"Cheating" or being good at your job

[BoltsFan]

There is no NFL rule against doing that. There IS a rule that you can't do it by having a video camera on the sidelines. A team could do it with a camera in the coach's booth

Yea, sure but that's not enough. There's a reason why you want the cameraman on the sidelines.

 

[PatsSteve1]

Yea, sure but that's not enough. There's a reason why you want the cameraman on the sidelines.

They have camera's today that could do it from a satellite. It doesn'y have to be on the sidelines.

 

[SpiritOf76]

Yea, sure but that's not enough. There's a reason why you want the cameraman on the sidelines.

Of course, to game plan against self-effacing hollow opponents like LT, the d**che.

 

[emoney_33]

Yea, sure but that's not enough. There's a reason why you want the cameraman on the sidelines.

Since we know there was no live feed from the camera, you are really suggesting that at the 15 minute half-time break, someone ran that film out, watched the whole thing as well as timed it up correctly with the formation. Studied the play that unfolded and each defensive assignment, thereby understanding the play called. Put all this information together, either memorized it or wrote it down in good detail. All in the hopes that one of these calls would be made again in the 2nd half. And when a call was made, either that person who broke the film down, hooked it up with game tape etc had all 40 or so plays and calls memorized so that he recognized it and got it into the coaches and the players within the 20-40 second time frame he would have from when the signal was given to the snap of the ball. Or he ran through the 40 signal-play correlations he discovered and wrote down in time to get the play call to the offense?

Do you understand how simplistic you are trying to make such a complicated process? And alllll of this incredible memorization, real-time analysis, resources or whatever else in the HOPES that at least one or two calls would be repeated in the 2nd half? Send me some of whatever it is you are smoking PLEASE

 

[emoney_33]

They have camera's today that could do it from a satellite. It doesn'y have to be on the sidelines.

And in reality it's worse to do it from the sideline. Especially from the jets sideline. If steal signing was the goal you would want a view from higher above with less possibility of obstructions. But again logistics and/or facts mean nothing to patriots-bashers

 

[PatsSteve1]

And in reality it's worse to do it from the sideline. Especially from the jets sideline. If steal signing was the goal you would want a view from higher above with less possibility of obstructions. But again logistics and/or facts mean nothing to patriots-bashers

And considering the person doing the signaling is as close to the sideline as possible, the guy with the camera being behind him doesn't get much of a shot at the signals. But hey, musn't let facts get in the way of the
hysteria-

 

[BoltsFan]

Since we know there was no live feed from the camera, you are really suggesting that at the 15 minute half-time break, someone ran that film out, watched the whole thing as well as timed it up correctly with the formation. Studied the play that unfolded and each defensive assignment, thereby understanding the play called. Put all this information together, either memorized it or wrote it down in good detail. All in the hopes that one of these calls would be made again in the 2nd half. And when a call was made, either that person who broke the film down, hooked it up with game tape etc had all 40 or so plays and calls memorized so that he recognized it and got it into the coaches and the players within the 20-40 second time frame he would have from when the signal was given to the snap of the ball. Or he ran through the 40 signal-play correlations he discovered and wrote down in time to get the play call to the offense?

Do you understand how simplistic you are trying to make such a complicated process? And alllll of this incredible memorization, real-time analysis, resources or whatever else in the HOPES that at least one or two calls would be repeated in the 2nd half? Send me some of whatever it is you are smoking PLEASE

You know what? Why don't you think about this? Why were the pats engaged in the activity?

 

[PatsSteve1]

You know what? Why don't you think about this? Why were the pats engaged in the activity?

I don't know why they had a camera on the sidelines when they could have done the same thing, legally by NFL rules, from the coach's booth.

 

[BoltsFan]

I don't know why they had a camera on the sidelines when they could have done the same thing, legally by NFL rules, from the coach's booth.

Well? That's pretty stupid isn't it?

 

[emoney_33]

You know what? Why don't you think about this? Why were the pats engaged in the activity?

Take your time and read my posts, i've explained numerous times why they engaged in the activity. This post of yours is simply a way out of responding to my post showing how extremely difficult if not impossible the logistics of what you assumed was going on.

