Official Brady vs. NFL Federal Court 8/12 Thread (LIVE UPDATES)

patsfan13 · Aug 13, 2015

Can't wait to see Kessler's new appeal this Friday.

YOUGOTMOSSED · Aug 13, 2015

QuantumMechanic said:
My debbie downer theory is that he's doing that to bluff the NFL into settling on terms closer to what he wishes the outcome should be. In other words, he wants to rule for Brady but doesn't think the law will let him get there and so is trying to force a settlement closer to how he wish he could rule.

I, of course, would be happy to be wrong.

"or is guilty of any other form of conduct reasonably judged by the League Commissioner to be detrimental to the League or professional football,"

If this article of the player's contract is the controlling standard as opposed to the "club rules" on equipment violations cited by Kessler, note that there is that pesky adverb "reasonably" modifying/qualifying the verb "judged." I interpret that to mean the judgment has to be objectively reasonable (not just whatever Goodell feels like doing). So it may mean the judge isn't just asking these questions just to embarrass the NFL and needle them into settlement. He may actually be assessing whether Goodell exercised reasonable judgment.

YOUGOTMOSSED · Aug 13, 2015

ANGR89 said:
But oh it gets better.....now another one is reporting deflategate strained their marriage.....Damn nfl . Lol

Pure speculation but I can't help but wonder if there was something on that destroyed cellphone that Brady was hiding from his wife. I can't believe he'd be stupid enough to send incriminating texts over his phone to an equipment manager. Cheating on wife? If I were a cynical person I would be inclined to believe that possibility and suspect this was why he was so guarded against turning the phone over.

VectorPrime · Aug 13, 2015

Or maybe its nothing and they aren't actually mad at eachother.

rochrist · Aug 13, 2015

FirstAndGoal said:
When the CBA says Goodell can be the judge, jury, and executioner, it may tie Brerman's hands.

Look, no one is saying it's fair and I'm not saying it's going to happen that way. I'm just saying that fairness may not be at the heart of Berman's ruling if and when it happens.

I'm just not going to be surprised either way and I'm sure he will make his reason for the decision clear.

I'm reading an awful lot of legal experts who say Berman could absolutely rule against the NFL if he feels they treated Brady unfairly.

rochrist · Aug 13, 2015

SVN said:
The twitterverse is blowing up with every minute of this. Dont know what the heck is going on.

I think its all based on one story from one of the tabloids. Not sure which one, but I caught a glimpse of the headline in the checkout at the market. Something Enquirer-like.

rochrist · Aug 13, 2015

Brady_to_Moss said:
During Wednesday's settlement hearing, Judge Richard Berman had some pointed criticism for the NFL and its lack of evidence against Tom Brady and the Deflategate saga.

The impression was that Berman was pressing the NFL more aggressively than the NFLPA, which leaves the question, how confident Brady's camp should be?

"I would tap the breaks on that," Tom E. Curran said. "The reason is the main thing Judge Berman wants is a settlement. The best way to highlight which entrenched side needs to move a little bit is to point out the holes in their case and that’s what Judge Berman did. Don’t misinterpret his questions as being determining factors in which way he’d rule. He said he has no idea yet what he will do legally with this case if it gets to him. But he doesn’t want it to get to him."

Per Curran

The sports guys have almost universally been wrong at every turn in this story.

rochrist · Aug 13, 2015

PatsWSB47 said:
Here's the thing. If Berman wants to rule for the NFL* because he has to because of the CBA, then why is he wasting everyone's time with facts? Do we really want to believe he's just throwing out this stuff that will have no actual bearing on how he decides just to pressure a settlement?

That's Tanguay's theory and he's sticking to it!

h0c2000 · Aug 13, 2015

QuantumMechanic said:
So IANAL but that would seem to give some level of validity (in the context of the CBA) to Goodell-as-Commissioner's punishment. Whether or not Goodell-as-arbitrator was fair and unbiased is a whole different thing.

I think some of today's questions were used to establish what Brady's "conduct" was and whether that conduct was "reasonably judged". I wouldn't throw out the possibility of the invalidity of the punishment.

FrodoBagginz · Aug 13, 2015

YOUGOTMOSSED said:
Pure speculation but I can't help but wonder if there was something on that destroyed cellphone that Brady was hiding from his wife. I can't believe he'd be stupid enough to send incriminating texts over his phone to an equipment manager. Cheating on wife? If I were a cynical person I would be inclined to believe that possibility and suspect this was why he was so guarded against turning the phone over.

People are forgetting there is a feature in cell phones called "Delete". People tend to use this feature to remove content such as Texts, photos, etc. without the need to send the phone into oblivion. Why would Brady destroy an entire phone when he can simply press delete? It is why if Brady turned his phone over to Wells, Wells would simply say he deleted any relevant information before giving it to him.

ctpatsfan77 · Aug 13, 2015

YOUGOTMOSSED said:
"or is guilty of any other form of conduct reasonably judged by the League Commissioner to be detrimental to the League or professional football,"

If this article of the player's contract is the controlling standard as opposed to the "club rules" on equipment violations cited by Kessler, note that there is that pesky adverb "reasonably" modifying/qualifying the verb "judged." I interpret that to mean the judgment has to be objectively reasonable (not just whatever Goodell feels like doing). So it may mean the judge isn't just asking these questions just to embarrass the NFL and needle them into settlement. He may actually be assessing whether Goodell exercised reasonable judgment.

