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CHFF: Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by SVN, Apr 29, 2010.

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  1. SVN

    SVN Rookie

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  2. PatsFan37

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    Re: CHFF:Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft

    Whatever the merits of the article, the author flogged that warhorse of a metaphor into dogfood.

    Edit: ok, now I read the article for content. Meriweather is a disappointment????? What an idiot.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2010
  3. patfanken

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    Re: CHFF:Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft

    The thing that surprise me while reading this was the author's neglect in recognizing the drastic changes in the rules/interpretation. This completely changed the passing game to the point where 4000 yds for a QB is now not a once in a decade event, its a SOP for good QBs. Its what Tom Brady does in a mediocre year.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2010
  4. memento

    memento Rookie

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    Re: CHFF:Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft

    To summarize the article, our defense only does well with superior pass protection. There is some credence to the theory, like the near all coverage schemes in the '01 superbowl and the chart the guy uses. We also play a passive bend-but-dont-break defense a lot.

    But truth is, we don't put a lot of emphasis on cornerbacks. Short, good coverage guys with a quick twitch that we pick up late/after the draft and other team's leftovers. Randall Gay, Leigh Bodden, Ellis Hobbs...

    And say what you want about Hobbs, but he was excellent at covering without getting a PI. Those are the guys Belichick looks for. The last couple years he's picked them out of the first two rounds, probably indicative of how much more difficult it is for DB's in today's league.
  5. bucky

    bucky Rookie

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    Hey, I have a good idea. Let's post every idiotic, smugly written article by every Tom, Dick, Harry, and any other moron who happens to figure out how to post something on the internet. And then let's waste all our time discussing it and getting bent out of shape.
  6. eom

    eom Rookie

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    hahaha.....
  7. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Or we could realize that CHFF is a legitimate website and take a serious look at what the writer is claiming, to determine whether or not he has any valid points.
  8. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    you can revisit Spygate II...here's the thread...

    http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...isele-filmed-getting-busy-nyc-restaurant.html
  9. Fencer

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    Bad article on an often-good site.

    Since they don't have individual bylines on the articles, it's hard to predict how good any one is going to be.

    That's the worst article on that site I happen to have ever read, because even the parts that are right are unoriginal, most of the conclusions are wildly unsupported, and some comments are worse than than that.

    Plus the metaphor is really offensive.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2010
  10. eom

    eom Rookie

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    you don't like a football coach being compared to hitler?

    hey --- I just happen to be listening to the inimitable gil brandt on sirius nfl radio (which is most excellent), and he mentioned that 36(?) corners were drafted this year, which was the 2nd most ever.

    fwiw
  11. eom

    eom Rookie

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    now ross tucker (former guard) is taking sf to the woodshed for drafting iupati instead of taking a top corner --- like jackson, wilson, or mccourty.
  12. IndianPat

    IndianPat Rookie

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    Decent article. Hard to deny the fact Patriots have not had two GOOD defensive backs for many years now. And that they have drafted an inordinate number of DB's over the years. And disastrous free agent signings like Duane Starks. Does any one remember the last minute signing of Deltha O'Neal in 2008 (when expectation was to repeat the mind blowing 2007 season) Brady going down took care of that expectation. As an aside, does anyone remember the dismemberment of Deltha O'Neal by Brady in a game against Denver (maybe, 2006 or 2005)?

    Ofcourse, lack of a credible pass rush exposes a mediocre secondary.

    But, I think positive changes are afoot. They now have a solid nucleus to build on. Bodden is solid. Butler, Springs, and this year's pick should lay the foundation for future. I am not so sure on Wilhite and Wheatley.

    Let's not forget that BB is taking over the coaching duties for the defense.
  13. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If you look at the numbers for 2006 & 2007, which were the Samuel/Hobbs years, the team did pretty damned well.
  14. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    given the scheme, its the front 7 that makes the secondary look good and look bad.......for instance, the seconday of 2000 was largely the same as 2001 (law, milloy, jones were already here when BB did)

    what made the pats in their best years was the LB's.....case closed

    only a fool would think otherwise....
  15. drew4008

    drew4008 Rookie

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    I have no idea what "umpteen-uples" means, can someone explain? I've heard of umpteen before, but uples?
  16. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    oh c'mon...you mean to say you've never heard of a cross between the Jamaican Ugli fruit and an apple?

