first round) – So far, the promising No. 1 pick has been largely a disappointment, though he did appear to come into his own in 2009, starting all 16 games for the first time, with 5 picks and a TD. But he's yet to live up to the expectations of a No. 1.

Cornerback Mike Richardson (sixth round) – Spent most of his two years with the Patriots on the taxi squad. He was signed by the Chiefs last year, after the Patriots released him. Started one game last year with Kansas City.

2008
Cornerback Terrence Wheatley (second round) – Wheatley saw some playing time as a rookie, but was injured halfway through the season. To say he's had no impact (three tackles in two years) would be an understatement.

Cornerback Jonathan Wilhite (fourth round) – He started the last four games of 2008 and eight games in 2009; with there picks in his limited playing time.

2009
Safety Patrick Chung (second round) – A college teammate of safety Jairus Byrd, who led the NFL last year with nine picks, Chung started one game and recorded a single INT in New England's 59-0 destruction of the Titans.

Cornerback Darius Butler (second round) – Developed fairly well during his rookie season, ending the year with five starts and 3 picks, including a 91-yard TD return in the season finale against Houston. Byrd, a safety, was taken with the very next pick in the draft.

And that doesn't even get into the DB disasters in free agency, at least since the Rodney Harrison signing – back in that same 2003 offseason that produced Asante Samuel.
A few things jump out at me. First, he's labeling 6th and 7th round picks that didn't last as busts. How many 6th and 7th round picks have long NFL careers, or last long on a defending league champion? Interesting that he talks as much about them as the early picks, and they make up 25% of the list.

Second is some of the judgements he comes up with. I didn't realize Meriweather was a disappointment, Hobbs was nothing more than a kick returner, or more should be expected out of a 4th round pick than what Sanders has provided. He points out Meriweather had five picks, as if that's a bad thing. He doesn't mention that was 4th in the league for a safety, but does mention league-leader Byrd, implying every draft pick should do what Byrd did.

Third is the 20-20 hindsight of some other draft pick (Byrd) having a better year. Guess what, I can do that with all 32 teams and "prove" that every one of them is "bad" at drafting.

Fourth is his jumping to conclusions about the '08 and '09 draft; the general consensus is that you have to wait three full seasons to evaluate a draft, but CHFF has already come to the conclusion that the draft that took place 13 months ago was not very good.

Lastly, note his comments about 2003. He concedes 2003 was good, but decides to start his analysis the following season. Wonder why that is? Maybe it's because he's looking for stats to back a theory, rather than searching through stats impartially to reach a conclusion. In other words the author already had his mind made up before he did his research and then found information to back his claim. That's poor research and poor analysis.


CHFF started out as a decidedly pro-Patriots site, finding ways to put the Patriots in general and Tom Brady specifically in a good light. The last couple of years they have been the opposite, especially in regards to Belichick. Don't let the name of the site fool you. They take a side then find stats to support it rather than doing research and then reaching a conclusion.

For example, if I wanted to make an anti-Raiders column, I could focus on the fact that they have seven straight seasons with 11 or more losses. If I wanted to make a pro-Raiders column I could point out that they have more wins than any other team that was ever in the AFL, 8th best win-loss percentage in the history of the NFL, and are in the top five in playoff appearances in the last fifty years.

I'm very skeptical of anything CHFF has to say, regardless of what they say.
 
So if it's all about DBs, how does he explain NE winning the Super Bowl with Randall Gay, Hank Poteat and Earthwind Moreland getting significant playing time?

Yeah, sure, the whole future of the franchise rests on Devin McCourty. Oh brother.

CHFF used to be a pretty good read but has increasingly become a smug, irritating know-it-all who'd rather stir the pot than discuss something meaningful. Welcome to the mainstream media ...

Earthwind Moreland didn't get significant playing time. In fact, he was cut prior to the SB that year.
 
