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Admit it, we are REBUILDING. But how far from the bottom are we?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Palm Beach Pats Fan, Jan 11, 2010.

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  1. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    When you jettison players like Seymour and Vrabel, when you have 7 new defensive starters (8 when you consider Adalius being inactive frequently), when you depend upon so many new guys learnng a system, when you are counting on non-star-level rookies (who generally take a few years to make an impact), when special teams was also drastically overhauled, I reach the obvious conclusion that this year was a rebuilding year from the beginning.

    Granted, the offense hasn't seen that level of overhaul (yet?)

    Where is the bottom, and do we need to tear things apart even more to eventually rise back up? Is that model even relevant?

    Stepping back a bit (hard to do!), it would be remarkable if the low point of a rebuilding job was a 10-7 season, frankly. Is it even necessary to expect we will dip lower before it gets better, or does the offense need an overhaul which sets the calander back another year before we are a factor?

    I know, the popular thing to say (before yesterday) is that we don't rebuild, you reload. But young guys need to learn by making mistakes, and that costs wins in the short term. 2-4 year vets need to learn to become leaders, and that doesn't happen automatically.

    With the amount of roster turnover we had this year, I think we have gotten younger, faster, more physically skilled at the expense of know-how. Yet with the emphasis on getting guys who have the attitude that "football is important to them" I think that the know-how will come.

    I think we are partly there and this is encouraging, actually.

    Are we on the right track?
  2. TheGodInAGreyHoodie

    TheGodInAGreyHoodie Rookie

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    Generally the term "rebuilding" is applied to teams that didn't make the playoffs. Why is everyone acting like this team is the '76 Bucs or '08 Lions?
  3. BPF

    BPF Rookie

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    It was a transition year not a rebuilding one.
  4. the wrothbroughterer

    the wrothbroughterer Rookie

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    I don't think that this was a rebuilding year, with a few breaks/correct calls they could have gone 13-3 and even with all their obvious deficiencies still managed to clinch the 3 seed.

    They didn't finish in the top 8 so they have the advantage of being able to sign whoever they want without penalty and should have 4 of the top 60 picks in one of the deepest drafts in recent memory. If they can come out of free agency with Wilfork and Mankins still in a Pats jersey, lose Adalius and Maroney, and get 2 starters(hopefully defensive) out of the draft, and pick up an impact player via free agency, they should be a bona fide 11-12 win team next year.
  5. Palm Beach Pats Fan

    Palm Beach Pats Fan Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    That's the beauty of it. I see it as a positive. I think BB saw the writing on the wall with regard to an aging defense and new special teams rules, and decided to rebuild while the talent level was still high and deep enough so that "bottoming out" didn't necessarily mean being 6-10 or worse.

    Replacing starters always happens. Replacing 3/4 of a veteran-based defense at once, and all of special teams (except kickers) in one year seems like exceptional turnover.

    If this was indeed the bottom, then we have a bright future.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  6. Scouse Patriot

    Scouse Patriot Rookie

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    Yup. It was clear as day from the start this team was in transition from one era to another. We all knew it was coming because the Patriots were, for the most part a veteran team and the team got old.

    We are far from the bottom of the NFL pile, we won the division this year and made the playoffs. Thats a good team that just needs that extra to be contenders again.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  7. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I guess I don't think that we are at the bottom when we are a division winner, have a fine team and have one of the best quarterbacks in the history of the league leading the team.

    This great era for the patriots has been the era of quarterbacks. Since Kraft came, we have had two eras, the Bledsoe years (1993-2000; one before Kraft) with three playoffs and one SB appearance, and the Brady era with seven playoffs and four SB appearance and three wins. Since Kraft took over the team, we have had two losing seasons, 1995 and 2000. we ahve had appeared in the playoffs 10 times. This has been a truly amazing run.

