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Alfonzo Dennard Trial

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by MTM558, Feb 11, 2013.

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  1. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Pro Bowl Player

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    I'm trying to understand this statement......what's the process for cuffing someone? do you just walk up with a handcuff to un unrestrained seemingly uncooperative person and try to get the cuffs on him?

    I don't think a cop is supposed to try to cuff a person unless they're in a 'off-balance' position (on knees, lying on the ground or some other prone position)

    It sounds like to me that the office lacked the patience to go through the arrest/cuffing process properly. It sounds like between the failure to properly identify himself and to properly order the subject to a properly prone position, a situation was developed where a lack of understanding was not provided.

    The cop claimed he knew who Dennard was and understood what the implications of being aggressive with a drunk 22 year old might entail.

    I am not excusing Dennard at all.....I'm merely pointing out that there's enough discrepancy in the cops story that makes me question whether jail time serves a purpose as cops should not be excused from a reasonable process in a detail such as college bars at closing.

    be interesting to hear what the other witnesses who are not the other cop have to say. if they don't corroborate the cops, then I can't see how Dennard can be found guilty of the 3rd degree assault on a cop
     
  2. eom

    eom In the Starting Line-Up

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    btw, I wonder if one of us had been punched in a bar if it'd be handled like this, or would the cops just break it up and tell us to cool off.
     
  3. kennyb

    kennyb 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    If he didn't know it was a cop, doesn't that lessen his culpability?

    I wonder what the verdict and punishment will be.
     
  4. BrickPat

    BrickPat Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Should the cop have waited until Dennard was cooperative before handcuffing him? You'll just have to take my word for it that uncooperative people tend to remain uncooperative when you're attampting to place them under arrest.

    You watch too many TV shows. Yes, in an ideal setting the suspect would be cooperative and proned out but guess what? That doesn't always happen with the aforementioned uncooperative people who also may be bleepfaced. If that cop had slammed Dennard to the floor the same internet lawyers would be accusing him of brutality.

    Your assumptions and pontifications are breathtaking in their sheer ignorance. You are the poster child on why the police take a dim view of civilian review boards.

    LOL, you critique the cop for trying to cuff an drunk and uncooperative Dennard in one sentence and now this... Here is a newsflash, getting assaulted may by a consequence of the job but it's not part of the job. The fact that you can't tell the difference speaks volumes.

    Yes you are, please don't insult our collective intelligence.

    You are all over the place. The question of jail time or lack thereof is decided by a judge. The cop only needed PC to make the arrest which by all accounts he did- period. Your self professed expertise relative to "reasonable process" whatver the hell that means is duly noted.

    OTOH if the bartender and bouncers indicate otherwise Dennard is toast but it likely won't come to that.

    I hate to break it to you that this ain't the OJ trial. The assaulted cop is a pretty good witness in and of himself. Then again judging by the tone of your posts he was a clueless jack booted government thug who ambushed the unsuspecting Dennard for no apparent reason.
     
  5. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    And this entire post sums up why a whole lot of us take a dim view of police, on the aggregate. In my day-to-day life as a productive, law-abiding, tax-paying citizen, I am more concerned about being harassed by the police than by the general public. The attitude that your posts exude is precisely the problem.

    FWIW, if I was a part of the jury in question, I would place exactly as much weight to the statements of the police as I would to anyone else who was there. I'd trust statements made by the bartenders and bouncers a good deal more, on the face of it (without accounting for specific facts of the case). Officers on the scene have a built-in bias that makes their statements difficult to take at face value.
     
  6. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Pro Bowl Player

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    I don't know....maybe getting him down on the ground?

    actually, I got this from the boston police department procedure for handcuffing......


    you sound like you are from law enforcement.....there are lots of dim cops out there.



    I can tell the difference between a good cop and a bad one....you sound like the latter



    speak for yourself.......and no....you have no intelligence



    all accounts have not been communicate you moron.......you must be a cop since you think once the cops have accounted, that all accounts have been recieved......LOL at you giving yourself a bad name


    you're sinking in your own point....or lack of
     
  7. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Pro Bowl Player

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    just like I said earlier.....I trust cops about as much as I trust football players.

    the facts are not all out and all of it is specualtion from this end.......but BrickPat has already tied Dennards noose
     
  8. eom

    eom In the Starting Line-Up

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    :rofl::rofl::rofl:

    you should make that your sig.
     
  9. BradyFTW!

    BradyFTW! PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Because however the cop who was hit said it happened is clearly how it happened. No reasonable doubt there, his testimony is all that you need. He is, after all, a sworn officer of the law.

    Anyone who's ever dealt with a bored cop on a power trip knows exactly how much that means.
     
  10. eom

    eom In the Starting Line-Up

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    dennard's just lucky he didn't get his house torched
     
  11. Fencer

    Fencer Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

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    #12 Jersey

    When two people have an unpleasant confrontation, I don't necessarily think the one with a badge should be believed any more than the one without, and certainly not to the point of convicting beyond reasonable doubt.

    That leaves security cameras, witnesses and so on as the tie-breaker.
     