Can't lie, that drafting after Samuel is putrid

Out of 04, 05, 04, 07, 08, 09, 6 years the Patriots have draft one pro bowler, and lets be honest Merriweather was no first ballot pro bowler. They have Potential at best in Butler, Chung, Wilhite, Mcourty. But I think the article does miss one point.

Who cares about PRO BOWLS. Pro Bowls mean NOTHING. They are a popularity contest for the most part. And that's been proven time and again.

Also, you lose credibility by mentioning the 09 draft. Those kids were ROOKIES last year. People EXPECTING rookies to automatically be in the Top 200 players in the league have unreasonable expectations.

From 04-08 (5 years), the Pats drafted 1 DB in the 1st round (Starter), 1 in the 2nd round (been injured), Two in the 3rd round (One Starter/One Bust), 3 fourth round picks (Bust/Starter/potential starter-nickle), one sixth and 2 7th rounders. So, of the 10 picks, 3 have been starters. One has shown potential as a starter, though he's only going into his 3rd year (Wilhite). Wheatley has been injured and then couldn't surpass Springs last year. And then you had 3 late round picks. One of who was a great special teamer for 2 years before he got in trouble with the law. Hardly damning evidence.


In a 3-4, LB is critical is it not? The back 4 of our 3-4 was so neglected until 08 thats why we've been watching JAGS like Woods, Alexander, Beisel, Brown, etc. play for us. BB just wanted his veterans, it's obvious this was his stance until he suddenly grew a ******' brain and started getting younger and faster at LB until 08.

*ROFLMAO*

That's the one thing I just can't get over. This man coached Lawrence Taylor, Bruschi, Mcginest, Vrabel, Seau, Colvin, etc. and he didn't think it was worth drafting players to replace them? Insane. Every coach has had their bad drafts, BB had really one bad, absolutely not gained, wasted draft and that was in 06. Well hey we got Maroney but that's not saying much.

More proof that you just don't know what you are talking about. BTW, the 06 draft produced more than just Maroney. It produced Gostkowski, LeKevin Smith, David Thomas, and Willie Andrews. The only real miss was Chad Jackson. Yes, Jeremy Mincey was cut, but that was because he was under the misguided assumption that he'd be given a year to learn the defense. Even O'Callaghan stepped up in his rookie season until concussions put him out.

I think besides that every other draft BB has found at least a couple of guys to contribute. But he still ignored LB, and I'll never understand it.

He didn't IGNORE LBer. It's pure ignorance on your part to say so. BB has gone on record as saying that they have high standards for LBer and won't take one early if they feel the player doesn't meet their criteria. Also, saying that they "IGNORED" LBer totally ignores the fact that they tried everything they could to trade up for Stewart Bradley in 07 only to be denied and have the Eagles select him.
 
Plain and simple. If Bill were that great at drafting players the Pats wouldn't have gotten blown out at home in the first round of the playoffs last year.
 
His point about the analogy was about being PC. Why the hell should the use of Hitler be out of bounds in a world of free speech? Also, CHFF has gone downhill over the course of recent years, so you should probably lower your expectations regarding that site.

No. His point about Hitler wasn't about it being PC. And Hitler is OOBs because the man was a psychopath whose decisions let to millions upon millions of people being murdered and killed. Many of them Jews. None of BB's decisions could be compared to that.

As to your comment regarding "Free Speech" you seem to forget the other edge of the Free Speech Sword. That People are entitled to their opinions on YOU exercising that Freedom of Speech. It works BOTH ways. It would help to remember that.

Lastly, you can point to drafting %, but it's really a waste of time to do so. Teams don't draft on exact percentages, so it's a useless argument. For example, the team was drafting well under the percentage of linebackers. The reason: the linebackers were fine and the team preferred bringing in veterans to do the job. Now that linebacker is a position of need and quality veterans are no longer as readily available as they used to be, the team's drafting linebackers as if they're having a sale.

