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Borges is back.... and at it again! [merged]

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by slash83, May 13, 2007.

  1. slash83

    slash83 Rookie

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  2. Ahriman

    Ahriman Rookie

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    Borges on Moss: Divided they stand

    Divided they stand - Ron Borges

    I must say that this was an unexpectedly pleasant read. When Borges wants to really put his agenda aside and cover a team, he can be second to none. He goes that extra mile to really make a piece entertaining and informative.

    Both sides of the coin, regarding Moss and the expectations people place on him here, were presented fairly and there really weren't any jabs taken at the team.

    I'm sure he'll revert to form soon enough, though, this was a nice continuation of the respite we've all had from his negativity.
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  3. tedylb

    tedylb Rookie

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    Re: Borges on Moss: Divided they stand

    I hope RM pins this article to his locker as an incentive to prove the bastards wrong!
  4. Ahriman

    Ahriman Rookie

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    Re: Borges on Moss: Divided they stand

    Yeah, those were some strong quotes from Shell and Walsh.
  5. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Borges on Moss: Divided they stand

    Borges is tempered and intelligent right now, but not sure if this guy can really change and just want to get along.
  6. patsgo

    patsgo Rookie

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    Re: Borges on Moss: Divided they stand

    his two sources are just sour grapes walsh was pathetic as a offensive coordinator, shell didnt do much as a coach both got fired, im sure moss could say things about teir coaches, what wasnt said if he doesnt get with our program hell be gone ,if he quits on plays hell be gone,its still a great gamble and im sure it will work out
  7. Sundayjack

    Sundayjack Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Actually, I think it's a pretty well balance and well researched article. You have to give the guy credit: He comes back from a suspension for plagiarism with an exhaustively sourced piece.

    Interesting stuff from Art Shell. Several weeks and no one thought to call him until now?
  8. PushnPencils

    PushnPencils Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Anyone with any bit of intelligence and that's followed this game for any reasonable length of time will read this article as well as take/absorb what's been said the last month and come to the following conclusions:

    #1 THERE IS NO WAY ON THIS EARTH Randy Moss could have possibly eroded or diminished his skills at AGE 30. IT JUST DOESN'T happen that way and I'm sick of hearing it. It's patronizing and most importantly it's wishful thinking by those who don't like Moss and an alibi for those whose teams failed overall and they were not able to get him to perform.

    #2 On that same line, THERE IS NO WAY a healthy physical specimen at age 30 has lost a step. WR's are not running backs. Their bodies just don't take anything close to the physical pounding other positions take. Truth be told, Moss has had a year and a half off. YOU don't lose steps at age 30. It's pure stupidity. The only way a man at that age loses his legs that completely as an idiot like Art Schell would make you try to believe is if he has either had multiple severe knee injuries or been diagnosed with MS or some other neuro-muscular disease.

    You can source an quote Art Schell all you want. I will tell you that in Schell you'll be hard pressed to find a larger failure as a coach and player manager, and only a guy like Borges would think that Schell was a worthwhile counterpoint in his article.


    You want proof. Here are some tidbits and you can double check them and more importantly find some other examples that will back up my argument:

    Troy Brown had his FINEST year as a Pro at age 30.

    Jerry Rice had his finest year as a pro at age 30.

    Shannon Sharpe, playing in a much more physically toll-taking receiving position, recorded over 360 receptions and 5000 yards from age 30 until the end of hs career at age 35 including only playing in 2 games at age 31-32 due to an injury.


    My worries about Moss are those of character ALONE. But to question his professional and physical ability at age 30 is a ******* joke.
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  9. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    he's backkkkkkkkkk and just as stupid...and just as WRONG
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  10. Sean Pa Patriot

    Sean Pa Patriot Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Article was fair at best..
  11. PushnPencils

    PushnPencils Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Here.

    I'll add some more:

    Stanley Morgan had his best year as a pro at age 30.

    Irving Fryar had his most productive years as a receiver WELL after the age of 30.

