Ben-Jarvis Green-Ellis

[Patspsycho]

The next time Belichick gives a really revealing answer in a press conference, it will be his first. Belichick doesn't give crap in a press conference. It is only revealing to you because you want it to be revealing.

So when BJGE runs well, it is because he is good. When BJGE doesn't run well, it is the offensive line or the gameplan? Really?!? I know Belichick goes into games say "If we can get 20-30 yards on the ground, we will win this game". It is also ironic that the o-line seems to only play bad when BJGE isn't running well and not when Brady is passing or Woodhead is running the ball.

Give it up. BJGE is your binkie any you refuse to accept the fact that he is the picture of inconsistency. It is because he is a limited runner. When he has great conditions, he runs well. If the holes aren't there, he cannot make his own opportunities like good backs do.

So you are essentially saying BB is full of ****. That's fine, that's something you can take up with him.

Of course BJGE is my binky. Why wouldn't he be? He is an UDFA that rose through the ranks, through hard work, sweat, and doing his job. He works hard, doesn't complain, doesn't talk to the press, and when he gets a touchdown, doesn't draw attention to himself.

If that's not a prototypical blue-collar JAG Patriot (the kind that helped win us 3 superbowls), I don't know what is.

All you've done is bash him.

 

[Kasmir]

All I see is a list with no explanation of why they are ordered the way they are.

Indeed. To operationalize your observation: I wonder how many of those backs anyone would trade a 1st round pick for? BJGE has outperformed all of them this year (according to FO). The only ones on that list that I'd consider trading BJGE for straight up based on this year's performance are Bradshaw, Turner and Rice...

 

[tombonneau]

All I care about BJGE is that he is good enough to win the 2010 Super Bowl with.

Very reminiscent of Antoine: Not sexy but he has teeth.

 

[BradyFTW!]

All I care about BJGE is that he is good enough to win the 2010 Super Bowl with.

Very reminiscent of Antoine: Not sexy but he has teeth.

I sorta agree, sorta disagree. He's serviceable enough as long as the opposing defense isn't keying in on him. If Brady and the receivers are doing damage, the Pats can basically use the play action pass to set up the run, it seems like. Not exactly how it traditionally goes, but today's NFL is clearly pass-first, so you're right that that might very well be good enough. They certainly run the ball better than last year's Colts did, and they almost won the SB.

 

[SpiderFox53]

All I see is a list with no explanation of why they are ordered the way they are.

I'm fairly certain they are ordered the way they are because that was the order he typed them. No other meaning involved.

 

[tombonneau]

I sorta agree, sorta disagree. He's serviceable enough as long as the opposing defense isn't keying in on him. If Brady and the receivers are doing damage, the Pats can basically use the play action pass to set up the run, it seems like. Not exactly how it traditionally goes, but today's NFL is clearly pass-first, so you're right that that might very well be good enough. They certainly run the ball better than last year's Colts did, and they almost won the SB.

I see your point. But there are few feature backs in the NFL that could excel if a defense is keying on them. If you have one, great, but only about five or six teams do.

That said, personally, I'm neutral on BJGE. Obviously he can be improved upon, but he's also not the scrub some are making him out to be.

Funny you bring up the Colts, as I'd argue the Saints won the SB last year with a similar 2-back tandem of Thomas-Bush. Granted, they are both better than their BJGE-Woodhead counterparts, but not by much.

 

[spacecrime]

I only compared him to Bishop because like Bishop his legend far exceeded his production

What is his production, do you know? I mean, his ypc average compared to other RBs in the league?

 

[Steamer86]

Taylor is good, but so old and fragile

Ben-Jarvis is average, but seems durable and tough

Maroney stinks - soft and can't remember his blocking assignments (the ladies dig him though because he has great moves on dance floor).


Bottom line is Pats, Saints, Colts, Green Bay... are all succeeding with passing offenses that don't run very much...we've seen it before - the short passing game is our running game - When Taylor comes back and gives us 6-8 good carriers a game, BJGE gives us another 8-10 and mix in a couple Woody runs - with all our screens and short patterns, we are ALL set - Super Bowl!!!

 

[Marqui]

the short passing game is our running game

Um, no. Our running game is our running game.

 

[emoney_33]

(2) He's unexciting. BJGE lacks both elusiveness and break away speed. He's an extremely competent slasher, but he lacks home run skills. His lack of long runs to inflate his per carry average also conceals how very effective a runner he is on average.

Well this isn't exactly true. You take out his 2 longest runs and his YPC drops to 3.85. That's an 8% drop by taking away 1.8% of his carries. 10% of his yards came on 2 of his 112 carries.

Interestingly Benny's YPC in the 1st half is 3.3, compared to 4.8 in the 2nd half.

 

[Rob0729]

What is his production, do you know? I mean, his ypc average compared to other RBs in the league?

I do know what his production is. Do you? YPC can be misleading especially since BJGE carries so few times as a lead back. That is why a game like the Vikings where he got over 6 YPC can offset three games like Baltimore, San Deigo, and the Browns where he got 2.2 YPC or less.