The taping was being done to be studied and analyzed at a later date for their next meeting. In their next meeting obviously their defensive signals would be different so it wouldn't be used to study defensive signals. It would however be used to study human tendencies and subtle tells. Kind of like poker players try to do, read their opponents body language to make an educated guess on what cards they hold. The tape would be studied in great detail (over the course of HOURS or days, not minutes) to be that much more prepared for the next game. If Mangini or any of the jets coaches were giving away any tells as to what type of play they called, an educated guess could be made in the next meeting. Maybe one of the coaches plays with his finger when anticipating a blitz. Maybe one of them gives off a sign of worry when they call a gutsy play etc... Who knows. Signals however is absolutely not the case with the video camera.

 

[BoltsFan]

Take your time and read my posts, i've explained numerous times why they engaged in the activity. This post of yours is simply a way out of responding to my post showing how extremely difficult if not impossible the logistics of what you assumed was going on.

The taping was being done to be studied and analyzed at a later date for their next meeting. In their next meeting obviously their defensive signals would be different so it wouldn't be used to study defensive signals. It would however be used to study human tendencies and subtle tells. Kind of like poker players try to do, read their opponents body language to make an educated guess on what cards they hold. The tape would be studied in great detail (over the course of HOURS or days, not minutes) to be that much more prepared for the next game. If Mangini or any of the jets coaches were giving away any tells as to what type of play they called, an educated guess could be made in the next meeting. Maybe one of the coaches plays with his finger when anticipating a blitz. Maybe one of them gives off a sign of worry when they call a gutsy play etc... Who knows. Signals however is absolutely not the case with the video camera.

Ok? Think what you want. Bottom line is this. It violated rules. BB knew the rules. There was no misinterpretation. There IS a reason why it's not allowed.

It is what it is?

 

[BoltsFan]

Take your time and read my posts, i've explained numerous times why they engaged in the activity. This post of yours is simply a way out of responding to my post showing how extremely difficult if not impossible the logistics of what you assumed was going on.

The taping was being done to be studied and analyzed at a later date for their next meeting. In their next meeting obviously their defensive signals would be different so it wouldn't be used to study defensive signals. It would however be used to study human tendencies and subtle tells. Kind of like poker players try to do, read their opponents body language to make an educated guess on what cards they hold. The tape would be studied in great detail (over the course of HOURS or days, not minutes) to be that much more prepared for the next game. If Mangini or any of the jets coaches were giving away any tells as to what type of play they called, an educated guess could be made in the next meeting. Maybe one of the coaches plays with his finger when anticipating a blitz. Maybe one of them gives off a sign of worry when they call a gutsy play etc... Who knows. Signals however is absolutely not the case with the video camera.

One more thing. Dude!? That's pure BS. I'm sure the pats nation is drinking your kool aid I'm not.

What? You were studying Detroit and Green Bay for that reason? Stop it. Don't be silly. Those are 2 NFC opponents that you KNEW you wouldn't see in the SB last year. And you won't see them again for another FOUR years.

Just keep drinking your kool aid.

 

[SpiritOf76]

Ok? Think what you want. Bottom line is this. It violated rules. BB knew the rules. There was no misinterpretation. There IS a reason why it's not allowed.

It is what it is?

You are such a tool. Let us all know when you're done stroking yourself.

 

[emoney_33]

Since we know there was no live feed from the camera, you are really suggesting that at the 15 minute half-time break, someone ran that film out, watched the whole thing as well as timed it up correctly with the formation. Studied the play that unfolded and each defensive assignment, thereby understanding the play called. Put all this information together, either memorized it or wrote it down in good detail. All in the hopes that one of these calls would be made again in the 2nd half. And when a call was made, either that person who broke the film down, hooked it up with game tape etc had all 40 or so plays and calls memorized so that he recognized it and got it into the coaches and the players within the 20-40 second time frame he would have from when the signal was given to the snap of the ball. Or he ran through the 40 signal-play correlations he discovered and wrote down in time to get the play call to the offense?

Do you understand how simplistic you are trying to make such a complicated process? And alllll of this incredible memorization, real-time analysis, resources or whatever else in the HOPES that at least one or two calls would be repeated in the 2nd half? Send me some of whatever it is you are smoking PLEASE

Ok? Think what you want. Bottom line is this. It violated rules. BB knew the rules. There was no misinterpretation. There IS a reason why it's not allowed.