    Below are Steve Largent's stats from age 30 to 32:

    | 1984 sea | 16 | 2 10 5.0 0 | 74 1164 15.7 12 |
    | 1985 sea | 16 | 0 0 0.0 0 | 79 1287 16.3 6 |
    | 1986 sea | 16 | 0 0 0.0 0 | 70 1070 15.3 9

    That 79 catch total at age 31 was a career best.

    :singing:
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  12. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!


    All of which proves he can't be the actual author! ;)
  13. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Nothing wrong with that article, IMO. No digs on the team for taking him, no "so much for character," etc.

    But the part that really struck me as I read was this:

    "Moss has not played 16 games in a season since 2003, and his production has slid noticeably.

    It began during his final season in Minnesota when that franchise was in turmoil. He caught only 49 passes for 767 yards..."


    Ah, so that's what a lousy Moss season looks like! Well if he can put up those lousy numbers for the Patriots, while distracting defenses and opening up the middle of the field, for a 4th-round pick and modest money...great deal.
  14. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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  15. sebman2112

    sebman2112 Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    Yup, and I'll take a dissapointing 60 catch 1,005 yards, and 8 TD season anyday. Borges did try to make it sound like he hasn't done anything since 2003, then had to admit he still had 13 TD's his last year in Minn, and Borges really tried to gloss over the numbers Moss put up his first year in Oakland.

    I also want to point out that Art Shell and Tom Walsh come off as bitter, and I'm sure they both think that team being so horrible had nothing to do with them.
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  16. Mike the Brit

    Mike the Brit Minuteman Target PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    I thought it was an excellent article. Whatever next? "Catholicism not for me says Pope"? "Bears stand in line for indoor washroom facilities"?

    It's funny to think that no reporter from Seattle would ever get that kind of access to so many of Branch's ex-coaches (of course, the Patriots haven't just cleared them all out after finishing with the worst record in football!)

    To Borges credit, he got mixed messages and put both sides of the story. What's more, you can't dismiss the possibility that Randy Moss's physical talents are in decline just by pointing to other receivers who flourished at his age. It's possible that he has long term degenerative injuries and he's certainly a very different style of receiver from Rice, Largent, etc.

    I'm still very excited to see Moss join the Patriots (see sig.) but this article contains the kind of skepticism that also needs a hearing.

    It showed Borges doing what he does best -- being a beat reporter for the Raiders.
  17. zoostation

    zoostation Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    No one in the media that is. I'm sure Belichick contacted him before pulling the trigger on this deal.

    Kerry Collins had some possitive input and made some good observations. His point about Randy opening up the middle of the field for Brady is huge. I'm going to listen to him over a coaching staff that's pissed after being run out of town for only winning two games..
    Last edited: May 13, 2007
  18. Nordberg

    Nordberg Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    I'm kind of sick and tired of people making a blanket statement, that Randy hasn't done anything his last three years. The numbers he put up in Oakland in his first year with at least an NFL QB.....were pretty good. After his first four games he was putting up incredible numbers. Then he gets hurt....the team continues to struggle.

    I give him a complete pass for last year.....Oakland had the worst offense I have ever seen. Put yourself in a wide receivers body for a minute. Every time you run a pattern....you look back for the ball, and your QB is picking dirt from his helmet. I would be frustrated as well.

    Some of the quotes by his coaches in Oakland are disturbing if they are true. But remember....he tries to pull that crap just once, and he is gonzo.
  19. BradfordPatsFan

    BradfordPatsFan Rookie

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

    I agree, it started out pretty balanced. Then it turned into, "This is why Randy could suck" and he brought it back around to "but wait a minute, there is also just as good a chance he won't." Typically he would have stopped with why it will not work out.

    I think the opening of his piece did a good job of outlining the tenor of the entire column. It balanced the questions that many have had.

    For Borges this is as close to a fair, unbiased report as we can expect.
  20. PatsMyBoyz!

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    Re: Borges is back.... and at it again!

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