As a lead back, his yards per game is among the lower parts of lead backs. The guy has the potential to be a very good change of pace or short yardage back, but he is a very mediocre lead back at best. You need a lead back who is going to consistently give you at least 50-60 yards or more if he is in a RB by committee and probably 80-90 yards or more if he is carrying the load. BJGE can't do either.

 

[Rob0729]

So you are essentially saying BB is full of ****. That's fine, that's something you can take up with him.

Of course BJGE is my binky. Why wouldn't he be? He is an UDFA that rose through the ranks, through hard work, sweat, and doing his job. He works hard, doesn't complain, doesn't talk to the press, and when he gets a touchdown, doesn't draw attention to himself.

If that's not a prototypical blue-collar JAG Patriot (the kind that helped win us 3 superbowls), I don't know what is.

All you've done is bash him.

I have always said what Belichick says in press conferences are BS. I can't wait until the Pats play the Bills again and he goes on how good of team they are and their record really doesn't indicate how good they really are. Of course he will be 100% truthful there. For years, everyone in the world has acknowledged that Belichick won't tell you how he really feels in a press conference. Why would that change now?

I bash him because although he has improved, he isn't very good at least as a lead running back. I will give him credit for being thrusted into a lead role that he isn't suited for and his struggles are partly because he is in over his head (much like Reche Caldwell was in 2006). But to say he is anything other than a mediocre lead RB or worse is just ignoring the facts.

When Taylor comes back, he will be able to move into a role he is more suited for (short yardage and change of pace) and may excel at it. Right now though, he is wildly inconsistent and just as or more likely to give you a sub 25 yard performance as over 80 yards. That is the definition of inconsistency especially for a RB.

 

[RobertWeathers]

This is silly. In 2006, LT had 5 games in which he averaged less than 4.0 ypc. Of those 5 games, 3 were vs TEN, BAL, PITT, SFO and DEN - BAL and PITT were excellent, SFO and DEN were decent and TEN was awful. You take out those games and hes averaging close to 6 ypc. Instead he averaged 5.2 for the year.

The ave, mean and median are important, but over a 16 game season or 200+ career carries you tend to get an idea of what kind of a runner you have.

 

[jack99]

I'm late to this thread, but I saw it on the net and wanted to chip in my two cents worth. I hadn't watched the first few games this year, but a game happened to be on TV at a friends house, and when they gave him the ball, I said, "I love this guy"! They looked at me like I had from two heads, and I realized he must have not been doing well to that point.

But I remember last year, when Maroney was awful and I was wondering why Belichick wasn't starting BJGE, since it was clear to me at least that he was far better. Obviously, Belichick, great coach that he is, had his reasons. Maybe he was showcasing him, and managed even to finagle a 4th rounder from a lousy Denver squad for him, once again demonstrating his genius.

Here is what I like about BJGE:

1) Hits the hole *fast* - those holes don't stay open long
2) Always gets the extra yard.
3) Can break tackles
4) Strong lower body strength and balance
5) Has reasonable speed
7) Does not get negative yardage
8) Doesn't fumble

Unless you have elite speed, that is how you have to do it as a running back - and you need for your O-line to open holes. If they don't make a hole, you'e not going anywhere. Now, if you are gifted with elite speed (BJGE isn't, very few are) then if the hole is not open, you can bounce to the outside, outrace and out-maneuver the defenders and rip off a big gain. But this is a dangerous strategy and can lose your team big yards. This is what Maroney tried to do but didn't have the instincts nor the talent. Basically, unless you're a Barry Sanders type runner, you're better off taking your lumps and slamming into the wall for a yard or two if there's no hole, and hope your O-line gives you a crease the next time.

To sum up - my take is BJGE has the potential to be a highly satisfactory solution along with Woody to the team's RB situation for years to come. He will (hopefully) always be underrated due to his lack of elite speed and therefore may come at a serious bargain. It's guys like him and Woodhead you win championships with.

 

[JMarr]

Haven't read the whole thread, but BJGE was a beast today. Scheme and blocking have contributed to his recent success, but today he made a lot of that yardage on his own and looked like a top-tier RB. Seems to be getting better and better as he gets more reps.

Kudos to those here who were saying for a long time that he was a better option than Maroney.

 

[italian pat patriot]

he made an incredible terrific run td

really a great great play

very well done Ben Jarvis !

today he was simply awesome

 

[A.C Vegas]

I loved watching him literally run over a db for the TD it was epic

 

[crowell33]

I loved watching him literally run over a db for the TD it was epic

BJGE has never fumbled once in his NFL career. Amazing stat.

 

[VectorPrime]

BJGE has never fumbled once in his NFL career. Amazing stat.

OR college career. And as far as anyone knows he never fumbled in high school.

 

[Batman]

I loved his second TD the second effort he put in to get over the line was awesome and his run before that for 3 yards should have been a loss but he never gives up or backs down while he can still turn his feet.