Yes, the presence of that word "reasonably" should matter. It absolutely should not be possible for Goodell just to suspend players arbitrarily on a hunch, which appears to be what he did here.

Deus Irae · Aug 13, 2015

FrodoBagginz said:
People are forgetting there is a feature in cell phones called "Delete". People tend to use this feature to remove content such as Texts, photos, etc. without the need to send the phone into oblivion. Why would Brady destroy an entire phone when he can simply press delete? It is why if Brady turned his phone over to Wells, Wells would simply say he deleted any relevant information before giving it to him.

So called "deleted" texts can often still be recovered.

Nikolai · Aug 13, 2015

FrodoBagginz said:
People are forgetting there is a feature in cell phones called "Delete". People tend to use this feature to remove content such as Texts, photos, etc. without the need to send the phone into oblivion. Why would Brady destroy an entire phone when he can simply press delete? It is why if Brady turned his phone over to Wells, Wells would simply say he deleted any relevant information before giving it to him.

It's easy enough to pull deleted texts from a phone. I don't know what the Android equivalent is, but for iPhones, the program PhoneView can retrieve deleted texts as well as photos received in texts, even if they have been "deleted" off the phone. I used that program to search through deleted texts for something I wound up needing.

nowayback · Aug 13, 2015

Some headlines today, eg.MSN Brady just ruined what was left of his Golden Boy image , bspn didn't have anything till far down, something neutral,
During this whole framegate, I have been wondering is this communist Russia? How the press is controlled, so one sided. What other org or vip has had such favorable press ? Not Presidents, not big oil ... is this America ?

Betterthanmost · Aug 13, 2015

FrodoBagginz said:
People are forgetting there is a feature in cell phones called "Delete". People tend to use this feature to remove content such as Texts, photos, ...

Are you serious or joking? You really think you can erase data from your electronic devices by a simple software on that same device? Lol.
You have quipped my interest about what people really know about electronic data memory. You have no idea what we can retrieve from the memory of a printer let alone a working cell phone with memory flash.

DarrylS · Aug 13, 2015

FrodoBagginz said:
People are forgetting there is a feature in cell phones called "Delete". People tend to use this feature to remove content such as Texts, photos, etc. without the need to send the phone into oblivion. Why would Brady destroy an entire phone when he can simply press delete? It is why if Brady turned his phone over to Wells, Wells would simply say he deleted any relevant information before giving it to him.

Even if he deleted the texts there would still be the specter that he hid something from the NFL.. he was advised not to turn it over by his legal team, and Wells told him it was not needed.. the cell phone destroyed was a cheap political stunt by the NFL...

The last thing he would want was information to be sold to the highest bidder by some NFL underling.. TMZ, Deadspin would all pay big bucks for some suggestive messages or pix to Gisele..

I always ask the same question if they had Jastermski's and McNally's phone why do they need Brady's, prurient interest???

adam941 · Aug 13, 2015

Nikolai said:
It's easy enough to pull deleted texts from a phone. I don't know what the Android equivalent is, but for iPhones, the program PhoneView can retrieve deleted texts as well as photos received in texts, even if they have been "deleted" off the phone. I used that program to search through deleted texts for something I wound up needing.

Bear with me for one more media rant. Every time I see mention of the "destroyed" phone, they usually include the 10,000 text messages that are gone as well. Please correct me, but my understanding is the 10,000 came from Brady's phone records that indicated he sent/received a total of 10,000 messages in the time frame they were looking at. That does not mean there were 10,000 messages on the phone when it met its demise, but it's repeated often. I think once they get a number in their heads, it's hard to shake, like the 2 out of 68 arbitration cases or 11 out of 12 (or videotaping practices). I really dislike people that show no interest in doing their entire job.

turkeyneck · Aug 13, 2015

DarrylS said:
I always ask the same question if they had Jastermski's and McNally's phone why do they need Brady's, prurient interest???

They were after the Holy Grail, a Belichick text.

adam941 · Aug 13, 2015

turkeyneck said:
They were after the Holy Grail, a Belichick text.

Does anyone else find it interesting that the league declined to track down the receiver of every possible relevant text sent by Brady? He gave them everything they needed. They must have been convinced at that point that there is no smoking gun possible for either Brady or Belichick.

DarrylS · Aug 13, 2015

turkeyneck said:
They were after the Holy Grail, a Belichick text.

Have said for a while now BB was their intended target, #12 is collateral damage.. but when they found out BB liked to use crappy footballs for practice, that plan hit the shytter real quick.

It started when Kensil was foaming at the mouth on the Pats sidelines during the Indy game, "We f... ing got you now"!!!!!

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