  12. BrickPat

    BrickPat Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Again you have the benefit of being an expert behind your keyboard but in a one on one confrontation a cop cannot always take a violently struggling suspectto the ground. You are dismissive ofthe cop's actions based on this point alone



    Psssst....I'll give you a hint that I went through the Boston Police Academy. Please cite the passage or lack thereof relative to a suspect who cannot be brought to the ground.



    Indeed. You are wasting your talent on this messagebaord. You are clearly a highly educated person and self professed expert in police operations and should apply forthwith to be a BPA Instructor.



    Of course you can tell the difference...you are an expert on the police. It's hard to argue with your internet assessment.

    Of course, that's why I became a cop.


    I can see that reading comprehension wasn't covered in genius school as I previously disclosed that I was a cop.

    Hard to refute that logic.
     
  13. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Pro Bowl Player

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    yep...... big mouth, small brain...... cop was my first guess

    I understand you defending your profession....prostitutes do that, too
     
  14. BrickPat

    BrickPat Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    That attitude was in direct response to a specific poster. I will happily discuss how the police do things but it's tough not to have an attitide with people who have never done a job telling you how to do yours. I don't know what you do for a livng but I hope you see my point in that you wouldn't appreciate it.

    I have no argument with that.

    Respectfully, isn't that default position hypocritical in that you have a bias against the police? If Dennard's friends testified for him would you similarly dismiss them for being biased toward their friend and against the police?

    It's frustrating that I once had a whole family ready to testify that their out of control, police assaulting relative did nothing prior to being arrested. If it had not been for their feuding neighbor with a camera I and my co workers would've been cast as heavy handed thugs. Needless to say that their statements and recollections did a 180 when that recording surfaced.

    I have no doubt there are a-holes who give the profession a bad name but it's sad that people automatically view the police as the problem. It's as if personal responsbility takes a backseat if you can blame it on someone else.
     
  15. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Pro Bowl Player

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    so this is in your job description? that 2nd cop should do what?

    just don't throw a snowball at a cop!!!!!

    BU Student Arrested During Snowball Fight « CBS Boston
     
  16. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    Pats68 - Do myself and Deuis and whatever city you are currently working for as an officer and resign because you clearly have a problem distinguishing between DEUS IRAE and DABRUINZ.

    To ignore with the ignorant.
     
  17. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    BTW, you violated the copyright laws with your posting here. Do yourself a favor and read the rules of the board before posting anymore. Or, turn yourself in for having violated the Copyright laws so that you can be prosecuted. I mean you ARE an officer of the law and should be upholding it, right? :rolleyes:
     
  18. BrickPat

    BrickPat Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Can I ask what you do for a living?

    If the kid whipped a snowball at my head then yes I would likely arrest him. Why? It's simple, we don't have the luxury of being the average Joe and walking away. If that cop had walked away one thrown snowball would turn into 100. I'm sorry to inform you that cops don't get paid to be targets for people's entertainment. You are the self professed criminal expert so you've surely heard of the broken windows theory. The snowball stuff is in the same category in that if you allow people to throw snowballs or anything else at the police it creates a slippery slope and sets a bad precedent that anything goes with the police.

    I realize that's not a popular response but there has to be a boundary somewhere.
     
  19. BB4PRez

    BB4PRez Practice Squad Player

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    Trying to stay away from the personal stuff.

    I do find it interesting that there was a video of this incident and the reporter I read descibed the scene on the video as "chaos".

    "A 17-second cellphone video caught the chaos of what happened at bar break April 21 in the middle of 14th Street near O Street. But whether jurors could make out former Husker and current New England Patriots player Alfonzo Dennard throwing a punch at a Lincoln police officer remained unclear to those watching from the gallery Tuesday."​

    Officer says former Husker punched him in the face : News-crime

    I agree with your comment in an earlier post that the officer's testimony seemed strong. But, if the video contradicts the officers testimony, a good lawyer should be able to use that to plant a few seeds of reasonable doubt in a closing.
     
  20. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    He'll likely be laughing at you since you are the one talking out your arse left and right. And, unlike you, I have quoted the testimony previously. You haven't. In fact, your claims have gone in direct opposition to what the testimony said.

    First, I told you not to comment unless you knew the story. You clearly didn't upon your first post and you've been struggling to catch up ever since.

    Second, I clearly DO have a clue (moreso than you) of what disorderly conduct is. You, sir, don't and I stand by that statement. You posting some legal mumbo jumbo from an uncited source doesn't make you correct.

    Third, You claimed that 2 police saw Dennard punch someone. That was false. I cited Officer Kopsa's testimony that "Dennard dropped his shoulder and pushed through another man" while crossing 14th St. I cited Officer McBride's court testimony that he only saw Kopsa wave and then Kopsa get hit by Dennard.

    Fourth, you ignore that Ben Samani, the man allegedly hit by Dennard in the crosswalk, was not able to identify Dennard as his assailant. Yet, I'm supposed to believe a guy who is 70 ft away can make out Dennard's actions in a crowd of people that are crossing the street both ways?

    So, I stand by my previous comments especially since it's clear you have your bias because you're a cop.
     
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