It is what it is?

Thought I'd quote myself again for ya since you conveniently missed it. It's not "think what I want" type of thing. It's understanding the logistics and coming to a more rational and logical conclusion.

Bottom line it did violate the rules according to the commish's interpretation (which really is all that matters). Again you use the word MISinterpretation, when actually it's simply two DIFFERENT interpretations. Only one of those interpretations matter however, and BB and the pats have paid the price.

It is logical to assume that the commish made his interpretation clear with the memo last Thursday. It is also logical however to believe that BB still thought he had an argument with his interpretation due to the wording in the rule. Also BB knowing what he was using the tape for, knowing the league etc, it is logical to assume that he didn't think it was a big deal if in fact his argument lost based on the commish's interpretation.

However the masses piled on and Goodell was more or less forced to come down hard.

I've already agreed BB broke a rule, but it's more along the lines of a questionable PI call rather than a blatant tackle of a player 5 seconds before the ball arrives.

 

[PatsSteve1]

One more thing. Dude!? That's pure BS. I'm sure the pats nation is drinking your kool aid I'm not.

What? You were studying Detroit and Green Bay for that reason? Stop it. Don't be silly. Those are 2 NFC opponents that you KNEW you wouldn't see in the SB last year. And you won't see them again for another FOUR years.

Just keep drinking your kool aid.

Whatever they were taping for whatever reason is not against NFL rules. Having the camera on the sidelines is against NFL rules. What part of that don't you understand?

 

[emoney_33]

One more thing. Dude!? That's pure BS. I'm sure the pats nation is drinking your kool aid I'm not.

What? You were studying Detroit and Green Bay for that reason? Stop it. Don't be silly. Those are 2 NFC opponents that you KNEW you wouldn't see in the SB last year. And you won't see them again for another FOUR years.

Just keep drinking your kool aid.

There is no proof of anything with Detroit and Green Bay. I also wouldn't be suprised if we taped every single coach we've played. BB is extremely dedicated and detail oriented. He is of the mind-frame "leave no stone unturned".

I am not saying BB doesn't want to or try to steal signals during games, as I believe 32 teams do that. I am simply pointing out that it is extremely unlikely using a no live-feed video camera (at a bad sign-stealing angle on the jets sideline) as your means of doing this.

 

[BoltsFan]

Thought I'd quote myself again for ya since you conveniently missed it. It's not "think what I want" type of thing. It's more about rationalizing a palatable explanation for the pats nation.

Bottom line it did violate the rules according to the commish's interpretation (which really is all that matters). Again you use the word MISinterpretation, when actually it's simply two DIFFERENT interpretations. Only one of those interpretations matter however, and BB and the pats have paid the price.

It is logical to assume that the commish made his interpretation clear with the memo last Thursday. It is also logical however to believe that BB still thought he had an argument with his interpretation due to the wording in the rule. Also BB knowing what he was using the tape for, knowing the league etc, it is logical to assume that he didn't think it was a big deal if in fact his argument lost based on the commish's interpretation.

However the masses piled on and Goodell was more or less forced to come down hard.

I've already agreed BB broke a rule, but it's more along the lines of a questionable PI call rather than a blatant tackle of a player 5 seconds before the ball arrives.

There, fixed it for ya.

 

[emoney_33]

Whatever they were taping for whatever reason is not against NFL rules. Having the camera on the sidelines is against NFL rules. What part of that don't you understand?

98% of non-pats fans choose not to understand this. The rule states you cannot have an employee using video equipment at any place that club staff has access to including the sideline. The rule was set like that so video technology is not used by coaches during games for any reason. A regular video recording of anything significant especially coaches is not real feasible to be used during the game. I am positive BB knew the spirit of the rule and more or less saw no reason to not tape since he knew how impossible it would be to use any of that tape during the game anyway, and any logical person would be able to realize that.

Of course the perfect storm followed which no one could have predicted

 

[SpiritOf76]

There, fixed it for ya.

It's the small victories, eh BoltsFan?

Wins...let's see you get one of those.

Keep hopin' and prayin'.

 

[BoltsFan]

Whatever they were taping for whatever reason is not against NFL rules. Having the camera on the sidelines is against NFL rules. What part of that don't you understand?

I think you're the one who doesn't understand.