Seriously??? You really should learn to read the articles and not just put your ideas into them. One of the basis of the ENTIRE ARTICLE was that BB had to increase the number of picks spent on DBs. And it's patently false. He hasn't had to do that. And I proved that by going back to 2000 and showing that BB averages about 2 a year.
 
Plain and simple. If Bill were that great at drafting players the Pats wouldn't have gotten blown out at home in the first round of the playoffs last year.

This has got to be the most ******ed post I have seen around here in a LONG time.
 
Plain and simple. If Bill were that great at drafting players the Pats wouldn't have gotten blown out at home in the first round of the playoffs last year.

This is utter BS and clearly said by someone who has NEVER played the game. There is a REASON they play the games and there is a reason for the saying "On any given Sunday, any team can beat any other team".

BTW, one of the biggest reasons they lost had NOTHING to do with the secondary. It had to do with how poorly Tom Brady played.

Thank you for your umm... contribution.
 
Who cares about PRO BOWLS. Pro Bowls mean NOTHING. They are a popularity contest for the most part. And that's been proven time and again.

Awesome rant you got going there. Tell me, can you tell me all the playmakers we've added to the secondary?

Also, you lose credibility by mentioning the 09 draft. Those kids were ROOKIES last year. People EXPECTING rookies to automatically be in the Top 200 players in the league have unreasonable expectations.

Hey moron, that's why I said the jury is still out on them no?

From 04-08 (5 years), the Pats drafted 1 DB in the 1st round (Starter), 1 in the 2nd round (been injured), Two in the 3rd round (One Starter/One Bust), 3 fourth round picks (Bust/Starter/potential starter-nickle), one sixth and 2 7th rounders. So, of the 10 picks, 3 have been starters. One has shown potential as a starter, though he's only going into his 3rd year (Wilhite). Wheatley has been injured and then couldn't surpass Springs last year. And then you had 3 late round picks. One of who was a great special teamer for 2 years before he got in trouble with the law. Hardly damning evidence.

Only you would argue for Wheatley or Wilhite. Fact is, none have shown the ability so far of being anything more than a constant IR name and an average corner. Willie Andrews the ST great, well I'm glad he knows how to draft DBs that can play STs.




*ROFLMAO*
Nothing huh?



More proof that you just don't know what you are talking about. BTW, the 06 draft produced more than just Maroney. It produced Gostkowski, LeKevin Smith, David Thomas, and Willie Andrews. The only real miss was Chad Jackson. Yes, Jeremy Mincey was cut, but that was because he was under the misguided assumption that he'd be given a year to learn the defense. Even O'Callaghan stepped up in his rookie season until concussions put him out

I love all the excuses you make. They got cut because they sucked, and that's why they still aren't worth a damn anywhere in this league. David Thomas was a nice pick who didn't work out for us. Smith? What did he ever do in his career? Willie Andrews, your binky. Like I said that's awesome that you like DBs that can't start to save their lives but their good on STs.

He didn't IGNORE LBer. It's pure ignorance on your part to say so. BB has gone on record as saying that they have high standards for LBer and won't take one early if they feel the player doesn't meet their criteria. Also, saying that they "IGNORED" LBer totally ignores the fact that they tried everything they could to trade up for Stewart Bradley in 07 only to be denied and have the Eagles select him.

OK. So every year after 04 until 087 BB added strictly veterans. The most effective one was Rosevelt Colvin. Funny how in all those years he doesn't find any prospects possibly worth of wearing a Patriots uniform for LB, yet in 08 and 09 he drafts 3 LBs in the first 2 rounds. Maybe after watching scrub QBs have 5 seconds to throw all day, the run defense weakening he realized it was time to get younger and faster?

I wouldn't want to have anyone else at the helm of this team but he has ****ed up, just like everyone else who has ever been a HC. No one is perfect and BB's good far outweigh's the bad. I just find it comical in my few years here all I've seen you do is kiss up for every bad move he's ever made and it's just funny to see you still beating the same "everything is fine" drum.
 
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