    I expect the Krafts to continue as owners for a long time. The question then is when the Brady era will end. As long as Brady is here, I have every confidence that we will be competitiors for a division win and more every year. I would EXPECT a rebuilding year the year after Brady leaves, but not until then.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  8. resdubwhite

    resdubwhite Rookie

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    No Jersey Selected

    you learn more from defeats than you ever do from victories.

    So, cliches aside (I'll do my best) if the patriots decide that they keep with the same oc/dc combination next year. Everyone and I mean everyone has to step up next year. Drafting and managing the current bunch.
    People are pissed and need a couple of days to blow off steam. As the off season progresses we will know whether this is a blip or a tail spin. (sorry another cliche).
  9. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

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    It's not "rebuilding" when you start planning for the veterans departure ahead of time. Rebuilding is crashing and then starting from the bottom. This is simply a transition phase. We know BB has always looked out for the long term as well as the short term. This should come as no surprise that we made the playoffs while transitioning. It's in the Patriots mission statement, and everyone employed works hard to accomplish this goal.
  10. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I think at this rate without any major additions next season and in the short future we are heading to the mediocre 8-8 or 7-9 team area - The bottom of the league would be a bit far fetched since there is still many quality guys on this team,I doubt we sink to double digit losses any time soon.

    Unless there is drastic changes in our offseason,I think the AFC East takes a different route next year in the Jets neighborhood.
  11. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

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    Yea let's just ASSUME that BB won't improve the team in the offseason, because he always just sits on his arse...

    8-8 is nowhere near our future, maybe in 2020 or the year Brady retires.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  12. mosi

    mosi Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Rebuilding will be next year. If we get 5 wins next year, I will be amazed. However, with only 5 wins, we will get 2 pics in the top 10 of the draft and that is how we will rebuild.
  13. SoCalPatsfan90

    SoCalPatsfan90 Rookie

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    You really think we'll go from 10-6 and AFCE champs to 5-11 in one season? Really?
  14. emoney_33

    emoney_33 Rookie

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    We had a tough schedule the year in which we lost all of our veterans and went 10-6. Next year we are going to do worse?

    And why will they be taking pic(ture)s of top 10 draft picks?
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  15. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

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    When a team that won 3 Super Bowls is replacing something around half its defense and a significant number of players on offense while not making it deep into the playoffs, it's rebuilding. People can throw about terms like "reloading" and "transitioning" if it makes them feel better, but it's the same thing. The team has had a talent and success drop, and it's now trying to make moves to counter that. That's what rebuilding is.
  16. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    Better check that schedule homer :rolleyes:

    Unless this team has a great draft and some real awesome pass rushers and the secondary can hold a freaking lead,how can you predict anything greater than middle of the pack?

    Teams and the league have caught up in the 'Patriot way' of winning consistently...it was due to happen.
  17. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    So you are to tell us that you expected a record worse than the Matt Cassel 2008 team in 2009 with Brady at the helm?...I call BS

    And yes,next years schedule is TOUGHER than this years..on paper at least
  18. PATRIOTSFANINPA

    PATRIOTSFANINPA Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Rebuilding is easier than Rebuilding AND staying competitive..thats where BB has a challenge.

    The AFC East should be nothing less than a dogfight in 2010 and I hope we are in that fight.

    The rebuilding stage to try and get back to prominence and being Elite again can take a few years at least ..can the Patriots weather the storm until then and have double digit wins throughout the process?

    The Draft and FA will tell that story
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  19. robertweathers

    robertweathers Rookie

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    I agree with your assesment. I think folks are getting lost in the semantics. Personally, I think of "rebuilding" as starting from the foundation on up, but thats me. I think the foundation of this team is strong (ownership, HC, marquee-QB) but clearly many moves need to be to reassume the position of Super-Bowl caliber.
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2010
  20. Remix 6

    Remix 6 Rookie

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    rebuilding? our offense was the same..the defense added some younger guys and we added talent at the corner position

    thats not rebuilding. we dont need to rebuild. we need to change our styles. we tried to live off 2007 style but just like the wildcat, teams adapt to it and learn to stop it. we need to evolve into a different type of style team
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