    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
    .
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    ..

    (neither have I)
  17. eom

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    no, but I've heard of the fig ugli cross.
  18. Joker

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    that's no way to talk about the girls of Holy Cross
  19. RayClay

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    #75 Jersey
    Awful article. The author should be legally prohibited from ever using statistics again.
  20. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It is the everending rhetorical question of who or what is more responsible the DB's, Pass Rushers or BB???...

    Strengthening one will make everyone a little bit better, or so they say..
  21. SpiderFox53

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    Umpteen-uples down is a mix of

    Umpteen
    Quadruples
    double-down
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2010
  22. tanked_as_usual

    tanked_as_usual Banned

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    once again....the scheme lives and dies with its linebackers......unless the way the 3-4 works has changed
  23. kurtinelson

    kurtinelson Rookie

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    Its an interesting and fair article stat-wise. The Hitler references are unnecessary.
  24. dhamz

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    The point - that the Pats have spent a lot of draft picks on DBs without much to show for it - is hard to dispute. It was just a very poorly written article.
  25. Bostonian1962

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    I love my Patriots, but it's hard not to admit that BB, a defensive guru, sure has missed ALOT on drafting DBs over the last several years. Until looking at the list in this article, I didn't realize just how badly.

    Let's all hope the McCourty pick turns out differently.
  26. bagwell368

    bagwell368 Rookie

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    Assuming issues with the passing game is only due to the quality/play of DB's is... ahm... incomplete thinking.

    The much better single answer is - Colvin. If he had not been injured he would have brought more pressure then the Pats did get since his injury. Even more critical, they would not have signed AT to that massive contract - and that money could have gone to resign Samuel, and gotten solid upgrades over the Poteat's of the NFL universe.

    Of course when you consider the Colvin/AT issues AND the DB situation you get a more complete view. Then consider all the coaches that have been poached during these years..

    And of course drafting is an inexact science, just take a look at your draft boards for 2010. BB knows more about drafting than anyone here or on CHFF. The amazing thing is because Mel "Eddie Munster" Kiper says something about someone, people create expectations of what should happen, and then get upset when they don't get what they expect.
  27. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: CHFF:Belichick umpteen-uples down on DBs in the draft

    That's kinda like saying the offense only scores passing touchdowns with superior play design. Unfortunately the author is referencing and comparing some of the nastiest defenses of all time in that period for the Patriots against patchwork jobs and a rebuild. I'll be interested to see the tune in 2 seasons time.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2010
  28. Triumph

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    The article is spot on with the exception of Merriweather.

    NE couldnt hold a lead in 2007. Remember the Miami game where Brady had to come back in a score more points because Miami scored a few quick TDs?
  29. borg

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    In 2009, the better passing teams picked on one Patriot DB ....usually Wilhite, Springs also. Sure the QB pressure was anemic, but I'm betting Pees felt that it was more important to flood the secondary with CBs and Safeties than rushing 5 or 6 guys. Look at the Jets. Revis alone on the teams best WR allows the Jets so many options blitzing. The Pats didn't have that luxury....hopefully they will now.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2010
  30. MoLewisrocks

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    The author should attempt an analysis of the other 31 teams in the league to see if this phenomenon is widespread or if there is some other reason the rest of them failed to make it to four superbowls and win three in the same period in which Belichick was failing like Hitler...

    I think the fact that we lost Rodney for most of 2005 and again down the stretch in 2006, Tedy for most of 2005 and TJ for all of it, that after Branch shot his way out of town our #1WR in 2006 was the incomparable Reche Caldwell, that after somehow clawing our way to 18-0 in 2007 in spite of Bill's Hitler like incompetance, Neal again went down in the Superbowl and the rest of the OL spit the bit (apparentely taking their cue from none other than Asante Samuel who did the same on defense), that Brady was lost in the first quarter of 2008 and the defense was in full blown rebuild by 2009 had a lot more to do with our struggles to continue to win it all after 2004 than Bill's inability to draft the kind of superior DB's this knucklehead presumes would have mitigated all of that.
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